Tau Empire Codex 2013 | Army Builder Program
Dark Angels Codex 2013
Chaos Daemons Codex 2013
Chaos Space Marines Codex 2012

Warhammer 40k Forum Tau Online

 

Warhammer 40K Forum

A look at Elite Carnifexes
Reply
Old 08 Jan 2009, 16:29   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: toronto
Posts: 999
Default A look at Elite Carnifexes

The Elite Carnifex


INTRODUCTION

Not too long ago, I and a small group of gamers decided to test NidZilla lists for 5th edition. We had one experienced ‘Zilla player and the rest of us wanted to examine the nuances and strategies that we were sure to encounter from time to time. I, as usual took the notes and eventually wrote a report for these boards which can be found here …

http://forums.tauonline.org/index.php?topic=70466

As is my inclination, I needed some structure for our testing. Part of the process was to design and test as many configurations as we thought might be viable for elite Carnifexes. Really the term elite is a bit of a misnomer because we played them in the heavy spots in smaller lists using the elite spots for other squads. Of course, I took notes. Here, I present a summary of our findings. Again, I must make a disclaimer. I am not an experienced Nid player. I am an experienced player who dipped into Nids to improve his overall game. Their might be the odd inconsistency with my notes.

Elite Carnifexes have been a staple of Tyranid armies for awhile. Fifth edition with its new ‘running’ rules and its rules for template weapons have given us a few more options for the slot. Combat Fexes now have their uses. Shooty Fexes are the only viable choices anymore. Most people use Fexes as mobile terrain but they can also be used on opposite flanks so that they can actually cut off vehicles and squads and get into combat with them. Your Carnifexes will be targeted. They are also a useful fire magnet drawing firepower away from the rest of your force. You can use an elite fex to sit on objectives so your opponent needs to take on my fex to grab that objective. You need to send a nice sized squad to take on a close combat Fex suiting in cover on an objective. They follow all the Monstrous Creature rules and to be an elite choice can cost no more then 114 points. I like elite Fexes in a number of lists. In smaller lists elite Fexes allow you the room to spend points on troops and HQs. Even smaller lists benefit greatly from two Fexes. In Nidzilla lists they give you the extra MCs in your elite spots on the FoC so that you can fierld six Fexes in one list should you choose to.

*In smaller games your elite Carnifexes are going to count as heavy support. You must field a force of at least 1500 points to use them in the elite slot. However, we are looking at Fexes that cost below 115 points. We can use them in smaller games as as we expand our list we can shift them into the elite slot. The good thing about this Fexes is their cost. They are not overloaded with extra biomorphs. Even in a small game you can fit two Fexes and a Zoanthrope and a hive tyrant w/guard. They're good, big, fillers in small games. This leaves the elite spots open for other choices as well.

We tested armies where the only guns in my army were Spinegaunts with WON. It is an all CC Nidzilla list that helped us appreciate the effectiveness of these monsters. Fielding 5-6 running CC Fexes, 2 Walking Tyrants with Guards, some Spinegaunts and flank-marching Stealers is too much for a lot of lists to deal with as they do not have enough firepower to kill all the MC's before they are upon them. These setups can be adopted to hybrid lists where CC Fexes can play a major role. The risk of instant death and being able to take 4 T6 Wounds at a 3+ Sv makes the Carnifex a great choice for either sitting on an objective or moving forward to attack.


Elite Carnifex – Close Combat

Ninja Fex; 114
2 Scything Talons, Adrenal Glands WS, Toxic Miasma, Flesh Hooks
The cheapest variety cc fex that hits Meqs on a 3+ thanks to +1WS and Toxic Miasma. Three of these fexes in a small point game shielding your gaunts and backed up by a Tyrant is a world of hurt in 5ed.These are MCs that can take on tanks or troops. It is tempting to use them all together as a wall but if you split them up and run them down the flanks they shorten the board considerably being able to move 6” and run 6”. Two sets of Scything Talons means the Carnifex will have consistent 4 attacks (or 5 on the charge. You hit most regular troops on 3+, with 5 attacks on the charge. You also stop WS5 from hitting you on 3+, which is important for survival.

Little Ninja Fex; 112
2 Scything Talons, Adrenal Glands WS, Adrenal Glands I, Flesh Hooks
He is a little cheaper then his big brother. He gets to strike before PFs.

