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Fifth Edition Tau
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Old 19 Jan 2008, 16:46   #1 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Fifth Edition Tau

So, how do you think the Tau are gonna pan out in fifth edition?

-Devilfish full of Fire Warriors will become even more common units for grabbing objectives at the last second (even more so than they already are, due to troops being the only units that can hold objectives... kinda like Advanced Wars )
-Deep Striking battlesuits becomes a little more safe.
-Hammerheads... Well, to be honest, they're a bit damaged by the new (balanced) Skimmer rules. But that's okay. Now they can Ram stuff if their weapon is destroyed! (awesome). And, look on the bright side. At least if you pass the 5+ invulnerable you're not guaranteed to be shaken, like you are with the 'reduce all hits to glancing' rule.
-More reliance on Broadsides than hammerheads, due to aforementioned rules.
-Units can not be shot through by your own troops... Not usually a big deal, if you set up right, especially if you're using a lot of transports.

What do you guys think? *prepares for 5th ed. bashing*
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Old 19 Jan 2008, 16:55   #2 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Fifth Edition Tau

well- based on what i've seen its not going to be that big of a difference.

Pathfinders will extend their scout rule to their devilfish (as it should be)

Hammerheads will become much better with the inclusion of the new vehicle rules as they will be a bit sturdier and be able to always fire their support weapons (since they are all bellow s 6) but we have yet to see what they will do with the skimmer rules in general regarding the new cover system.

There won't be a new reliance on anything- it will just tweek certain armies and prevent cheese armies- which i don't think the Tau have anyway.

The new line of sight is a kick back to 2nd edition before 'silly' people started playing. A model has to see another model= end of story. I think that will just make better gameplay.

The only changes I do see are people having to rely more on their ability to adapt and less on one tactic- so all you run and gun/static armies get ready to have to play both sides of the field.
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Old 19 Jan 2008, 16:59   #3 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Fifth Edition Tau

A hammerhead hull is 90 points. +10 really because it would be foolish not to take the mtrk
A Predator hull is 70 pts.

both present an armor 13 front.

30 points difference that allows the hammerhead to move 12 and still fire, and only be glanced.

allegedly now for the 5th, all there is left is the manuverability. 30 pts for the manuverability - i think it's worth it, but barely. - HH not so much a bargain anymore Teh suxxor? - definitely not.

I gladly take this nerf to all the more easily kill the mass of flying assault cannons (which are nerfed too - hooray!) as well as the unkillable eldar fortresses.

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Old 19 Jan 2008, 18:46   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Fifth Edition Tau

Quote:
Originally Posted by calmsword
Hammerheads will become much better with the inclusion of the new vehicle rules as they will be a bit sturdier and be able to always fire their support weapons (since they are all bellow s 6) but we have yet to see what they will do with the skimmer rules in general regarding the new cover system.
Problem is that they changed the defensive weapons to only those that are 4 or less so the Hammer head can only shoot it's defensive or it's main gun.

Things that really help the Tau in my opinion are the new jet pack rules and the huge reliance on cover saves now.
In the leaked 5ed book jet packs allow the unit to fire a heavy weapon and still move. This will probably open up a lot of people trying to use mobile marker lights on stealth and crisis suits. The new vehicle rules also say a fast skimmer counts as an obscured target, granting it a 5+ cover save. Guess what army can reduce cover saves with a gun =).
Also Tau have the disruption pod upgrade, which with the new obscured target rules, makes it really useful.

The method that you make saves in a unit after being shot is also changed which helps Tau. Now you cant roll 6 saves in a 6 man squad and if you fail 3 just remove 3 random guys. You have to distribute all the wounds before you roll armor saves. This helps Tau out with being able to take out any heavy weapons in small units.

Oh yea, also dedicated transports can act like taxis after the first turn, makeing pathfinder's mandatory Devilfish not a handicap any more.
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Old 19 Jan 2008, 18:59   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Fifth Edition Tau

Quote:
Hammerheads will become much better with the inclusion of the new vehicle rules as they will be a bit sturdier and be able to always fire their support weapons (since they are all bellow s 6) but we have yet to see what they will do with the skimmer rules in general regarding the new cover system.
No. Immobilization is still deadly if we move faster than 6" and we don't get the benefit of a skimmer if we move 6" or less. The 'Skimmer Moving Fast' rule is a cover save (5+) and does not stack with actual cover. Even including the 5+ cover save, a penetrated skimmer is just as likely to die as a penetrated normal vehicle (just less likely to lose a weapon or become shaken/stunned). Skimmers will need a slight point cost reduction to represent this loss in survivability (open-topped skimmers doubly so).

