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Logichammer: Tau Win Tournaments
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Old 06 Feb 2009, 14:09   #1 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Logichammer: Tau Win Tournaments

I have heard a lot of comments lately about the tau, which if they all hold true contradic themselves, for example:

1. Tau are horrible at all comers lists

2. Tau are GOOD at specific anti-whatever lists

3. Space marines are broken unfair in 5th

4. People in tournaments like to play broken/unfair armies

5. Tau don't win in tournaments


Think about 2 then 3, and combine that with 4, and 5 just doesn't make any sense. either A) tau aren't that good at specific army lists, or B) we can be really good at tournaments.... particularily if you convert everyone in your gamestore over to marines in time for the tournament.
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Old 06 Feb 2009, 14:56   #2 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Logichammer: Tau Win Tournaments

Well of course if you were the only non-marine player in a tourney then you could bring a SM specific list. The fact of the matter is that on the average you won't just see SMs. Heck, I've played true SMs probably twice in the 4 years I've been with the Greater Good. Every time GW redoes a codex they push hard for people to buy into it. That would put Orks and SMs at the top of the list (not that GW really needed anymore reason to push SMs). Those are two vastly different armies with very different tactics. If you know what you're going against, Tau can be very good. This would be true for any army though. It's just common sense, you don't use a flathead screw driver for a job needing a Phillips. Any army will suffer when it comes to using a balanced list. I feel the ONLY reason SMs do well in tournies where all-comers lists are basically required is because of a fact that we all know... SMs are a jack of all trades army. Their not the best at anything but all their areas support each other and thus at a whole make the army stronger. In the same way, a Tau list as you well know is greater than the sum of its parts. A unit of Helios suits is going to have a hard time taking on anything in cover but add some markers from any other unit and the equation changes. The problem some people seem to have is they see our troops and they compare them point for point to SM troops and find them lacking. In short, you send a Tau ARMY to take on a SM SQUAD. I'm not saying it's fair, it's just the way it is.
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Old 06 Feb 2009, 17:11   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Logichammer: Tau Win Tournaments

I have around 2 years playing with tau, and I participate in some tournaments, and i won all of them, the only thing you need to have in mind is all models have some to do, and all is necesary, so try your models as were christal made, one i always use is firewarriors with devilfish, other is a unit of Death Rain crisis or FireKnife, and 1-2 Railguns and 1-3 Piranhas with Fusion Blaster, all that give you the movil force, and you have the power to put the game in any place on the table.
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Old 06 Feb 2009, 17:21   #4 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Logichammer: Tau Win Tournaments

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liinsivi
Well of course if you were the only non-marine player in a tourney then you could bring a SM specific list.
last tournament there was one drop pod marine player, I never played him the other armies were 2 Dark Eldar, 2 Tau, 1 Eldar, 1 Necron and 1 Nid, Kinda Hard to make a Take all comers army when thats your setup especially when i know the next time around its going to be a guard player instead of a eldar player

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liinsivi
In short, you send a Tau ARMY to take on a SM SQUAD. I'm not saying it's fair, it's just the way it is.
Pretty much have to remember the SM rule,
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unusualsuspect
Don't you know? Marines have the And They Shall Follow No Rules special rule.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unusualsuspect
Don't you know? Marines have the And They Shall Follow No Rules special rule.
Quote:
Originally Posted by enderwiggin
Meh, shooting roman candles in the face of the SM's charging you IS pretty ballsy...
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Old 06 Feb 2009, 18:07   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Logichammer: Tau Win Tournaments

How do things work in tourneys? Do you just submit an army list and stick with it, or can you make adjustments on the fly?
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Old 06 Feb 2009, 18:34   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Logichammer: Tau Win Tournaments

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashtoruin
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liinsivi
Well of course if you were the only non-marine player in a tourney then you could bring a SM specific list.
last tournament there was one drop pod marine player, I never played him the other armies were 2 Dark Eldar, 2 Tau, 1 Eldar, 1 Necron and 1 Nid, Kinda Hard to make a Take all comers army when thats your setup especially when i know the next time around its going to be a guard player instead of a eldar player

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liinsivi
In short, you send a Tau ARMY to take on a SM SQUAD. I'm not saying it's fair, it's just the way it is.
Pretty much have to remember the SM rule,
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unusualsuspect
Don't you know? Marines have the And They Shall Follow No Rules special rule.
You really like that quote, don't you, Ash? ;D
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Old 06 Feb 2009, 19:14   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Logichammer: Tau Win Tournaments

The qoute is right up there beside "They shall always be right".