Screamer Fex; 114
2 Scything Talons, Adrenal Glands WS, Bioplasma, Flesh Hooks
Similar to the Carnifex above this build lets you get an extra attack at double initiative to hopefully take out another MC with lower iniatiative before it takes out your Carnifex. I really do not see the extra attack at a lesser strength hitting on a 4+ an improvement over the standard Ninja Fex. Bioplasma does hit skimmers on a 4+ which is very useful, and most opponents seem to not know that rule..

Tusked Fex; 111
2 Rending Claws, Adrenal Glands WS, Spine Banks, Tusked, Flesh Hooks
Yet another cc monster with plenty of attacks and some spine banks for the turn he is ready to charge. Run him up the table until he is close enough to attack. Two or three of them work the same as a Ninja Fex. Nothing wrong with a couple of S6 shots before the charge. It is your cheapest cc Fex.

Baby Fex; 96
2 Rending Claws, Adrenal Glands WS, Flesh Hooks
It is not as effective as the other builds of combat Fexes BUT – 96 points! It can still do damage, can still sit on an objective, and it is still a walking piece of terrain. If you are looking to shave points of your list in very small games this build might be what you want. A Rend Fex and a Boom Fex will only cost you 200 points. Lists of 1000 points or less might make use of this fellow.

Now a quick note from the FAQ

Q. How does a monstrous creature’s 2D6 roll for armour penetration in close combat work if the creature has Rending Claws as well?
A. When rolling for armour penetration, the creature gets to add a D3 to the total for each dice that comes up with a 6. So, if either of the two dice is a six, the total penetration roll will be 2D6+D3+S; if both were 6s, the total would be 12+2D3+S (which is more than enough to penetrate the thickest armour!).


Spine Fex; 107
2 Scything Talons, Spine Banks, Flesh Hooks
This is your ‘ cheap as chips ’ cc Fex. In a 1000 point list you can fit in two of these, a Hive Tyrant w/ Guard, a squad of feeder genestealers and two squads of gaunts. Just run everything up the table hiding the Tyrant and Guard behind the Fexes and letting the guants ‘go to ground’ on objectives.

Tail Fex; 114
2 Scything Talons, Toxic Miasma, Macetail
Use as you would a Ninja Fex. You are using this beast to attack squads so that your get some use out of that Macetail. Let’s be honest though – isn’t that what elite cc Carnifexes should be charging? Toxic Miasma is needed with this guy.

Crab Fex; 114
Crushing Claws, Rending Claws, Flesh Hooks
This has the possibility of the most attacks on the charge. With a good die roll he will be taking down a lot of infantry. I like the look of this guy but I’m gambling that I will sometimes get seven attacks on the charge. I’m guaranteed five attacks with the Ninja Fex. Crushing Claws give you the chance of totally smashing something or totally whiffing a thierd of the time. If you feel like gambling, or if you want to mess with your opponent's head by making him second guess your Fex's threat level, try the Claws.


Elite Carnifexes – Flexible


Boom Fex; 114
Barbed Strangler, Scything Talons, Flesh Hooks
A nice pinning weapon that blasts away until it can get into cc with those nice Scything Talons, makes it a very good infantry killer. My problem with this configuration is that it needs to run in order to get use out of those Scything Talons and if it is running it is not using its Barbed Strangler. There will be games when your opponent comes to you but in testing this configuration I found that only a a squads armed with PFs, large mobs of Orks, Wraithlords and other MCs ever got close enough to attack and you really do not want to tackle any of them with a lone Boom Fex. A configuration that we tested that proved effective was using two Boom Fexes and a Dakka Fex. You really do not want to miss with a lone Boom Fex all game, lol. In larger list we tried out two Boom Fexes, two Dakka Fex and two Super Boom Fexes (Barbed Strangler, Scything Talons (+1A), +1WS, +1I, +1St, Scyth Tail (+d3 Attacks), Tusked (+2A's on Charge)). They fill all your heavy and elite squads at a reasonable cost and really scare your opponent when they start walking down table. Orks have made this particular Fex a lot more useful. We tested it against my Ork lists and found it performed best. Carnifexes with Barbed Stranglers have a pie plate that’s going to hit at least four Nobs if its a good hit, wound on a 2+. Sure he gets a 4+ cover save but watch for instant death, crying Orks, and pinning. Spamming four pie plates a turn can be quite effective.