In addition, Defensive Weapons are now Str 4 or less, which helps Space Marines (mass Storm Bolters) but nerfs everyone else. Walkers also got nerfed, as they can only fire 1 non-defensive weapon on the move (as opposed to any combination of 2 defensive and normal weapons).

The new wound allocation rules help Tau somewhat, since we don't have embedded weaponry (it does, however, hurt Shield Drones). They have, however, made falling back contagious, which hurts low leadership armies more. Oh, and only troops are scoring, which is kind of a shaft to any army which only gets generic guns in the troop slot.

Last Man Standing is now gone! Blessed are the Broadsides, who won't flee off the boards! Drone Controllers got just that much better.

And Pathfinders still shouldn't be Fast Attack, despite them fixing the Scout rule for transports. Heavy Weapons on Infantry with a mandatory transport is bullshit, and will remain so until they fix it.
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Old 19 Jan 2008, 20:33   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Fifth Edition Tau

I just pray the Tau get mega-FAQ'd. There's some things in the book that the 5th Ed Rulebook just won't fix without FAQing.

/sigh

Who knows how long it'll be before they decide to do that though, if at all. :'(
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Old 19 Jan 2008, 21:34   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Fifth Edition Tau

Is there any mention of Fire Warriors being able to Rapid Fire 15" instead of the usual 12" in 5th edition? Doesn't it kind of make more sense, seeing on how nearly every weapon that can Rapid Fire does so at essentially half of it's total range?
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Old 19 Jan 2008, 21:43   #8 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Fifth Edition Tau

Here's a list of possible effects I see the new rules having on the Tau. I understand that these rumors could be false, but it's more fun if we treat them like they aren't. Only time will tell.

Troops
  • Troops are now the only scoring units. My first thought was that this could threaten armies with low amounts of Fire Warriors, like T0nkaTruckDriver's mobile infantry list. With more reflection, I think that more Kroot can solve this problem (more Kroot solves every problem!).
  • In my opinion, these rules simply makes Kroot more awesome - if necessary, their infiltration lets them enter from non-player board edges, and the "taxi" ability of transports can help move them around. They can also go to ground and increase their cover save by +1, at the expense of being pinned.
  • We'll need to be more careful of assaulters - they can Run!
  • But so can we! And, our bullets don't "fall out of the air" at 30" - wounds are applicable to all the members of a fired-upon squad.
  • Skimmers now block line of sight. Depending on how Line of Sight works out in terms of models and bases, Fish of Fury may be a thing of the past.

Pathfinders
  • Pathfinders now confer their scout move to their Devilfish. whoop!
  • The Pathfinder Devilfish can now transport other units. This means it's a Devilfish that rerolls deep striking scatter die for free.

Pinning
  • Pinning now occurs directly after a unit receives an unsaved pinning wound. This will increase the utility of Sniper Drone Teams - we'll know if a squad is pinned before additional shooting, rather than having to play it safe and "stack" multiple pinning tests.

Crisis Suits and Stealth Suits
  • Crisis Suits can now jump-shoot-jump anywhere - like, from behind a squad of Tau Fire Warriors. I love the idea of seeing Crisis Suits behaving like they should: working in tandem with foot infantry, providing heavy weapons support.
  • Crisis Suits now count as stationary for both rapid fire and heavy weapons. Stealth Marker Teams are even stronger, and XV-84s are now practical choices.
  • Infiltrating Stealth Suits coming in from a board edge - hello, Basilisks!
  • No more Last Man Standing!
  • All jump infantry gets the Deep Strike special rule. Yay for Shadowsun! Yay for Vespid!

Commanders
  • IC status has been changed - commanders can be shot if they can be seen.
  • We actually have a reason for retinues and shield drones.
  • They confer acute senses and their Blacksun Filters to squads they join.

Vehicles
  • Pulse weapons are now consider "offensive weaponry." This hurts, but not as much as you might think.
  • Skimmers Moving Fast confers a 5+ Cover Save - which, is in effect, what disruption pods will do. Meaning - we don't have to move fast to get the benefits of getting SMF, and will therefore still be able to fire all of our weapons!
  • Sensor Spines could become awesome.


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Old 19 Jan 2008, 22:27   #9 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Fifth Edition Tau

i don't get the new wound system- could someone explain it?

The marker light deal will definatly make Crisis teams more versatile- as they should be.

is the S 4 really the case? hrm, maybe they'll make a special rule for Tau because that does seem rather silly.

And they must have done something more for IC- or is it really gone? I guess they want you to buy that retinue.
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Old 19 Jan 2008, 22:30   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Fifth Edition Tau

Don't forget Railgun Submunitions scatter now...
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