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When to assault with Tau
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Old 27 Sep 2008, 18:13   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default When to assault with Tau

Although Tau are generally not the best CQC troops, I think there are times when combat would be appropriate:

1. It is always better to charge than to be charged. Unless you could eliminate your enemy with one turn of pulse fire when he's in assaulting range, it's better to charge him and get a bonus attack than being charged and him getting a bonus attack (even if you have photon grenades, its better to charge)

2. Desperation. Obvious. If twelve pulse carbines won't kill them, maybe this will...

3. If you have a reasonably good chance of coming out on top (this is the least common of the three situations). If the offending squad is something like grots, guants, guardsmen, or anything else with strength 3, toughness 3, and a 5+ save or worse, than you will probably beat them in combat because of your 4+ save (WOOHOO)!
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Old 27 Sep 2008, 19:04   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: When to assault with Tau

Perhaps...

But keep in mind, why Assault when you have, if at full strength, 24, Strength 5 AP 5 shots...

As oppose to 24, Strength 3 AP Zilch attacks?

Though, I suppose the Pulse Carbine would be the only time I'd assault.
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Old 27 Sep 2008, 19:24   #3 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: When to assault with Tau

Quote:
Originally Posted by monocleman
Although Tau are generally not the best CQC troops, I think there are times when combat would be appropriate:

1. It is always better to charge than to be charged. Unless you could eliminate your enemy with one turn of pulse fire when he's in assaulting range, it's better to charge him and get a bonus attack than being charged and him getting a bonus attack (even if you have photon grenades, its better to charge)
Unless you are certain you will survive a round, which means passing a leadership check, I disagree. It is better for them to charge, so that they are left standing for other units to take on.
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Old 27 Sep 2008, 20:38   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: When to assault with Tau

Quote:
Originally Posted by monocleman
Although Tau are generally not the best CQC troops, I think there are times when combat would be appropriate:

1. It is always better to charge than to be charged. Unless you could eliminate your enemy with one turn of pulse fire when he's in assaulting range, it's better to charge him and get a bonus attack than being charged and him getting a bonus attack (even if you have photon grenades, its better to charge)
I disagree completely! It is better to charge than be charged if a) charging doesn't cost you your shooting, which with tau rapid fire weapons it does, b) you are not in cover, which my fire warriors usually are, c) you don't have photon grenades to nullify the enemy's charge advantage d) you get more attacks on the charge than you do shooting, which is not the case with pulse rifles. Unless you have pulse carbines, photon grenades, and no cover, few if any of these will be true. The initiative of fire warriors is terrible, and in most melees they're dead before they even swing, regardless of who charged who.

Quote:

2. Desperation. Obvious. If twelve pulse carbines won't kill them, maybe this will...
I'll concede this one, but only if you're outside of cover, and that's rare for my guys.

Quote:

3. If you have a reasonably good chance of coming out on top (this is the least common of the three situations). If the offending squad is something like grots, guants, guardsmen, or anything else with strength 3, toughness 3, and a 5+ save or worse, than you will probably beat them in combat because of your 4+ save (WOOHOO)!
With fire warriors or pathfinders a melee is almost never to your advantage. If you're unable to avoid the melee your best bet is to hang back in cover and rapid fire to soften them up, then hope they don't have frag grenades when what's left charges you. Even guardsmen and gaunts are going to have better weapon skill than your guys, so they will hit on 3's not 4's, they'll likely have more attacks, and they'll likely go first. A slightly better armor save is not going to make enough difference to counteract all of that.

Kroot, Vespid, Crisis suits, even drones can do well in melee on occasion, but only against the right targets. I would add Necron warriors to the list of charge targets as kroot have better stats except for armor save. Especially if you have hounds, a kroot charge is one of the better ways of making Necrons go down and stay down.
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Old 27 Sep 2008, 21:00   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: When to assault with Tau

I do have one very rare reason that you might.

