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Deep striking
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Old 20 Jun 2010, 21:29   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 127
Default Deep striking

As the Crisis suits can deep strike, occasionally I've wanted to try it out. It never works:

1) My reserve rolls fail and the Crisis suit/unit arrives long after it would have been needed: a Positional Relay would help to fix this, but I don't like to load already overpriced HQ suit with more wargear unless it's absolutely necessary.

2) The unit suffers a mishap.

3) Crisis unit arrives, shoots at something, and is then rapid fired or assaulted to death.

Am I doing something wrong, or is the Deep striking just a boneheaded tactic for the Crisis suits? Any tips?
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Old 20 Jun 2010, 21:40   #2 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
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Default Re: Deep striking

You know what, I am still sort of new to the game so the rules of Deepstriking kind of confuse me so I still haven't done it. It is interesting to wonder what would happen if you deepstruck 3 units of elites and 2 units of gun drones...But that depends on how useful deepstrike is.
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Old 20 Jun 2010, 21:48   #3 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Austria
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Default Re: Deep striking

1) A positional relay can also be played on a Crisis Shas'Vre of a Crisis unit that already starts at the table.

2) Pathfinder Devilfish help you to improve the accuracy of your Crisis drops.

3) Just because you CAN deepstrike your Crisis in the middle of the opponent's army doesn't mean that you SHOULD. Conversely - just because you CAN deepstrike right next to the enemy, doesn't mean you HAVE to deepstrike right next to him. Of course, where you deepstrike depends on the Crisis configuration, but generally speaking, deepstriking a unit of Crisis somewhat safely away from the opponent in a previously empty spot of the table might force your opponent to spread his forces out. For this, you want to equip your Crisis with long-range weapons (i.e. Deathrains) - also, this way, you can get shots at side- and backarmour of enemy vehicles. The possibilities are endless - in an average game with my Orks, for example, objectives in my deployment zone are usually "guarded" by a unit of Grots - the rest of the army is closing in on the enemy. A Crisis drop can actually disrupt this quite effectively.

Cheers,
-Bone
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Old 20 Jun 2010, 21:55   #4 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: USA
Posts: 647
Default Re: Deep striking

Deep Strike is useful for putting units in an otherwise unreachable spot to be really annoying. A good tactic is the "Suicide Squad" where a unit armed with TL Fusion Blasters or Flamers drop in close to their intended target and blast the crap out of it. The reason they are called Suicide Squads is they tend to not survive long after deployment. Keeping them cheap or mounting shields counters most of the problems with the survivability of the unit.

Bonesaw also said some good points.
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Old 20 Jun 2010, 22:00   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
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Default Re: Deep striking

There's also the awesome Nin'ja Tau! Suck it to your enemies by just not showing up to fight (its works very well).

Deepstriking with Tau should be done just like any other army. You deepstrike in support of another group of units, never all by yourself (unless you're playing Nin'ja Tau!).
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Old 20 Jun 2010, 22:16   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: UK
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Default Re: Deep striking

Deepstriking is just one of those things - back in 4th ed I was playing a game against the Nids, I had set up 3 squads of Crisis suits all with Plasma and Fusion to take out the MC's and was planning to deepstrike them into range and blaze away.

The beginning of the game went perfectly, with my lines blazing away and wiping the nid hordes out to a man - by the end of my turn 2 all that was left was my opponents MC's (some of which were already wounded). Turn 3 - My suits started to arrive.

The first scattered with pinpoint accuracy onto single carnifex (The only one in range) and was destroyed.

The second Squad scattered with pinpoint accuracy 11 inches onto another Carnifex.

The third squad scattered 10 inches into impassable terrain, again being destroyed.

A third or my army gone without ever having fired a shot.

I went from almost certain victory to being massacred shortly after that

And thats Deepstriking for you - it can go hugely wrong, but there are ways you can get around it. Pathfinders Devilfish gives you a reroll on the scatter dice as long as its in LOS. - If you are planning on a deepstike heavy army, you HAVE to squeeze in a unit of pathfinders just for the Devilfish and this ability - the Reroll has saved more lives than I can count!

Then you want to consider what you are Deepstriking.

Suicide Suits - a Monat Crisis Suit designed for one simple purpose - causing trouble or taking out a specific target. Be it TL Fusion in the back armour of a Leman Russ or a TL Flamer on a tightly packed bunch of gaunts. Its cheap and you expect it to die, but hopefully it will do its job first, if you lose it to a deepstike its annoying - but not that problematic.

Full Unit of suits - What are they armed with? If they have Missile Pods for example, there in no point in DS'ing. You can hold them in reserve and just walk them on from the table edge safe in the knowledge that you have a 36" Range (42" if you include your movement).

If however your packing rapid fire plasma death and want to get close to that unit of Marines, first off, for the cost of the unit involved you want the Pathfinder Fish and you want them in LOS of it. - Its an added layer of security. When you Deepstrike them dont put them out on there own, if there target survives they will be dead the next turn (as you cant move) - so like all Tau, you want to bring them down as part of a supported attack and make sure you have enough fire to take out your target and leave the suits in a safe place. Bring them in on there own unsupported and your asking to lose them.

