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Chapter (hopefully) Approved: Advancing Tau Technology
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Old 22 Jun 2005, 18:37   #1 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Chapter (hopefully) Approved: Advancing Tau Technology

I'd like to send these ideas to Games Workshop's chapter approved, maybe to speed up some Tau changes while we wait for an updated Codex. This list largely details improvements and refined parts of Tau technology. It is not for power-gaming. Its purpose is to add more flexibility and opportunities for creativity in both army fluff (grr...I hate that word) and conversions. Note that Tau models are vastly under-represented in most GW publications...I feel this is largely due to the lack of flexibility with their models. Anyway, please visit the site below and leave your comments here. I'll post when things are updated. After a week of comments, I'll pay the 80 cents to mail it to the UK.

http://ryancannon.com/design/tau_armory/

Also, some areas I feel Tau technology lack, and I'd like to see added here are:
  • Answers to close combat
  • Answers to power armor
  • Lack of sniper weapons
  • More robust use of drones
  • More useful darkhorse units (Pathfinders, Krootox)
  • Provide a pathway to integration of Forgeworld models

I don't want to see the Tau become the same as other armies, but I do think their wargear needs to address these problems in some way. I think I've done a pretty good job. Let me know if you have any more ideas.
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Old 22 Jun 2005, 20:41   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Chapter (hopefully) Approved: Advancing Tau Technology

I would suggest removing any stats for weapons you did not create. GW can be a little punchy about posting full statlines.

GW generally does not accept fan submissions to Chapter Approved, especially those dealing with pre-existing armies. We are probably going to need patience and wait for the Studio to come up with something.

That said, the weapons system looks a little complicated. While it does give more flexibility, that is often the fastest route to powergaming, intentional or not. Weapons that count as assault or rapid-fire would count as Heavy for troops. The codex got around that by not mixing the two. It was an elegant approach, and forces us to use units in support of each other, as was always intended.

I don't like the idea of a Rail Pistol, since it doesn't jive with the technology and harkens back to 2nd edition's vast arsenal of silly-looking pistols.
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Old 22 Jun 2005, 22:27   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Chapter (hopefully) Approved: Advancing Tau Technology

Well, the thought just occured to me that no weapon embodies the idea of 'stay away and shoot' more than a sniper rifle, yet we don't have them. Good idea! Actually, EXCELLENT idea! Infact, rather than standard sniper rules, the sniper could use a 3+ for wound (aka it always has strength equal to 1 less than the target's tougness) which would reflect the tau design of a sniper that uses rail/plasma technology. I'm invisioning something like the covenant sniper in halo2. By the way, the answer to powerarmor (f you mean an equivalent) is shown in the recoil absorbtion of a crisis suit, and if you mean the 'solution' to the 'problem', then that's plasma rifles.
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Old 22 Jun 2005, 23:01   #4 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: Chapter (hopefully) Approved: Advancing Tau Technology

After taking I look I further agree completely with the idea of 'lightsaber' bayonets for combat, since given tau fighting strength, this will not be abusable since by the time tau can strike @ the end of combat, they'll be down in numbers. *pant*

Also, why not have a limited list of genetic abilities kinda similar to those of the 'Nids since kroot have the ability to absorb genetic material. While there can't be as much variance as the 'Nids, you could have things like:
+2 pt per carnivore: +1 strength
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Old 22 Jun 2005, 23:21   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Chapter (hopefully) Approved: Advancing Tau Technology

Those all ready exist in the Mercenary Kroot army, so why don't you just ope up that option for Kroot in Tau armies?
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Old 23 Jun 2005, 01:41   #6 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Chapter (hopefully) Approved: Advancing Tau Technology

* Answers to close combat
- Kroot
* Answers to power armor
- Plasma rifles, massed pulse fire
* Lack of sniper weapons
- Rail rifle should do the job, if not better
* More robust use of drones
- I agree here.
* More useful darkhorse units (Pathfinders, Krootox)
- Krootox needs fixing
* Provide a pathway to integration of Forgeworld models
- Forgeworld releases its own books, with full rules/stats/fluff etc. As they aren't official or widely available, I doubt theres much use in GW incorporating them. And it would undermine sales of IAV3.

Have a look around here and on other forums, there are a lot of discussions on what people think Tau need etc, with some good suggestions (but also some not so good ones..)
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Old 23 Jun 2005, 04:11   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Chapter (hopefully) Approved: Advancing Tau Technology

Answers to close combat
-MM and I suppose that kroot aren't doing it. Consider tau are shooty they definantly need some CC huh.... kinda defeats the whole shooty idea. Kroot work great as counter charge.

Answers to power armor
-As one of my other armies is Chaos and SoB I can firmly say that right now tau have "THE BEST" anti power armor.... more would just be far to unbalancing

Lack of sniper weapons
-Agreed. I would love to see pathfinder that can either take a mix of rail rifles or sniper rifles. Or just one of them in the squad (as in one set of three but not both rail and sniper)

More robust use of drones
-Again agreed. Drones need alot of work.

