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Tau technological acheivment, when will they stop???
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Old 24 Aug 2008, 21:26   #1 (permalink)
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Default Tau technological acheivment, when will they stop???

The tau at the current time in the 40k universe (m.42) are achieving technological feats that rival that of even the eldar. I am aware as everyone else is that it is within tau society to advance at an amazing rate but i was wondering when will they stop and why?
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Old 24 Aug 2008, 21:29   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Tau technological acheivment, when will they stop???

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Originally Posted by Eddy
The tau at the current time in the 40k universe (m.42) are achieving technological feats that rival that of even the eldar.
In the same way that a chariot and a Jet Fighter can both carry people at speed. :
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Old 24 Aug 2008, 21:31   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Tau technological acheivment, when will they stop???

actually im right read this quote from the gw website: perhaps more than any other species in the Warhammer 40,000 universe, the Tau rely on their technology to survive. An entire stratum of Tau society is devoted to engineering and science the Earth caste and it has developed technical wonders that rival even the Eldar. Advanced technology has enabled the Tau to expand their small empire at an extraordinary rate.
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Old 24 Aug 2008, 21:46   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Tau technological acheivment, when will they stop???

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddy
actually im right read this quote from the gw website: perhaps more than any other species in the Warhammer 40,000 universe, the Tau rely on their technology to survive. An entire stratum of Tau society is devoted to engineering and science the Earth caste and it has developed technical wonders that rival even the Eldar. Advanced technology has enabled the Tau to expand their small empire at an extraordinary rate.
That's to appease the fanboys.

Tau skimmer-tech is inferior; Eldar vehicles lack armour not because they cannot build them with armour, but because they don't see the point. Bright Lance tech renders armour pointless. Think about it - you wouldn't wear a bullet proof vest if nobody in your army carried a gun. Eldar skimmers have been reported engaging low-flying aircraft, and are pretty much as good as Skimmers can get.

Eldar weapons tech is far in advance - the Tau's most advanced weapon is the Ion Cannon, which they bought off the Demiurg and scaled down. The Eldar use so many high-tech weapons I don't know where to begin, but Bright Lances and D-Guns deserve a mention.

Eldar shield technology, though rare, is at least equal to Tau tech. Shadowfields are superior to anything else any other race can produce.

Eldar "cloaking" tech is virtually un-rivalled - the closest thing to a Holofield is the Necron's "shroud" in Gothic.

Eldar Titans are so advanced they can dance.


Tau are not "rivals" to the Eldar technologically. Not by a long shot. They are certainly more practical (as the Eldar believe that the appearance is as important as the function), but not as advanced.
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Old 24 Aug 2008, 22:46   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Tau technological acheivment, when will they stop???

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Originally Posted by Wargamer
That's to appease the fanboys.
As opposed to the vast tracts of material appeasing Eldar fanboys, which is all you have ever been working off of. We simply don't have an impartial way of setting the baseline for Tau technology outside of the actual background material. It is advanced because GW tells us it is, just as it was when they said the same for the Eldar years ago. Thus your completely unsupported point about the Ion Cannon being the most advanced weapon the Tau have. If you are going to make this sort of stuff up, at least have the decency to present it as an opinion. Otherwise back it up with a reference.

It is not up to the fanboys to define the Tau or the Eldar. If GW wants to make the Tau a high-tech race, as they have since the beginning, complaining about it now seems a little petty. Eldar fanboys already have enough to brag about. Technological prowess is not their specific niche, just as firepower is not the unique tactical niche of the Tau.

[hr]

I think the Eldar as written can be arrogant to the point of stupidity, and this manifests itself in their approach to technology. Even when their systems are inferior in terms of raw capability, they generally fail to recognize it. Their technology is complex, but it is not always the most powerful or effective. And when it is not, the Eldar fail to accept those weaknesses and address them. The Eldar excel in warfare and in the arts, but they do not appear to make very good scientists or engineers.