If its a cheap unit like 3 TL Flamers, again you want the Fish, as the Reroll lets you position in optimum flamer range, and again, unless its a suicide unit, you want to bring them on somewhere safe - for example, bring your Outflanking Kroot and your flamers on together, your flamers can fire and your Kroot can tie whats left in CC (or rapid fire it).

The Positional Relay is a great tool if you have DS'ing suits designed for a special purpose, as it lets you select and bring on the unit you want for the task they were designed for - its 15pts, dont leave home without it.

Crisis Commanders and Bodyguards - if you dont have a PF fish, dont Deepstrike them! - Huge Unit cost and the potential to die without firing a shot dont go together. - At least the fish gives you a reroll.

Finally Vespid - you can now Deepstrike them, and the Skilled flyer rule means you can strike into cover and get a reroll for the dangerous terrain - they still arent great, but if you use them its worth remembering.

Hope that helps!
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Old 20 Jun 2010, 22:43   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
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Default Re: Deep striking

I don't use crisis suits but I deepstrike terminators and obliterators a lot.

It is a suicide mission... which is why chaos players commonly call deep striking terminator squads 'termicide'. There is one very important thing when deep striking units right into the other army.

"Make sure you can kill something worth more than your unit in one turn of shooting because your unit is going to die."

3 terminators, 3 combi meltas: 105pts Drop them next to a land raider, kill 250pts. Who cares if they die the next turn, they have earned their keep. Be glad your enemy is wasting firepower on them.

If you did something similar you might see better results. I would NOT use a commander for this. For suicide deep strike units you want the most possible firepower at the lowest possible cost because you want to do a lot of damage and then die. So gear them to kill expensive stuff(fusion blasters or plasma).

2 Crisis suits: dual fusion blasters would be the best IMO. Keep them cheap. Target big expensive tanks.

Dual plasma might be good but its only really good against monstrous creatures... anything else and you aren't earning your points back. Even against terminators you won't kill enough to be worth it.

One problem I see for Tau. You can kill big tanks easily from far away, so why drop a crisis suit with dual fusion blasters when you can railgun it? Chaos lacks good long range anti tank so termicide is good, Tyranids lack good long range anti tank so deep striking zoanthropes makes sense. Tau can kill things from a long ways off.

Just my 2 cents.
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Old 21 Jun 2010, 03:03   #8 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Deep striking

I tend to deepstrike one of my crisis suit units, I usually have them come in where I need backup, often because I am not exactly sure where the hotspots are until they occur.
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Old 21 Jun 2010, 08:32   #9 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
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Default Re: Deep striking

Ok, thanks for the replies. Just yesterday I had one more negative DS experience - I decided to deep strike my Fireknife commander, to get it into Plasma rapid fire range I opted for somewhat risky drop, which of course resulted to my Shas'el plummeting right into his death :

I haven't tried them, but I'm not big on the concept of suicide suits. You need them to arrive early before that Land Raider or whatever arrives with its Terminators. To drop them on Flamer or Melta optimum range needs a tight drop, so you need both Positional Relay and Marker Beacon to maximise their chances. Admittably latter does not cost anything if you're already buying Pathfinders (and you often are) but nevertheless, I don't like to rely on such "combos". Second, suicide suits are not "cheap", they cost you an Elite slot. Not an issue in small points games, but is signifant in larger.

Pretty much only more-or-less successful Deep strike experiences I've got have been with Missile pod armed suits like Deathrains. They don't need to be dropped close, making whole thing much safer, and they can still take out most tanks with side or rear armour shots. But this is a highly situational tactic.

I guess part of the problem is that I'm not ready to 'commit' part of my army to DS'ing. I've been just equipping my suits for conventional fighting, sometimes Deep striking them when I think it would be useful, since the option exists. That seems to be the wrong approach...
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Old 21 Jun 2010, 10:50   #10 (permalink)
Kroot Warrior
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
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Default Re: Deep striking

Ive never used Tau for deepstriking, but im now interested in collecting an army so im beefing
up on all their rules.

Deepstriking as most people will tell you, is a tricky and dangerous ploy. In real war the simpliest
strategy is more effective than a complicated one. (which has many chances of going wrong)

My suggestion with deep striking is survey the battlefield before deployment. Look at where
you and your enemy deployment zones are and identify upto three "safe" potentially beneficial drop
zones. Consider what types of units could put up a solid fight there at their random scattered range.
Then reserve cost effective units that pack a punch. In the location(s) you feel is best at the moment.

Keep in mind:
**If you Deepstrike near enemy units, your gambling with that units points, and you will likely lose them.
**If you Deepstrike nearby terrain, then once again, your gambling with their points. Consider if its worth
the risk. (which it might be)

I personally consider a "safe" zone, an open, circular (because the scatter dice will create a diameter) area where the only chance of death is if you happen to roll really high on the scatter dice.
Special Tau wargear can save you from those super unlucky situations.

The last thing id like to comment on about deepstriking is that it is used to distract a player from his current strategy and focus on something smaller, lure away a large number of units so you can move your firing lines forward AND catch soft units off guard that have special weapons or gear that is crucial
to your opponents strategy. Think of it as guerilla warfare, your behind enemy lines distrupting things while the main battles still going on.
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