Elite Carnifex – Shooty


Dakka Fex; 114
2 Twin linked Devourer, Enhanced Senses, Flesh Hooks
A nice amount of high strength attacks which are both accurate and likely to wound that can mow down most infantry units at a nice cost. These cann be marched up the table in groups of twop or three to shield your walking Tyrant and Guard and your guants. This fellow has eight shots that reroll. Need we say more. You will kill an average of 2 – 3 Meqs a round and double it for Geqs. So there is reason for their popularity. A dakka fex with 2 TL Devourers pumps out 8 Str 6 shots re-rolling to wound and hit (full armour saves still) and on a charge still gets 3 attacks.Plus his 18" shooting range means that you'll be doing damage from a much earlier turn then a combat Fex.

Little Dakka Fex; 104

Rending Claws, Twin linked Devourer, Spine Banks, Flesh Hooks
If you really need to save some points you can use Spine Banks instead of Enhanced Senses. Enhanced Senses gives you an average of 6 hits per turn. Spine Banks gives 4.67 Devourer hits and 1.11 Spinefist hits per turn. It works but not as well. Of course you can fire those Spine Banks and charge if need be. You are still an MC.


Weapons and Biomporphs

In general we found barbed strangler, devourers, and scything talons the best weapons and Enhanced Senses, Adrenal Glands WS, Toxic Miasma and Flesh Hooks the best biomorphs. Expensive Fexes are a gamble. You get better value with your Hive Tyrant. A Tyrant has better WS, I, A, synapse and BS. The super Boom Fex (mentioned above) or your traditional Sniper Fex withVenom Cannon/Barbed Strangler are the only ones I would consider at higher points costs. Ranged firepower did not improve in 5th, and your CC Carnifex can now actually make it into combat. Elite Carnifexes cannot get 2+ saves. The +1 wound biomorph or an improved save are upgrades I might take if I was shifting elite Carnifexes into the heavy support slots. Missile Launchers and other weapons that are AP3 are pretty common now in lists and a 2+ save will shrug them off. That said the new cover rules do improve the survivability of our Fexes. As a general rule of thumb, two elite Carnifexes are better than one Uberfex. So field cheap CC Carnifexes from 96-126pts.


Weapons and Biomorphs on the Close Combat Carnifex

In 5ed we can finally make use of our cc Fexes. We no longer need four turns to get them into combat with the run rules and it makes it easier to cut off the table quarters and attack. Scything talons are pretty much the standard. You could get Crushing Claws but then you would not be able to fit in ANY biomorphs. Now my favorite biomorphs are Adrenal Glands WS, Toxic Miasma and Flesh Hooks for these boys. That does not mean that the other cc combinations are bad though. Tusked is nice but without Toxic Miasma not as effective. A Macetail is situational. One upgrade that appears in almost every build is flesh hooks and you just cannot beat them at the cost for their use.


Weapons and Biomorphs on the Shooty Carnifex

Although 5ed makes cc Fexes a nice choice the new rules also give us another option for a Carnifex that hits in cc and also shoots like the Boom Fex. We really want Enhanced Senses to improve our chances of hitting something. There is a significant difference between BS2 and BS3. Unfortunately a Barbed Strangler precludes Enhanced Senses if we want to keep our Carnifex an Elite choice. You do get the pinning option though and the two sets of Scything Talons. Do not forget the auto hit nature of template weapons in 5th ed. make the Barbed Strangler a solid choice. Still the TL Devourer setup is the popular choice.

Recommendations

The best configurations for elite Carnifexes are the Ninja Fex, the Boom Fex, the Screamer Fex and the Dakka Fex. Of these four the Boom Fex is somewhat suspect for the reasons listed above. I preferred the Ninja Fex over the Screamer Fex but a good case could be made for both. Now there are options if you want to save points and there are options depending on what you expect to face – I do not like to tailor lists though. These four Fexes will prove useful in almost any list. Their tactics vary though and some will offer better synergy then others depending on the rest of your army.

My personal preference is a combination of Boom Fexes and Dakka Fexes. Now here is a little Math to help you out … this is just a quick assessment that averages out the different builds… there are other variables and results will differ.

T4/Save 4+
Shooty Fex - 2.6 kills a turn /4 on the charge
Combat Fex - 2.3 kills a turn

T4/Save 3+
Shooty Fex - 1.8 kills a turn /3.1 on the charge
Combat Fex - 2.2 kills a turn

T3/Save 5+
Shooty Fex = 3. 6 kills a turn /5 on the charge
Combat Fex = 2.3 kills a turn

Now on paper it makes the shooty Fexes appear to be better in most cases to the Combat Fex but a lot of armies sport 3+ saves! The Combat Fex rightly has its followers.