More useful darkhorse units (Pathfinders, Krootox)
-Krootox are fine. Especially if you prefer kroot based armies. Though pathfinders like I said could use a little... diversity.

Provide a pathway to integration of Forgeworld models
-All armies need that. Forgeworld is a god when it comes to enhancing while retaining balance.
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Old 23 Jun 2005, 06:33   #8 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Chapter (hopefully) Approved: Advancing Tau Technology

Removed those stat lines, thanks...don't know what I was thinking. Anyway. Thank you for your input. Here are some clarifications.

I started compiling this list after hanging around my local hobby shop. Pretty much everyone that works there plays Chaos Space Marines. If they don't, then they play Space Marines strait up. They were putting together army lists and trying to decide on the options for their characters. They're essentially limitless. The amount of wargear, upgrades, and other individualized touches was unreal. I was jealous. That simply does not exist for Tau, with the exception of one unit.

I wanted to provide a mechanism by which Tau players could have more flexibility and individualism for their characters, not powergame--hence why there is not much new on those lists. I also wanted to provide some evidence of the speed of their advancing technology.

As for some of the questions I asked:

Answers to close combat: The Tau are realizing that armies going to engage them, and they must have some plan. Combat lasers and rail pistols are the beginnings of that plan.
Answers to power armor: as they Tau confronted Marines more frequently, my guess is that they would make weapons that are more effective against them more plentiful. This is balanced by the fact that it is 1) more expensive and 2) less effective against armies with high model counts.
Lack of sniper weapons: This just doesn't make sense, especially for Pathfinders. I still have yet to come up with a solution that makes sense within the different types of Tau technology. I'm open to ideas.
More robust use of drones: With the mixed armor and toughness rules changes, there needs to be some benefit to taking drones. It also makes sense that a drone would be very configurable, based on the whims of the Cadre.
Fixing darkhorse units: I love Kroot and desperately want to take a Krootox, but can't when their benefits conflict with their attached units abilities.
Provide a pathway to integration with forgeworld models: Some GW chapter approveds make use of Forgeworld models--not by design, necessarily, but the FW models are a good option. Two examples are using Gnarloc Riders as Kroot Tracker Kindred in the Kroot Merc List, and fielding a Great Knarloc using the Carnosaur rules in the creature feature. The idea is provide another way to sell FW models, not override their Imperial Armor books.

To those who have read and left comments, thanks. Keep them coming! To those who wonder if I can/why I'm doing this, GW does advertise submissions to their Chapter Approved section, just not on their American web site (<http://uk.games-workshop.com/chapterapproved/&gt. They might just throw it away, no biggie. I want to send them some ideas on how to make the Tau army more robust and flexible, if for no other reason than to show that there is interest from their customers. Heck, what's the worst that can happen for them, they sell more bitz?
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Old 23 Jun 2005, 10:12   #9 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Chapter (hopefully) Approved: Advancing Tau Technology

no offense dude, but those ideas are pointless. Tau are the anti-wargear army.

the only things that you can argue are needed are some more suit-based support systems, like smart armour flechette dischargets, targetting arrays and the like.
and that is stretching it.

I've looked through it, and saw nothing i liked.

why do you want infantry to have special weapons? the whole concept of kroot and fire warriors was they's have NO spec or heavy weapons. allowing them to take plasmas, or missile pods is just pointless. and you got one bit of fluff wrong. tau love plasma. the plasma rifle is the typical officer weapon, like a Colonels ceremonial sword. its not regarded as primitive.
rail pistol is pointless as the only reason you take pistols in 40k is so they count as an extra ccw in combat-in the 40k game mechanics, its pointless to tau. and whats the point in separating the sub and solid railgun??
regarding drones- whats the point of giving tau power weapons? its TOTALLY unfluffy! repair drones make them into poor man's enginseers, or techmarines. Or necrons. Coming up with a concept of damaged vehicles that can self repair- smart armour would be a fluffier idea.
gue'vesa should not be taken from codex IG. if they have some form of platoon structure, maybe but different weapons etc.
bionic limbs, combat lasers anti grav platforms. ludicrous, and toally unfluffy! i do not want tau with power weapons! and neither does GW! tau are not iron hands, nor are they pariahsm nor are they eldar!

Please, stop trying to turn them into guardians!
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Old 23 Jun 2005, 12:59   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Chapter (hopefully) Approved: Advancing Tau Technology

Regarding the turret options, these are already covered in IAV3 (I think), well at least, Forge World had the test rules out for a while..

Apart from that, some good ideas there, although I think GW already has some in mind..

Tech wise, railpistols wouldn't really be pistols, they'd be more the size of a long barreled smg's or something.. the way railguns work, they need rails Although I think the str and ap you have there caters for that..

and a minor typo 'Codes: Imperial Guard' in the IG tech section :P

I think everyone would agree that Tau do need more units and/or upgrades, although I think more importantly, drones and krootox need fixing. To date, I haven't seen anyone with a krootox. Its either HH or BS, krootox just doesn't come into the picture. Refer to this thread
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