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Railgun vs. Railgun vs. Missle
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Old 08 Jul 2009, 16:16   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Railgun vs. Railgun vs. Missle

I started this subject for you guys to list the pros and cons vs. these three units:

1.Broadside crisis suit
2.Hammerhead gunship
(1)hammerhead w/ ion connon/missile pods
(2)hammerhead w/ railgun/missile pods
(3)hammerhead w/ ion cannon/blast cannons
(4)hammerhead w/ railgun/blast cannons
3.Skyray Missile defence ship
4.Sniper drones let's not forget
Making the post to hear all sides of the options you guys got .This is going to help me tweak my heavy support on my army.If the topic is to open my apologies.

Don't be scared to speak out.I am looking at all units not just these.So if you know any i missed feel free.
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Old 08 Jul 2009, 16:27   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Railgun vs. Railgun vs. Missle

Broadside can be quite fun especially with the A.S.S. 3 twin-linked railgun and the ability to move and shoot is awesome. Shield drone are highly recommanded for survivability since it scream Priority target.

Sniper drones are awesome IMO. You can get 1 to 3 teams that work indepenmdantely from one the other. so you can spread them across the board. For increased effectiveness you bneed to keep them between 21 and 24 inches away from your oppponent -where they can shoot and their stealth shield generator is at his most efective. Remember that they have a networked markelright so always shoot the spotter first, and then your drones since, if needed, they can use his marker token. Also remember that each sniper drone sqaud can target 4 different unit -potentially pinning 3. 3 squad can target 12 units and potentially pin 9.

I don't do hammerhead or skyray so can't say for sure.
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Old 08 Jul 2009, 16:51   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Railgun vs. Railgun vs. Missle

I ALWAYS have at least one broadside with me. Even at 500 points. I would recommend that this is the real staple of your Heavy choices at all point levels. However, at 1k points I usually field two HammerHeads, either a Rail and an Ion or two Rails. At 1.5k it's always two tanks and a Bside unit. Only when I make it up to 2k do I really use Sniper Drones, but I find them INCREDIBLY awesome. Depending on how your army is built, Sniper Drones can easily turn the tide of a battle *by themselves*

IF you are fielding a large number of markerlights (think 12+ ex: full Pathfinders and some on FWs or something) Then you can almost auto-pin enemy squads THREE times a shooting phase. Rail Rifles are S6 AP3, so they're almost guaranteed to wipe MEQs every shot (think Markerlights here!) AND, with a full squad of 9 sniper drones 3 spotters (240pts) you can 1: fit them in a devilfish (often ignored!) 2: drop 9 MEQs off the table almost every turn they're out, 3: Use them as a lure with a save that's situationally better than a 2+ normal save (IF YOU KEEP THEM AT RANGE - which you should) and 4: attempt to pin up to 9 squads per turn.

My 2000pt army has 21 markerlights in it (including 3 from full sniper drone team) which allows me to do any of the following (if they hit >.&gt Boost the drone's BS, reduce cover saves, reduce leadership for pinning tests. Now everyone knows all this, however, with so many markerlights I can Pin (guaranteed) 3 units of anything per turn. 3x 5BS drones firing and a further -5 Leadership? Absurd. Even if you do not wish to commit all your markerlights to the Sniper Drones just to pin some units you still get 9 crushing 3ap shots per turn and 3 BS4 stealth markerlights. That means, if you factor in no other units, you can have 9 dead marines and 1-2 extra markerlight shots every turn they're in range.

Got an enemy who is turtling some nasty units? Pop them in a Dfish and bring them far enough up the flank to get in range and stay virtually invisible. Worried about them being assaulted? Evac them behind the Dfish, use your pathfinders to strip the targets cover save and add the Bs, use the spotter markerlights for (whatever) that isn't in range of the pathfinders' and go for gold! They are, in my opinion, glorious against any kind of infantry. Force the pins on light infantry, kill numerous medium infantry denying them saves, or kill a handful of heavy infantry from safety!

All that being said, they end up being one of your most vulnerable units, so, after you establish how absurdly deadly they are most opponents will try to eliminate them because they seem so frail. This lets you take them for a spin! Use your Broadsides that are back around the Sniper Drones to either shield them, or just obliterate whatever vehicles are coming for them, use THEM to stop infantry advances until you can force a fallback or annihilate them with your FW's + Dfish (I use Lionfish).

Consider then, how for just 240 points, you can completely change the way the battle looks and feels.
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Old 08 Jul 2009, 17:59   #4 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Railgun vs. Railgun vs. Missle

240 points very nice.....I would say it would feel very good
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Old 08 Jul 2009, 18:04   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Railgun vs. Railgun vs. Missle

at 1500, I use 2 railheads and a team of two broadsides.

Above that, I shift more to Broadsides (at 2500, I use 1 railhead and two teams of 3 Broadsides)
Below that, it depends on the game.

I don't use Sky Rays
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Old 08 Jul 2009, 18:26   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Railgun vs. Railgun vs. Missle

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nasir Al Din
Use your Broadsides that are back around the Sniper Drones to either shield them, or just obliterate whatever vehicles are coming for them, use THEM to stop infantry advances until you can force a fallback or annihilate them with your FW's + Dfish (I use Lionfish).
What's a Lionfish???
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Old 08 Jul 2009, 19:18   #7 (permalink)
Kroot Warrior
 
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Default Re: Railgun vs. Railgun vs. Missle

Hammerhead with railgun, 2 burst cannons, multi-tracker, and disruption pod. - Moves as a fast vehicle, can fire all of your weapons (at most speeds), and exellect protection as long as you're over 12" away from the closest enemy unit. Dirt cheap too!

