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Piranha squadron size
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Old 02 Oct 2008, 10:15   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Piranha squadron size

How many Piranhas is a good number to field in one squad.

I have three Piranhas; I haven't used them yet and I would like to use all three in one squad, but am a bit tight on points and two would be more affordable.

Would two still be effective? What is a good number?
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Old 02 Oct 2008, 11:29   #2 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Piranha squadron size

I normally use 2 squads of 1. I have also used just a single piranha flying around.

As for effective. It depends and what your using them for, if you have burst cannon armed ones hunting infantry the more you use the better they are. My army is kind of light on anti-armour so both of mine are armed with fusions. they fly around trying to hit what ever is annoying me the most and generally keeping my Hammerhead alive by take shots that would otherwise be aimed at it.
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Old 02 Oct 2008, 11:51   #3 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Piranha squadron size

I was going to give them fusions, target arrays and disruption pods. I have three hammerheads so don't really need extra anti tank but I think I prefer fusions over bust cannons tell me if I'm wrong.

If I take them in squads of one isn't it dangerous giving away the extra kill points?

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Old 02 Oct 2008, 12:00   #4 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Piranha squadron size

Better to have one you can hide then many who can be killed.

Personally, I'd split them 3-1-1 if you choose to purchase the other two, but 2-1 if you don't. Fast attack slots allowing of course.
Being the fast, short ranged things that they are, most of the piranha's enemies are going to be close enough to negate the disruption pod on whatever turn you strike. The cost of a piranha isn't worth the defence investment IMO, there won't be much long range shooting at them. Especially with a hammerhead trio to distract and incapacitate their main weapons.
I'd advise on fusion blasters as well, the drones can tie up enemy shooty squads and provide light pulse fire. Tau already have enough pulse weapons, where a good fusion blaster is comparatively rare. Targeting Arrays are a must with the Fusion blaster.


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Old 02 Oct 2008, 12:09   #5 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Piranha squadron size

Well that was before 5Th ed and I have only played one 5Th ed game and didn't use them. I guess it is but I don't know the Kill point rules so...

As Korill says, Targeting arrays are a must with Fusions. Of cause, pathfinders marking for them also helps. The problem with that is you really want the pathfinders marking for the hammerheads/suits in your army (if you even take any).

Use the Piranhas to hunt artillery and the odd HQ/termie squad.
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Old 02 Oct 2008, 12:39   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Piranha squadron size

The kill points rule will effect one third of games, the others are objective based. Each unit gives away one kill point when killed so if I split my Piranhas up = more kill points.

Do the advantages of splitting them up outweigh the disadvantage when playing with kill points?

I would think that with units of one, you give your opponent more targets and you have more units to contest objectives with a last turn turbo boost, but then there is the kill points you could be giving away with a fragile skimmer.

With a larger squad you get a larger drone squad (does that matter) and give away less kill points.

I'm starting to see why splitting them up is better, kill points is bothering me but maybe I should just be more careful 1/3 of the time. Or hold them in reserve to keep them alive longer?
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Old 02 Oct 2008, 14:06   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Piranha squadron size

It sounds like it isn't worth worrying about. But not having played it I can't say for sure. Also, the drone squadron from the piranhas would also probably count towards kill points aswell, if i'm understanding it correctly. it will really come down to how the unit works with your play style. I like to use them as two units cause I tend to use them to harass more then anything. I like to use them to take hits for my hammerhead, as I said before. I suggest you play acouple of games using both single model squads and combos of multiple squads and see what works for you.
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Old 02 Oct 2008, 18:56   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Piranha squadron size

Do you find that fire directed at your hammerheads is of the same type as that which goes against your pirhanas?

I would imagine that most of the stuff shot at a HH is at least S8 unless the opponent can get a shot off at side armor, in which case maybe an S7 shot could be worthwhile. I'd think most of the weapons being shot at a Pirhana would be of the S6 or S7 variety, and maybe even S5 with side armor...

I'm not saying you're wrong, I just want to know what your experience is? Does it take those shots because of the 3++ save it gets and perhaps the lower strength stuff is missing the Pirhana forcing them to use the big guns or suck life to the Pirhana's FBs?

I'm teetering on Pirhanas, and genuinely interested in your answer!

Thanks,

RmeJu
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Old 02 Oct 2008, 20:33   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Piranha squadron size

An interesting thing to consider is that the Piranha, at a base cost of 60 points, brings 5 of those Str 5 Ap 5 shots we pay 10 points each for. Throw on a targeting array, d pod, and the thing is quite mobile compared to Fire Warriors of equivalent points. Useful for people trying to "scale" into larger point valued-missions.
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Old 03 Oct 2008, 08:05   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Piranha squadron size

Quote:
Originally Posted by rmeju
Do you find that fire directed at your hammerheads is of the same type as that which goes against your pirhanas?

I would imagine that most of the stuff shot at a HH is at least S8 unless the opponent can get a shot off at side armor, in which case maybe an S7 shot could be worthwhile. I'd think most of the weapons being shot at a Pirhana would be of the S6 or S7 variety, and maybe even S5 with side armor...

I'm not saying you're wrong, I just want to know what your experience is? Does it take those shots because of the 3++ save it gets and perhaps the lower strength stuff is missing the Pirhana forcing them to use the big guns or suck life to the Pirhana's FBs?

I'm teetering on Pirhanas, and genuinely interested in your answer!

Thanks,

RmeJu
This was before 5Th ed so... I haven't used them in 5Th yet. Might try them this weekend. My 2 main opponents were Black Templars and CSM, the BT player used mostly assault cannons for AT work and the chaos player used lascannons. they didn't really used str 6-7 weapons. the chaos player did use heavy bolters but I never gave him a chance for side armour with them, plus he really only used the heavy bolter against my FWs. None of the players really bothered with high STR weapons against me because if my tanks hadn't moved it was because they were dead, so glancings all round.

5Th ed will be different. I'm still not sure how useful mine will be. Being armed with fusions and my main opponents using hoard armies now, I might have to drop them for stealth suits. The extra shots would be more useful against the hoards.
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