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Skyray Seeker Missile Warhead Options
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Old 10 Nov 2008, 17:07   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Skyray Seeker Missile Warhead Options

In repsonse to some of the criticism regarding my previous entries in making suggestions for improvements to the Skyray, I proposed the idea of different warheads for the Seeker Missiles. I must agree overall, I would rather have the Sky Ray be able to carry transports rather than unlimited ammo. But as an alternative to unlimited ammo, perhaps being able to do new things with the somewhat vanilla Seeker Missile may have some of you perk your ears up. Points costs are all equivalent to the standard seeker missile, as I am trying to keep it balance at that point cost. Here we go...

EMP Binary Warhead

This seeker missiles casing breaks up, revealing two rocket-propelled EMP grenades, one rocket boosting immediately while the other is delayed, impacting several seconds after the initial detonation. This is to deter any counter-measures on the target vehicle. As such, each grenade is resolved as a separate attack, damage being rolled for each as per the EMP greande entry in the Tau Empire codex.

Airbursting Fragmentation Warhead

This seeker missile carries the same munition fired from the Airbursting Fragmentation Projector, and works in a similar fashion, the only difference being a higher Str (+1) due to the lager volume of munitions that the seeker missile can hold, versus a single canister used on the Crisis-based platform.

Standard Warhead

Same as Codex, except small blast template. It simply makes no sense that a warhead that big wouldn't have some sort of blast.

Sabot Kinetic Energy Warhead

The casing of the seeker missile breaks up, revealing a long, dart-like projectile, focusing all missile energy to a small point, piercing the armor of any vehicle. Because the warhead focuses on armor piercing rather than an explosion, the relative strength of the munition is low, and relatively ineffective against non-vehicles due to a lack of any explosion. The Sabot round, mathematically has an armor penetration equivalent to that of a standard seeker missile, but also has a higher maxima and lower minimum (the dart could hit a less vital portion of the tank), where as a standard seeker missile is more multi-purpose, has a higher minimum (67% 10+ on armor pen, vs. 58% 10+ for sabot). So, the sabot has a greater chance of doing nothing, but if it hits, it has a better chance of doing more, but is overkill for other applications.

Str 5, AP 1, 2d6+S for armor penetration

Conclusion

I am not sure if the points are balanced or not... I think they are. The math seems to have nice trade-offs. The idea with maintaining balance is that you would have to select, before gameplay, which warheads would be on your seeker missiles, which is another balancing mechanism.

Please don't just shoot it down because you don't think the points are balanced... tell me what you think might improve it. I think there is something to work with here.
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Old 10 Nov 2008, 18:01   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Skyray Seeker Missile Warhead Options

I like a majority of the choices, they seem very nice. Too bad GW doesn't actually make changes when someone really thinks them out.

I find that the Binary warhead would be a little bit on the cheese side. The opposing side did pay points, like we do for the Dpods, to protect the tank. There isn't anything, other then getting close, that can nullify our advantage of Dpods.

I find the rest of the choices to be viable and rather thought out. I am wondering if I can get the House to fly a few of these.

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Old 10 Nov 2008, 18:11   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Skyray Seeker Missile Warhead Options

I like the ideas so far, but heres where I would do a few changes.

The EMP warhead should be a little stronger than a normal EMP grenade, but only by one increment as it is a larger unit. If I remember right thats glance on 3-4 and penetrate on 5-6. it would be more expensive, yes, but only useful against vehicles. Against infantry its useless. I'd say between 10-20 points, 10 if it is only 1 attack and not 2.

No changes to the frag warhead, though I would say this would be a pricey missile too. The ability to light up an enemy squad with 5+ armor or worse, then smash them with a no cover large blast is brutal, especially for Eldar stuff. I'd say 15-20 points a shot, mainly because you'd only scatter at BS5.

While it does make sense for a small cruise missile to have some sort of area kill zone, this is 40k, where logic does not exist. I'd say either make the seeker 5 points, or keep it at 10 points with the small blast.

As for the Sabot round, I think Tau already have enough dedicated Anti-Tank, especially with railguns, fusion blasters, and the EMP warhead above if it were to be used. But I would make the strength on this 1 higher, as kinetic kill munitions such as a sabot penetrator are very powerful, especially in such an application (As we know today in life, for those who know their weapons) That brings average penetration to 13, not enough to glance AV14, so a good roll is needed to do that, and not terribly broken. Just expensive.15-20 points a shot.
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Old 10 Nov 2008, 18:13   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Skyray Seeker Missile Warhead Options

I actually like most of these rules, although there would have to be a point increase so Guard, etc. players wouldn't scream "CHEEZE!!1" for Tau getting a BS 5 Hunter-Killer Missile with a blast. But I definitely agree that the Seeker should be a blast & I think the EMP & Airbursting are great.

Maybe increase the strength of the Sabot to 6, as it doesn't even have a better chance of getting AV10 than the standard. You could even get rid of it, as you've already made an anti-armour missile.

Also, shouldn't this be in the House Rules board?
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Old 10 Nov 2008, 23:59   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Skyray Seeker Missile Warhead Options

Quote:
Originally Posted by ranzin927
I like a majority of the choices, they seem very nice. Too bad GW doesn't actually make changes when someone really thinks them out.
Thanks, I appreciate that it seems that interesting and/or balanced to actually be something considered.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ranzin927
I find that the Binary warhead would be a little bit on the cheese side. The opposing side did pay points, like we do for the Dpods, to protect the tank. There isn't anything, other then getting close, that can nullify our advantage of Dpods.
Yeah, I meant it more so for each grenade to be resolved in damage separately. Im not sure if they should have a cover save... do they get one with standard seeker missiles?

MDRedeemer:

You are right, the sabot round may be overkill when I could modify the EMP warhead and with all the other tank-busting options. I was thinking of perhaps a mine deploying warhead, or a small blast template scattering warhead... like it carpet bombs an area. I was also thinking of an anti-air warhead.

Yeah, some point balancing would definitely be needed. I need to brainstorm some good math.

Hairy Grim:

There is a House Rule section? I assume that is in the General chat area? Perhaps when I hammer this out here, I can post a more refined version.

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Old 11 Nov 2008, 03:47   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Skyray Seeker Missile Warhead Options

The House Rules board is under the 40k Creations board... or whatever it's called... it's the one above the Hobby board.
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Old 11 Nov 2008, 03:55   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Skyray Seeker Missile Warhead Options

Also, you might want to take a look at the Tau epic rules. There are some ideas over there without a doubt.
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Old 11 Nov 2008, 10:42   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Skyray Seeker Missile Warhead Options

I'm gonna say no to the blast rule on the standard seeker. Not only is it designed as a precision strike weapon, but by giving it a blast we then have to have it scatter - not good when egaging vehicles.

I like the EMP Binary, although balance would be hard, and I like the sabot version.

I'd suggest looking into Epic fluff, where Tau have a hell of a lot more missiles, like Tracers for engaging heavy tanks.
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Old 11 Nov 2008, 15:45   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Skyray Seeker Missile Warhead Options

I just said that. :P
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Old 11 Nov 2008, 16:12   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Skyray Seeker Missile Warhead Options

Quote:
Originally Posted by Faith
I'm gonna say no to the blast rule on the standard seeker. Not only is it designed as a precision strike weapon, but by giving it a blast we then have to have it scatter - not good when egaging vehicles.
say that, with that missile only, it counts as Bs 8. then it will scatter no more than 4", so it wont usually move at all. the other missiles extra bitz can make them less accurate (remain bs 5)
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