Skyray missle ship (6seekers/2MLs) with 2 burst cannons, targeting array, multi-tracker, and disruption pod. - Shares the same "pros" as above, but has its seekers instead of the railgun. For extra kicks, add a pair of piranhas with 2 seekers and a PF team. Just be prepared for all the name-calling ;D

Broadsides are fine, they just have more "cons" than "pros" for me ...
1. You need to decide between taking the ASsystem (fire HWs after ya moved) and a MT (fire two weapon systems a turn).
2. If you take the ASsystem, you now have to decide which weapon system to fire each turn. Most players just fire the TL'ed railgun, but I see this as a waste.
3. With a 2-3 shas'ui team, you can take a TL with a BK/HW DC with 2 SDs, and a HW MT if you wish. As nice as this sounds, it's a "point sink".

Sniper drones are a waste of a HS slot, in my opinion. Some people swear by them, by I believe them to be horribly over-priced and a very exspensive "target".


Those are my opinions. :-*


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Old 08 Jul 2009, 19:19   #8 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Railgun vs. Railgun vs. Missle

Broadsides: Twin linked railguns are always nice, plus with advanced stabilizers, the ability to move and shoot is not to be underestimated. Also try to bring a few shield drones, as your opponent will not want you using a triple gun salute on his land raider.

Hammerheads: vehicles, can get taken out faster than broadsides but have more options
Ion cannon: good at killing any infantry with 3+ armor saves, shoots three times, can be a great transport killer
Railgun: Single shot versus vehicles, though you will more often than no want its submunitions to fire at troops since its so much better in that role. Works great in unison with a broadside team, broadsides shoot vehicles, railgun destroys troops. Also note that open topped vehicles are weak to blast templates, making this a better option than the ion cannon versus them.
Burst cannons: Great versus hordes, otherwise a good way to save points
Smart missiles: Hide and shoot, longer range than the burst cannons and work great under night fighting rules. If you have the points and are not fighting hordes, this is a better option.

Skyray: A lot of people write this off, however it can do very well. Toss it off to the side and call seekers from it as necessary, when the seekers are gone its two markerlights can really be of great assistance. Smart missiles are preferred on this guy

Sniper teams: You get 9 sniper drones and 3 guys with networked markerlights, all taking up only one heavy slot. The also all have a stealth field. Great for watching your flanks and their focus fire can decimate nearly any troop.
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Old 08 Jul 2009, 23:30   #9 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Railgun vs. Railgun vs. Missle

@Nasir al Din: You can only put one sniper team in a devilfish at a time. Even though they would all fit, they count as separate units in play and only one unit (plus attached Independent Characters) can fit in a transport at a time.

@MaleOpener: While the railgun / burst cannons hammerhead is a good choice, it's misleading at best to say it "can fire all of your weapons (at most speeds)" or that it's "dirt cheap". You can fire only the railgun at cruising speed (6-12 inches) or all weapons at combat speed (under 6).

@all:

Broadsides: Without question the best monolith-killer short of Apocalypse, and the best long-range tank killer. Melta is better against AV14 vehicles, but they have to get close.

Hammerhead, railgun: Probably the most popular Tau tank out there. Not as good at tank killing as the broadsides for your points, but more maneuverable. It's also much better against horde and medium infantry with the large blast submunition. Generally the burst cannons are the better secondary weapon for it. If you are moving too fast to fire more than one weapon, you're going to want to fire the railgun rather than an SMS or burst cannon, so the secondaries only matter at slow speed. Burst cannons are cheaper and have more firepower, although slightly less range.

Hammerhead, ion cannon: Similar to the railgun version, but specialized for taking down marine-equivalents. Also 35 points cheaper than a similarly-equipped railhead.

sniper teams: Useful in small-point games, but I don't bother with them very often. Most enemy units are so mobile that you're only going to get 1 round of shooting before the enemy can either assault you or reliably see through the stealth field. Once you take 4 wounds and have to apply one to the spotter you have a 50% chance of losing the whole team.

Skyray: My favorite underdog. Equipped with a multi-tracker and SMS, it's the only heavy support choice we have that can fire all of its weapons at cruising speed. It's also the toughest and fastest source of markerlights we have available, although it's expensive. Combined with a pathfinder squad, you can almost empty it of seeker missiles in the first turn of shooting and likely wipe out the target unit. Once the missile rack is empty the enemy is likely to ignore it, leaving it free to markerlight freely.
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Old 09 Jul 2009, 00:01   #10 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Railgun vs. Railgun vs. Missle

Quote:
Originally Posted by knightperson
@all:

Broadsides: Without question the best monolith-killer short of Apocalypse, and the best long-range tank killer. Melta is better against AV14 vehicles, but they have to get close.
Truer words were never spoken. I never leave home wihtout Broadsides (ever since my first game with one where it ID'd an SM captain and survived 4 rounds of CC against an Ork Warboss 8)). They are durable, cheap, and reliable.

The only game I didn't take them my BS5 boosted Railhead rolled a 1 to hit against a Monolith. Next time it rolled two 5's in a row though (not before the 'lith unloaded its Necron goodness) so it's all good: But if you need that AV14 dead yesterday from a safe distance (like, say, a Land Raider full of Assault Termies) use Broadsides.
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