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Outflanking Warfish?
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Old 06 May 2009, 13:40   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Outflanking Warfish?

Pathfinders can outflank, but do people actually use them in this capability? Tried to search but didn't find much if anything. I know I'm going to experiment taking Warfish & minimum squad of Pathfinders, because idea of an outflanking tank is just too cute to pass, but I'd like to hear some practical experiences too. I'd imagine that in certain situations it might be quite effective, Warfish should have decent chance to destroy or damage AV10 vehicles or kill soft-skinned support weapons...of course, if enemy has something like Obliterators or Broadsides behind his front lines, it might not be such a good idea...
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Old 06 May 2009, 14:08   #2 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Outflanking Warfish?

I have used the "sneakyfish" a couple of times. The technique has potential, although it hasn't worked all that well for me. The thing to remember is that the pathfinders' devlifish can outflank only if the pathfinders are on board. You can't deploy them normally and send the empty 'fish around on an outflank. Since this means the pathfinders won't use their heavy weapons until at least turn 3, that minimizes the effectiveness of the trick.

The other thing to keep in mind is that you can mount a couple of seeker missiles on the devilfish. If you have another source of markerlights (stealth marker team, skyray, etc) then you can get a seeker missile shot at a side. Rear armor shots are possible, but in my experience you aren't like to get them. You will need a fairly cooperative opponent, and I never seem to get one!
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Old 07 May 2009, 18:47   #3 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Outflanking Warfish?

I use the Pathfinders (and there Warfish) pretty much exclusively for this purpose. Normally I bring them on in support of my Outflanking Kroot, and it generally has good results!

1 - You have a Tank with 7 S5 shots (possibly hitting on 3's) appearing behind enemy lines backed up by a shed load of Kroot (Normally able to hit rear armour on vehicles).

2. You have armoured support for you Kroot.

3. You can Tank Shock enemy off objectives, or even into assualt range of your Kroot.

4. You can use it as mobile cover for the Kroot.

5. Your opponent cant afford to ignore it!


The Warfish really works well as a Kroot armoured support outflanking. In one battle (as an example I brought a Unit of Kroot and 2 Warfish (+ 2 x 6 PF's) in on the same flank - facing a Whirlwind and 2 Landspeeder Storms (plus Scouts). The Kroot assualted the Whirlwind, destroying it - the Warfish fired at (and stunned) the Landspeeders. Next turn the Kroot charged the Landspeeder (it had not moved or fired thanks to the Warfish Stunning it) and destroyed that too, the Pathfinders shot the Scouts and the Warfishes stunned the last remaining Landspeeder - followed up in the next turn by another Kroot assualt which destroyed it. Working in conjunction with the Warfish the Kroot destroyed 3 Tanks and the Pathfinders (with Warfish support) killed 2 Units of Scouts. I lost 1 unit of Pathfinders.......I like Outflanking Warfish.
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Old 08 May 2009, 06:45   #4 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Outflanking Warfish?

Wow, finally a reason for me to consider Pathfinders...
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Old 08 May 2009, 09:31   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Outflanking Warfish?

I seem to distinctly remember back in 4th ed that the Scout rule for Pathfinders did NOT extend to Devilfishes... Has this changed in 5th ed? If not, you cannot use this tactic as a Devilfish has no legal means to Outflank. It sucks, I know as this is a pretty creative use and no doubt a stunner to the enemy.
As much as I'd like me to be wrong about this I fear I'm not ^^;;;
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Old 08 May 2009, 10:28   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Outflanking Warfish?

This was changed for 5th edition. Attempting to quote the 5th ed rulebook from memory, "a unit with the scout rule embarked on a dedicated transport confers the rule to the vehicle". It's possible that this was intended to let pathfinders take the scout move while in their vehicle, rather than having to start outside it in order to get scout, but RAW is RAW. The devilfish can outflank as long as the pathfinders are inside it at the time. You can't send an empty devilfish on outflank.
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Old 08 May 2009, 11:02   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Outflanking Warfish?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Charistoph
Wow, finally a reason for me to consider Pathfinders...
And you mean the markerlights aren't?

I'd try this tactic out but the problem is I like to light up the main threats to my force early so I can bring weapons to bear against them early packing my pathfinders into a warfish and flanking reduces the time they have to help me remove those big threats.

Suppose I might have to bring a small second team though, just to bring a fully outfitted 'fish on the flank and laugh manically when it annoys my opponent.
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Old 08 May 2009, 18:15   #8 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Outflanking Warfish?

I wouldn't do it. The devil fish doesn't have the outright hitting power of a hammerhead. Also, it will likely put the devilfish closer to your opponent where it's more vulnerable. Also, you can only do it with a squad of pathfinders, which is bad for several reasons. 1) you have to leave them off the table and in reserve which means you lose 2 turns of markerlight fire. 2) It could end up putting them closer to your opponent which will make them much more vulnerable than they already are.
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Old 08 May 2009, 20:14   #9 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Outflanking Warfish?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedibean
I wouldn't do it. The devil fish doesn't have the outright hitting power of a hammerhead. Also, it will likely put the devilfish closer to your opponent where it's more vulnerable. Also, you can only do it with a squad of pathfinders, which is bad for several reasons.
1) you have to leave them off the table and in reserve which means you lose 2 turns of markerlight fire.
2) It could end up putting them closer to your opponent which will make them much more vulnerable than they already are.
3) What's the point anyway? The SMS ignores cover and doesn't need LoS, so you're just hoping for a Burstcannon that ignores light infantry's armor saves when it fires from the behind...and Seeker Missiles? They have infinite range Sure the SMS and Burstcannon's range are mediocre, but seldom do you end up not having an enemy within 24'' by the time you have finished moving 6'' and with the Multi Tracker both weapons should be able to fire on prime targets.

Cheers,
-Silver
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Old 08 May 2009, 20:16   #10 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Outflanking Warfish?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedibean
I wouldn't do it. The devil fish doesn't have the outright hitting power of a hammerhead. Also, it will likely put the devilfish closer to your opponent where it's more vulnerable. Also, you can only do it with a squad of pathfinders, which is bad for several reasons.
1) you have to leave them off the table and in reserve which means you lose 2 turns of markerlight fire.
2) It could end up putting them closer to your opponent which will make them much more vulnerable than they already are.
3) What's the point anyway? The SMS ignores cover and doesn't need LoS, so you're just hoping for a Burstcannon that ignores light infantry's armor saves when it fires from the behind...and Seeker Missiles? They have infinite range
What he said... ;D
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