I hope this is of some use - I felt that since we took the notes I might as well sort through them and present our findings, I'm sure that there are some errors in the notes and there are probably a few bad assumptions as well, lol. Please be free with comments and criticisms. I have a hide like a Carnifex.

thanks for your patience reading through this

Good article. +1 ~Gada
bebe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08 Jan 2009, 18:09   #2 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 7,926
Default Re: A look at Elite Carnifexes

I'm midway through it, but nCr would be good for the whole combination thing. :P I don't recall what it exactly means (I need to go dig up my prob and stats notes) but I definitely recall nCr for combination related things. nPr being permutations. Not that that's relevant. Anyway.
__________________
*Doh!-Nuts DarkWand3r3r Msg Player 04-08-2009 17:51:32
Moral of this story... in real life or in a pen and paper game... do not piss off Delpheus or he will OMGWTFBBQPWN your face with a uber hit.
DELPHEUS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08 Jan 2009, 18:22   #3 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,045
Default Re: A look at Elite Carnifexes

Very nice analysis - however there is a point near the start where you reference "Rending Talons", mixing up Rending Claws & Scything Talons - I think you meant Scything Talons in those situations, but I just wanted to check.
Nezalhualixtlan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08 Jan 2009, 18:53   #4 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: toronto
Posts: 999
Default Re: A look at Elite Carnifexes

Quote:
Very nice analysis - however there is a point near the start where you reference "Rending Talons", mixing up Rending Claws & Scything Talons - I think you meant Scything Talons in those situations, but I just wanted to check.
Actually I meant Rending Claws, lol. It is what keeps the cost below 115 points. You lose an attack but it still can be a somewhat effective option. I listed a few builds with Rending Claws and hence the reference to the FAQ. I told there would be a few mistakes ... see what a mess non-Nid players can make!

Thank you for the kind words though.
bebe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08 Jan 2009, 20:20   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,045
Default Re: A look at Elite Carnifexes

Quote:
Originally Posted by CanaBebe
Quote:
Very nice analysis - however there is a point near the start where you reference "Rending Talons", mixing up Rending Claws & Scything Talons - I think you meant Scything Talons in those situations, but I just wanted to check.
Actually I meant Rending Claws, lol. It is what keeps the cost below 115 points. You lose an attack but it still can be a somewhat effective option. I listed a few builds with Rending Claws and hence the reference to the FAQ. I told there would be a few mistakes ... see what a mess non-Nid players can make!

Thank you for the kind words though.
Ah, I see. I didn't have my Codex in front of me and wasn't thinking through the points.

For my points, I'm never going to run a Carnifex with Rending. It gives it nothing extra against infantry since you already ignore Armor Saves to begin with, and with it's high STR and +2d6 Armor Pen on most vehicles (d6 against Monoliths, but then Rending wouldn't count against Monoliths either) it's not adding a whole ton of value - in fact if you roll a 6 on either d6, you're pretty much guaranteed to have already penetrated the heaviest armor in the game. Granted, it's a cheap second weapon bio-morph if all you are looking to do is fill the slot requirement. But I'd honestly rather save the difference in points somewhere else on the Fex and upgrade the Rending to Scything Talons.

I'm also not a personal fan of mixed units (ranged & CC bio-morphs). There can certainly be arguments made for them, as others here have done, but it's not something I personally like to do. That really leaves me with three options in terms of <115pt fexes that I like to sometimes run:

CC Variant 1 "Screamer-Killer" - 2x Scything, Adrenal WS, Flesh Hooks, Bio-plasma
CC Variant 2 "Ninjafex" - 2x Scything, Adrenal WS, Flesh Hooks, Toxic Miasma
Ranged Variant 1 "Devilfex" - 2x Devourer, Enhanced Senses, Flesh Hooks

Of them, I usually just run a Screamer-Killer or/& Devilfex. It's not that I don't like Toxic Miasma on the Fex - I think it's definitely a good buy against infantry. My problem with it in this scenario is that it leaves my CC Fex at I1, which is dangerous against Power Fists, of which I kind of tend to run up against a lot - so a lot of times I'm aiming them (elite CC fexes) at vehicles rather than infantry (unless the shifting conditions on the table make it better to do otherwise, I'm flexible), and I'd rather have the extra Bio-plasma attack in that case. Partially though, it's just the lists I run in general - I tend to have enough stuff that can deal with Infantry between Warriors, Genestealers, and massed Gaunts/Hormagaunts or a Tyrant, my anti-vehicle stuff tends to be more limited. What I tend to do though, is bulk up a CC Fex just a little over the Elite level of points, and before it gets too expensive, it's a good Infantry or Vehicle killer, no matter what it ends up against - but then I've never really run the Nidzilla list where this is a larger concern.