As for Tau in tournaments I have to say that the doom and gloom people have it somewhat right. Allow me to explain.

Tau, as an army, tailored to it's enemy, can really excel when it has a good commander. I can make a list that can kill Orks down to the last nob, Necros with out many losses, Open tin cans.... I mean Space Marines, flatten Eldar, dog food Tyranids and recycle Chaos Space Marines. I have yet to lose a battle with a nicely tailored Tau army.

But wars (tournies) are not single battles alone. Looking at my lists that have been finely tuned, they are all finely tuned to a certain enemy. My Anti space marine list is a lot of Plasma Rifles, with a mixture of Rail Rifles and Rail guns. My Firewarriors primarily hang back and do nothing but capture objectives. It doesn't work well with hordes.

I make a horde based list, taking out large amounts of models with mass firepower. But I then have to sacrifice the points to bring the guns, normally in heavy hitting weapons that would normally be used to take down MEQ.

I have tried balancing the two, so I could compete and got handed my hat by BOTH of those armies I previously defeated.

I have found that:
A: A tailored Tau list is just as powerful as before, as long as it is tailored to that enemy.
B: A tailored enemy list can very rarely defeat my Tau army, when I am also using a tailored list.
C: When the list does not match the enemy, I have a far harder time even breaking even.
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Old 06 Feb 2009, 19:56   #8 (permalink)
WLD
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Default Re: Logichammer: Tau Win Tournaments

Well Sun, those aren't all true, they are just assumptions, It ain't always to do with the Army, the players skill also comes into play, and vice-versa.
You could have a right moron playing a squad of 'Nid's against a lone space marine with a pistol and still lose, how do I know this? I played as the marine once, ok I got him down to the last one but still my point stands, different factors have to be studied before you can come to the conclussion that Tau suck at tournaments.


Although it is proved that "Tau are GOOD at specific anti-whatever lists"!
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Old 06 Feb 2009, 21:46   #9 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Logichammer: Tau Win Tournaments

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unusualsuspect
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashtoruin
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liinsivi
Well of course if you were the only non-marine player in a tourney then you could bring a SM specific list.
last tournament there was one drop pod marine player, I never played him the other armies were 2 Dark Eldar, 2 Tau, 1 Eldar, 1 Necron and 1 Nid, Kinda Hard to make a Take all comers army when thats your setup especially when i know the next time around its going to be a guard player instead of a eldar player

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liinsivi
In short, you send a Tau ARMY to take on a SM SQUAD. I'm not saying it's fair, it's just the way it is.
Pretty much have to remember the SM rule,
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unusualsuspect
Don't you know? Marines have the And They Shall Follow No Rules special rule.
You really like that quote, don't you, Ash? ;D
Dude that quote is the best thing since Sliced Bread, lol
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We have done the impossible… and that makes us mighty.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unusualsuspect
Don't you know? Marines have the And They Shall Follow No Rules special rule.
Quote:
Originally Posted by enderwiggin
Meh, shooting roman candles in the face of the SM's charging you IS pretty ballsy...
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Old 06 Feb 2009, 21:52   #10 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Logichammer: Tau Win Tournaments

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashtoruin
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unusualsuspect
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashtoruin
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liinsivi
Well of course if you were the only non-marine player in a tourney then you could bring a SM specific list.
last tournament there was one drop pod marine player, I never played him the other armies were 2 Dark Eldar, 2 Tau, 1 Eldar, 1 Necron and 1 Nid, Kinda Hard to make a Take all comers army when thats your setup especially when i know the next time around its going to be a guard player instead of a eldar player

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liinsivi
In short, you send a Tau ARMY to take on a SM SQUAD. I'm not saying it's fair, it's just the way it is.
Pretty much have to remember the SM rule,
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unusualsuspect
Don't you know? Marines have the And They Shall Follow No Rules special rule.
You really like that quote, don't you, Ash? ;D
Dude that quote is the best thing since Sliced Bread, lol
It is true. They do have some kind of rule that ignores some facet of just about every single core rule in the entire book.

I mean, they have special characters that give them fleet of foot. They cant be overrun in close combat. They might as well be fearless. They have equipment that allows them to not scatter when deepstriking. Similarly they can negate the effects of the deepstrike mishap table completely. They have a unit that allows them to assault the turn they deepstrike. They have vehicles that ignore crew stunned results and can still fire even if they're shaken. I could go on... but I dont think I have enough time to list al of the rules defying crap that the space marines can do.
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