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Dawn of War Deployment and Devilfish Transports
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Old 06 Aug 2008, 20:46   #1 (permalink)
Kroot Warrior
 
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Default Dawn of War Deployment and Devilfish Transports

I have heard several different interpretations of this rule, so I was wondering what others had to say.

In Dawn of War Missions, would a Firewarrior squad with a Devilfish take up both of the troop deployment slots or just one?

I figured it would only take up one slot since Dedicated Transports are outside the Force Org Chart, but others have said it would take up both.
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Old 06 Aug 2008, 20:48   #2 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Dawn of War Deployment and Devilfish Transports

Quote:
Originally Posted by RockoRobotics
I figured it would only take up one slot since Dedicated Transports are outside the Force Org Chart, but others have said it would take up both.
Lemme see if I can be first!

the troop is 1 unit, the fish is nothing but a transport. You can Deploy it with the troop inside or separately but even in Dawn of war it must be deployed if it is the dedicated transport for that unit.
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Old 06 Aug 2008, 22:03   #3 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Dawn of War Deployment and Devilfish Transports

im sorry. this is probebly a dumb question but what does "dedicated transport" mean EXACTLY (what must the transport do or not do to be a dedicated transport)? also, does the devilfish count as a troop when counting who controls an objective in 5th ed (only troops count in 5th i think, but are transports considered troops)?
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Old 06 Aug 2008, 22:30   #4 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Dawn of War Deployment and Devilfish Transports

"Dedicated" transport means a bit less than it used to, but here goes:

A dedicated Transport is one that is purchased with a unit, as part of its unit options. It used to be that only the unit that purchased it could ever use it, but YAY that's changed, and nowadays they only have to start off with their purchasing unit. In this way, a Dedicated Tranport is part of the purchasing unit, and all count as a single unit.

There are some vehicles out there that can be purchased AS a separate unit, such as Land Raider and Falcon tanks. And this is what differentiates these from dedicated transports.

On a final note, some of those non dedicated transports can find themselves as dedicated ones nonetheless, if they can be purchased as a units' transport- a good example of this is Space Marine HQ being able to buy a land raider for their bodyguard unit.

So, to answer the original question (even though I still have no idea what a 'Dawn of War' mission involves), since you cannot in fact buy a Devilfish as a heavy or fast attack slot, then it has no choice but to be a dedicated transport, and be included with another units slot on he Field Allocation Chart.

[there! if someone ninja'd this post, I bet their ninja kung-fu [??] was no match for mine!! ;D )
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Old 07 Aug 2008, 02:08   #5 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Dawn of War Deployment and Devilfish Transports

Just use the devilfish from your pathfinders instead. If you dont have pathfinders then get them and use their devilfish! hehe... you should have some anyway. ;D
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Old 07 Aug 2008, 02:58   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Dawn of War Deployment and Devilfish Transports

But "unit" doesn't exactly equal "FoC slot." Please refer to p.87, "Force Organization Chart: Dedicated Transports."

Quote:
Originally Posted by 5th Edition Rulebook, p. 87
For example, a Rhino bought for a Space Marine Tactical Squad (Troops) counts as a unit of Troops..."
I think there's a case to be made for a Devilfish counting as one of the two units deployed in Dawn of War conditions.
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I picture the Ethereal looking out the window of the Devilfish from his seat: "Hey this isn't the way to Applebee's?! Where are you guys taking...Aw man, a battle?! Aw, you guys are total dicks, I swear! I'm still wearing my bathrobe! Can I at least have a gun? What do you mean you don't have any extra? What should I do, hit Khorne Berzerkers with my symbol of office? Man, you're gonna be sorry if I die... dicks."
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Old 07 Aug 2008, 03:43   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Dawn of War Deployment and Devilfish Transports

I am pretty sure the Transport does take up one of the spaces in DoW set-up. As an example I heard was:

SM Commander (HQ)
9 man Tac Squad (Troop)
Rhino (Troop)

Your deployment could involve you placing a Rhino, and that's it. Everyone else is inside that.
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Old 07 Aug 2008, 20:59   #8 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Dawn of War Deployment and Devilfish Transports

The Rhino might be SM specific, however in the 5th edition rule book on page 67 under the box labeled "dedicated troop transport" which is what a devil fish is, you must deploy it with the unit who purchased ( they do not have to be inside but it has to deploy when that unit does ) and since it does not take up a slot in force organization it alone can not hold an objective. If you have it stuffed full of FW it can hold an objective however.

In terms of the description on page 87. If the vehicle itself actually became a "troops" choice you would only be able to field a max of 3 troops units with a vehicle assigned to each one.

The description is ment to tell the player when to deploy the vehicle I.E if you have a Rhino assigned to a unit of space marines you deploy the rhino when you place troops down I.E Dawn of war. Just as if you had given the Rhino to an elites unit you could not just place it on the table.

To Calaban: Dawn of War simulates 2 armies scouting an area at night and they run into eachother, then reinforcements are called from the surrounding area and it escalates into an all out battle.

You play on table halves and can not be within 18in of an enemy unit, also you are only allowed to deploy the compulsory 2 troops/1HQ at the start of the game keeping all other units in reserves.

Turn 1 : Night Fighting rules are in effect and all troops not in special reserves come into play.

Turn 2 : Game continues as normal with no night fight rules in effect.
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Old 11 Aug 2008, 02:36   #9 (permalink)
Kroot Warrior
 
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Default Re: Dawn of War Deployment and Devilfish Transports

With the Rhino, can't that be taken as a stand alone transport? I don't have my Space Marine Codex with me, but I think that how it works.

As for the Dedicated Transport, based on what I have found, here is my current stance:

The Dedicated Transport does not count towards the two troop limit because:
1) A dedicated Transport must be deployed at the time its squad is deployed....
2) Dedicated Transports are outside the Force Org Chart and therefore are NOT a troop choice.


As for a Non-Dedicated Transport, It would count as one of the troop choices because the non-dedicated transport occupies one of the six troop slots on the Force Org Chart and therefore it is a Troop Choice.


Anyone have arguments for or against this?
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Old 11 Aug 2008, 05:25   #10 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Dawn of War Deployment and Devilfish Transports

Guys, dedicated transports can be held in reserve empty. If a unit deploys in them, it must be the unit they were bought with - reread the note on page 67. Otherwise, there are no deployment restrictions - see p. 94.

Also: if you read the note on p. 87, it seems as if dedicated transports count as a Troops choice for Dawn of War deployment.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Col.Angus
I picture the Ethereal looking out the window of the Devilfish from his seat: "Hey this isn't the way to Applebee's?! Where are you guys taking...Aw man, a battle?! Aw, you guys are total dicks, I swear! I'm still wearing my bathrobe! Can I at least have a gun? What do you mean you don't have any extra? What should I do, hit Khorne Berzerkers with my symbol of office? Man, you're gonna be sorry if I die... dicks."
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