I did want to point out something else I caught: Your "Little Dakka Fex; 111" is an invalid configuration. You only have 1 Weapon Symbiote on it, and you are required to have 2. You could add Rending Claws to it, but then that makes it equal in cost to the regular Devilfex you listed just before, which I think is an all around superior configuration is you are going to be spending the same points anyway.
Nezalhualixtlan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08 Jan 2009, 20:38   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: toronto
Posts: 999
Default Re: A look at Elite Carnifexes

Quote:
CC Variant 1 - 2x Scything, Adrenal WS, Flesh Hooks, Bio-plasma
CC Variant 2 - 2x Scything, Adrenal WS, Flesh Hooks, Toxic Miasma
Ranged Variant 1 - 2x Devourer, Enhanced Senses, Flesh Hooks
All among the top four I listed. You are just missing the Boom Fex. You probably have a better feel for Nids then me however the Boom Fex was incredibly effective against my Orks in testing. Now perhaps if we played more games your Devilfex might have won out. The problem with testing is its difficult to get enough games in, lol. When I posted our observations on Nidzilla the Devil/Dakka Fex was the one of the ones we eventually chose for the elite spot. We had a hard time not including a Boom Fex in the list also though.

Quote:
I did want to point out something else I caught: Your "Little Dakka Fex; 111" is an invalid configuration. You only have 1 Weapon Symbiote on it, and you are required to have 2. You could add Rending Claws to it, but then that makes it equal in cost to the regular Devilfex you listed just before, which I think is an all around superior configuration is you are going to be spending the same points anyway.
Post
You are correct sir. I adjusted the listing after peering at my notes again. It is cheaper mainly because it has no Enhanced Senses but Spine Banks instead and only one set of TL Devourers. No question the Dakka Fex is superior.

Quote:
But I'd honestly rather save the difference in points somewhere else on the Fex and upgrade the Rending to Scything Talons.
The only reason to take rending is to cut costs in a tight list. We agree here.

Your comments as always are appreciated. I absolutely agree that some of these configurations do not 'cut the mustard'. I felt that I should at least describe thew various versions we tested though.
bebe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09 Jan 2009, 01:40   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,045
Default Re: A look at Elite Carnifexes

Quote:
Originally Posted by CanaBebe
All among the top four I listed. You are just missing the Boom Fex. You probably have a better feel for Nids then me however the Boom Fex was incredibly effective against my Orks in testing. Now perhaps if we played more games your Devilfex might have won out. The problem with testing is its difficult to get enough games in, lol. When I posted our observations on Nidzilla the Devil/Dakka Fex was the one of the ones we eventually chose for the elite spot. We had a hard time not including a Boom Fex in the list also though.
Yeah, I can certainly understand the Boomfex could have its uses, I've just never been a big fan of mixing my units up in purpose, particularly now that we have the option to Run with everything. It's like you said earlier, if you shoot, you aren't running and vice versa, so it just always ends up feeling off to me, like I'm wasting part of my units usefulness each turn. But, it also presents a tactically complex unit, one your opponent might misjudge since it can be effective in both range and CC - just not streamlined for either role.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CanaBebe
You are correct sir. I adjusted the listing after peering at my notes again. It is cheaper mainly because it has no Enhanced Senses but Spine Banks instead and only one set of TL Devourers. No question the Dakka Fex is superior.
Ah, ok, I see the change now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CanaBebe
The only reason to take rending is to cut costs in a tight list. We agree here.

Your comments as always are appreciated. I absolutely agree that some of these configurations do not 'cut the mustard'. I felt that I should at least describe thew various versions we tested though.
It's definitely a good idea to try things out and run through the ideas in theory as well, so I certainly understand, and I think you did an admirable job in your analysis of the different Fexes you tried out.
Nezalhualixtlan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09 Jan 2009, 02:12   #8 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: toronto
Posts: 999
Default Re: A look at Elite Carnifexes

Quote:
Yeah, I can certainly understand the Boomfex could have its uses
I'm quite prejudiced in my assessment here. We are testing out a hybrid list at 1000 points that features FIVE Barbed Stranglers ...