If you are under heavy fire by a short ranged tank.
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Old 27 Sep 2008, 21:18   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: When to assault with Tau

A unit of 15 Kroot and 10 Hounds can take down pretty much anything
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Old 27 Sep 2008, 21:40   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: When to assault with Tau

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoneFishing
A unit of 15 Kroot and 10 Hounds can take down pretty much anything
Actually for assault you need to have equal number of kroot then hounds...so 12:12.

The reason is quite simple: Majority rules used in assault. Especially the bit about 'if there is no majority you use the best value'
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Old 27 Sep 2008, 22:10   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: When to assault with Tau

When to assult with Tau? Never. Unless you can be sure that you will win, and it is essential to victory that the enemy unit is destroyed (a single guardsman contesting an objectice, etc.), then you never should assult with the Tau.

The reason? If you charge into combat, it is fairly certain that the Tau will lose, and the unit will be destroyed. Now, you can try to win the combat, and end up just protecting the enemy unit from shooting for a few turns, or you can let the unit die in the turn it is assaulted, allowing the enemy unit the chance to get shoot to bits. If you charge, the unit charging is less likely to get itself killed in one turn, which in this case is bad. :P
That's also why I don't use photon grenades.

It really isn't effective to assult with the Kroot, either, unless a more expensive Tau unit is at risk. Kroot are much better at hiding in woods, pretending to be Space Marines. >
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Old 27 Sep 2008, 23:09   #9 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: When to assault with Tau

I am not sure the majority rule counts for much with Kroot, Kroot and hounds have exactly the same statline except for I. Attacks still go in "I" order, so the only point that its going to count is if you have lost/won the combat and are rolling for sweeping advance. By that point you are almost certain to have lost a few Kroot so you can achieve the "Majority" "I" simply with the judicious removal of just a few models - IE take some kroot away as casualties. I would rather have the extra Kroot for firing, the Hounds are mainly there for first strike capability.

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Originally Posted by Woogmeister

It really isn't effective to assult with the Kroot, either, unless a more expensive Tau unit is at risk. Kroot are much better at hiding in woods, pretending to be Space Marines. >
I completely disagree with that sorry - Kroot in the right numbers are devastating in assault. My Kroot have swung many a battle with a well timed charge (especially since outflank). And have taken down Carnifexs, tanks, Space marine tactical and assault squads, Sisters etc with ease in close combat. Yes, compared to some armies assault troops they look weak, but a unit of 25, charging in with 75 attacks is going to make a mess. Small units of kroot sat on objectives are great as a cheap objective holder (especially woodland) but a big unit used well is equally as good as an assaulting unit, and can be a real game winner! If you are fielding a small unit of say 10 Kroot with no hounds, then yes, they are weak in assult - but add the I 5 hounds and boost the numbers and you have a unit that can either shoot or assult - a unit that doesent just hold objectives, it takes them.
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Old 28 Sep 2008, 06:05   #10 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: When to assault with Tau

Quote:
Originally Posted by Woogmeister
When to assult with Tau? Never. Unless you can be sure that you will win, and it is essential to victory that the enemy unit is destroyed (a single guardsman contesting an objectice, etc.), then you never should assult with the Tau.

The reason? If you charge into combat, it is fairly certain that the Tau will lose, and the unit will be destroyed. Now, you can try to win the combat, and end up just protecting the enemy unit from shooting for a few turns, or you can let the unit die in the turn it is assaulted, allowing the enemy unit the chance to get shoot to bits. If you charge, the unit charging is less likely to get itself killed in one turn, which in this case is bad. :P
That's also why I don't use photon grenades.

It really isn't effective to assult with the Kroot, either, unless a more expensive Tau unit is at risk. Kroot are much better at hiding in woods, pretending to be Space Marines. >
Actually, I've had a reasonable amount of success with kroot assaults. While they may not be able to take assualt marines in a stand-up fight, they can take things like tac marines, sisters of battle, or anything weaker then that (if in sufficient numbers, I usually run with as large a kroot+hound squad as I can when I actually bring them) if they charge just through sheer number of attacks. I mean, they're basically orks with higher initiative and lower toughness.
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