Eldar systems are certainly more complicated than those of any other race aside from the Necrons, but their approach to technology seems to be just as non-scientific as that of the Imperium. An Eldar craftsman could take centuries learning how to build a shuriken catapult with a perfect and graceful function. Every part of it would be lovingly crafted, and the craftsmanship would make it a formidable weapon. But that artisan would never try to improve the underlying design through first-principles physical experimention. That just isn't how the Eldar think. So it is still not going to be as effective in many settings as a mass-produced Pulse Rifle or a Bolter. This is likely why the Eldar haven't really advanced technologically in the thousands of years since their fall.

And this is in line with the original Space Elf archetype. What the younger races accomplish with innovation and ingenuity, the elves match with skill and wisdom. The net effect is pretty much a wash. Despite being much older, they can be rivaled in terms of technology by races many times their junior because in their longevity they have not retained the ability to grow.

[hr]

In the context of the original topic, Tau technology will probably continue to develop so long as their current culture remains in place. They will reach plateaus when the theoretical part of their science gets ahead of the applied science. This mirrors our own technological development, where simple advances drive much greater applications.

But as the Empire gets larger, implementing new advances will get harder. You can not roll out a new design of Pulse Rifle across your entire military at once, and in the meantime there will be issues with incompatible parts and training. Humanity seems to have solved this problem with the STC system, but this standardization also limited their ability to innovate new solutions.

Technological innovation is also easier in the absence of social segmentation. The Tau in the current era are more or less a monoculture. Compare that to human culture today. There is a specific form of technological conservatism that forms whenever you have a lot of distinct sub-cultures within the same society. This is a brake on development the Tau currently lack, but may develop as the septs become more culturally distinct.
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Old 24 Aug 2008, 22:58   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Tau technological acheivment, when will they stop???

When will they stop?

Well, it depends in what sector. The warp, as is so often said, is anathema to them, so proper warp travel is well out, as is warp based weaponry such as the Eldar use and teleportation.

However, eventually they might be able to use the same kind of drives that the Necrons use, and make lighter and more sophisticated battlesuits. That would make sense. But you can't say where the "top" would be.

I imagine another thing they would like to advance in is increasing their lifespan, but that'd change the pragmatic attitude of the race...
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Old 25 Aug 2008, 04:27   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Tau technological acheivment, when will they stop???

yeah, I aint tryin' to brown nose or anything but I think Khanaris said it best. You pretty much hit the nail on the head as far as it concerns the Tau. I dont know enough about the Eldar to say one way or the other but As long as all the Tau are on the same page with technological development and as long as the Tau Empire remains relatively dense then we'll see a lot more technological advances from them in the near and distant future.

All of this makes me excited for when they redo their codex.... probably in a couple of years... :
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Old 25 Aug 2008, 16:06   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Tau technological acheivment, when will they stop???

Thanks guys that's helped. On the topic of technology, as you said, the tau are on the same page with technology although i myself haven't been specific enough about technological achievement. The tau probably outmatch the eldar when it comes to cybernetics but the eldar certainly outmatch the tau when it comes to technology based upon using the warp and similar developments.The ion cannon the most advanced? what about the CIB and rail rifle?

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Old 25 Aug 2008, 16:23   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Tau technological acheivment, when will they stop???

Ol' Wargy doesn't like to think of the Rail technology as advanced...

You'll get nowhere in the arguments of Tau vs. Eldar with him for the most part. :P




I think the Tau advancement will stop fairly quickly though. I don't see us having enough friends at GW to keep us getting stuff. We are quickly becoming the shafted army of 40K due to our lack of supporters from the inside...
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Old 25 Aug 2008, 16:49   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Tau technological acheivment, when will they stop???

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Originally Posted by Slave to the Bell.
Ol' Wargy doesn't like to think of the Rail technology as advanced...

You'll get nowhere in the arguments of Tau vs. Eldar with him for the most part. :P
If only because he's to stubborn to back down when he's wrong. (and contary to what he will insist he has been wrong before now. Opinions do not a valid argument make...)


But generally yes, a Rail weapon isn't overly advanced considering we have the technolgy to make single shot versions now. What is more advanced is the Tau versions are a fairly improved version of our current version, Kind of like how a "computer" isn't advanced, but the latest NASA version of one is.


Also, since when did we get "Shafted" by GW? I've seen countless uses of Tau in background sources, and it hasn't suddenly stopped as far as I can tell.
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