STRANGLER SPAM
nid pie - ummm tasty

HQ

Bomber Rant; 219
Barbed Strangler, TL Devourer, Enhanced Senses, Toxin Sacs
w/ 2 Tyrant Guard

4 Warriors; 126
3 Deathspitters, Barbed Stangler, Scything Talons, Toxin Sacs

Troops

15 Termaguants w/ fleshborers - 90

15 Termaguants w/ fleshborers - 90

8 Genestealers w/ Feeder Tendrils - 136

Heavy

Boom Fex; 113
Barbed Strangler, Scything Talons

Boom Fex; 113
Barbed Strangler, Scything Talons

Boom Fex; 113
Barbed Strangler, Scything Talons

As you can see we switched our elite fexes to the heavy slots (as mentioned in the article) and went nuts with the stranglers putting them everywhere. The list is designed to dispense with a lot of upgrades by using units to cover each other and presenting too many priority targets for the opponent to deal with at this point level. We have used the list twice now ... once versus Orks and once versus Necrons. Both lists have been problematic in the past but this list handled them without too much difficulty. I think because I am not a regular Tyranid player, I was able to be very flexible with my tactics when the list was fielded. I did miss the combat oriented warriors we used in our Zilla list a bit and synapse can be a bit of problem here with the guants but if you sit them on objectives, let them 'go to ground' and protect with Fexes it plays out well.

bebe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09 Jan 2009, 02:29   #9 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,860
Default Re: A look at Elite Carnifexes

I like this, and agree with most of it. I'm glad you aren't just another article writer that says "CC fexes suck, don't use them :P "

I really like the Ninja/Screamer-killer (similair enough to be nearly the same thing) and the dakkafex is a very useful build. While I can agree with Nex about the boomfex, I certainly wouldn't count it out. IT has some serious advantages over other units, besides it's ability to sneak in Barbed Stranglers for cheap (definitely a good thing against almost any army), the "mixed" build is unbelievably useful in lower point games. At higher points, it's easy to diversify and make your fexes dedicated for one task, but in lower point limits having a fex that can shoot up the enemy and still perform mediocrely well in combat is a great thing to have.

Very well written, I've had tons of Carnifex thoughts floating around in my head so it's nice to see this on the boards. Do you plan on doing one for HS fexes? I'd be more than willing to type up an article on that as well.
__________________
sionnach19 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09 Jan 2009, 03:11   #10 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: toronto
Posts: 999
Default Re: A look at Elite Carnifexes

Quote:
Very well written, I've had tons of Carnifex thoughts floating around in my head so it's nice to see this on the boards. Do you plan on doing one for HS fexes? I'd be more than willing to type up an article on that as well.
We did not test as many configurations for the Heavy Fex as we did for the Elite. We only really tested the

Super Boom Fex - 154
Barbed Strangler, Scything Talons, +1WS, +1I, +1St, Scyth Tail (+d3 Attacks), Tusked (+2A's on Charge)

and the

Gun Fex - 148
Enhanced Senses, Venom Cannons, Barbed Strangler

We felt that these two builds offered the best value for cost. Of course, you could improve the save, add a wound, etc. with the extra biomorphs but a lascannon, power fist, power klaw or railgun can really spoil your day on an expensive Fex.
Also as you can see from the list I posted many of the elite fexes can be shifted to the heavy slots as well. I think I will leave the discussion of heavy fexes to someone who plays Nids more frequently than me.

We did more testing with gaunts, warriors and stealers then with heavy fexes. We found fleshborers math hammered out the best although hormagaunts had tactical applications that were nice due to their speed. WON was discarded as an option early although small squads of spinegaunts in a Zilla list could use them. I won't go into a full analysis.

For stealers we found the best biomorph was feeder tendrils by far. Scuttlers were second and extended carapace was a waste with all the cover saves in 5th edition.

Warriors were the most difficult to assess. Both leaping, cc oriented and shooty warriors worked quite well. In Zilla lists we went with the CC warriors as we had enough Dakka from our Fexes but I'm now shifting back to the Strangler/ Spitter warrior as my personal preference.

If you check my notes on Zilla in 5th edition you will see what our analysis was. The link is in the article above.

Thanks for the kind words.
bebe is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Carnifexes and Barbed Stranglers Martel Tyranids 21 17 Oct 2008 18:57
Lash Whips - on Warriors and/or Carnifexes? Gorbass Tyranids 5 16 Oct 2008 19:21
great thing against tyranid carnifexes Shaso Rael The Inquisition 7 02 Dec 2006 04:45
How do Carnifexes kill things in CC? alcibiates Tyranids 17 26 Jun 2006 06:03
Mech Tau and Carnifexes trainik Tau 15 17 May 2005 19:46