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New tactic for Vespids or abuse of the rules?
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Old 01 Jan 2008, 20:02   #1 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default New tactic for Vespids or abuse of the rules?

If you use 2 units of vespids to surround an enemy unit in a "U" shape and then tank shock into the open end with, let's say the mandatory devilfish from your pathfinder squad. would the unit be summarily destroyed because it cannot give way to the tank?
New tactic for killing a unit in the movement phase or an abuse of the rules?
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Old 01 Jan 2008, 20:09   #2 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: New tactic for Vespids or abuse of the rules?

I'm pretty sure someone has brought this up before only instead of using vespid they used Parana and a devilfish.

I suppose you could do it. I don't see anything wrong with the tactic besides leaving the vespid in the open. It might be tough to get the vespid around the unit like that in one movement phase, but hey just give it a shot and let us know what happens.
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Old 01 Jan 2008, 20:52   #3 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: New tactic for Vespids or abuse of the rules?

Been asked and/or done before probably,
It'll be very difficult to get units like that, and there is another thread with a similar question in,
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Old 01 Jan 2008, 21:08   #4 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: New tactic for Vespids or abuse of the rules?

This has been brought up before. How it works is this.

If the surrounded unit fails its morale test after being tank shocked, then they are destroyed.

If they pass then the tank stops in front of them.
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Old 01 Jan 2008, 22:30   #5 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: New tactic for Vespids or abuse of the rules?

Why would the tank stop? I mean that doesn't make sense at all. If some people were standing in front of me and I needed to get rid of them and I was in a tank, whether they held their ground or not I'd still run over them.

I'm sorry if I'm sounding rude but you'll have to justify that one. As far as I'm concerned there isn't a chance for that unit to survive.
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Old 01 Jan 2008, 22:57   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: New tactic for Vespids or abuse of the rules?

Well, anyone forced to give way are destroyed if they pass their morale, or all are destroyed if they fail. It clearly states in the rules that models MUST give way to the tank-shocking vehicle, and no model may be within 1" of the enemy unless in assault.

However, just because it works doesn't mean you ought to do it. It's beardy, and after you do it once don't expect anyone to ever want to play with you again. In a Grand Tournament where everyone who competes is a powergaming beardy jerk, then go ahead and use it, but otherwise it's best to just play a clean game with no dirty tricks.
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Old 02 Jan 2008, 06:40   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: New tactic for Vespids or abuse of the rules?

Lol there are better, faster, and easier ways of killing a unit. Also, taking two Vespid units? Who does that? I'd love to see what kind of list can support that, Vespid are far too fragile to be taking up 2/3 of your Fast Attack.
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Old 02 Jan 2008, 09:08   #8 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: New tactic for Vespids or abuse of the rules?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaffl
Well, anyone forced to give way are destroyed if they pass their morale, or all are destroyed if they fail. It clearly states in the rules that models MUST give way to the tank-shocking vehicle, and no model may be within 1" of the enemy unless in assault.

However, just because it works doesn't mean you ought to do it. It's beardy, and after you do it once don't expect anyone to ever want to play with you again. In a Grand Tournament where everyone who competes is a powergaming beardy jerk, then go ahead and use it, but otherwise it's best to just play a clean game with no dirty tricks.
That's not right, or I've read it wrong
Ok here we are
- You declare your going to tank shock a unit, you declare how far and in which direction, you move your vehicle in a straight line until it reaches the unit(s)
-They can choose to either take a morale check or Death or glory
-if they pass there morale they simply move out the way and the vehicle carries on until its movement is completed ,
-if they fail, they brake and follow normal fall back procedures, (so if they can't move they are 'Trapped!' and are destroyed,


-If they Death or glory, each model may make one shooting or close combat attack that automatically hits,
-if the fail to stop the tank the models that were attacking are squished, the rest act as if they have failed a morale check.

And hey.. I go to Grand tournaments... *strokes beard* *packs iron warrior army*
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Old 02 Jan 2008, 11:09   #9 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: New tactic for Vespids or abuse of the rules?

Well I have the rule book right in front of me and reading through tank shock, it sounds like no one has got it 100% right.

This is how I interpreted it from the rulebook page 70 under Tank Shock:
1. You declare your going to tank shock a unit, you declare how far and in which direction the tank moves.

2. You can turn the vehicle before the tank shock, with the actual tank shock being done in a straight line.You measure to see if the enemy units can be reached by the tank, if they can't be reached you just move the tank normally.

3. If the enemy unit is overrun by the tank and models would end up underneath the tank, they must move out of the way by the shortest distance while maintaining unit coherency (they don't get harmed).

You can read the part about tank shocking other vehicles, because it's pretty simple.

4. If a unit has moved from being tank shocked it must take a morale check,if it fails it falls back.
5.Death or Glory:
If the unit passes its morale check one of the models in the path of the vehicle can try and destroy it instead of moving out of the way. This model gets only one attack, either from a shooting weapon or in close combat that hits automatically against the tanks front armour. If the model stuns, destroys, explodes, annihilates, or immobilises the tank then it stops right in front of the model, if the model doesn't then it dies outright and the unit that Death or Gloried must give way.

I hope that I helped a bit, I'm not all that good with rules but I sat down and read through that part of the rules a few times while writing this post so I hope its correct!
Clive

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Old 02 Jan 2008, 11:54   #10 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: New tactic for Vespids or abuse of the rules?

So they pass their morale check and get placed to the side of the tank.

Now the clever bit from the first poster. The U shape of vespid. The tank shocked unit can not be placed within 1" of an enemy model.

So what do you do?
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