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RTT Report.
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Old 03 Apr 2005, 05:24   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Fenton, MI
Posts: 1,151
Default RTT Report.

Alrighty then, I'm back! The short version is, I won 3 games and lost 1... came in 3rd out of 10 people. The long version follows...

Here's the list I ended up bringing. I didn't have time to assemble and paint 3 more Kroot, so instead, I used the extra 25 points for 2 Shas'ui and a D-Pod on the Railhead... much easier that way!
  • Shas'el [TL Plasma Rifle, Fusion Blaster, HW Multitracker] (96)
  • Shas'el [TL Plasma Rifle, Fusion Blaster, HW Multitracker] (96)
  • 6 Stealth Suits (180)
  • 6 Stealth Suits (180)
  • 1 Crisis Suit [Twin-Linked Missile Pod, Flamer] (57)
  • 12 Firewarriors in Devilfish [Shas'ui, Multitracker, Decoy] (225)
  • 12 Firewarriors in Devilfish [Shas'ui, Multitracker, Decoy] (225)
  • 14 Kroot (98)
  • 8 Pathfinders in Devilfish [Shas'ui, HWDC + 2 Gun Drones, Multitracker, Decoy, 2 Seekers] (243)
  • Railhead [SMS, Target Lock, Multitracker, Decoy, Disruption Pod] (185)
  • Ionhead [Burst Cannons, Multitracker, Decoy, 2 Seekers] (165)
  • Broadside Battlesuit [DC + 2 Shield Drone] (100)

Total: 1850
Seekers: 4
Tanks: 5
Scoring Units: 10

[hr]

Game 1

My first game was against a Vanilla Eldar player with a GEORGEOUS army. I later found out that his wife painted it all He had 2 Falcons, 2 Wave Serpents, Banshees, Striking Scorpions, Wraithguard and Swooping Hawks. A little bit of everything... except Guardians! The mission was Unplanned Assault (roll for mission objectives on turn 3). We started only with compulsory troops and infiltrators on the table... which meant that I had 2 Firewarrior Devilfish, Kroot, 2 Stealth Teams, and Pathfinders against his 3, 4 man Ranger squads and his infiltrating Striking Scorpions. I was clearly at an advantage from the start!

I won first turn and proceeded to horribly maim him. By the end of my turn 2 I'd wiped his starting troops from the table. My excitement quickly turned to horror though when he rolled for reserves and won his Swooping Hawks... and moved them on within assault range of a carelessly deployed Firewarrior squad. CRAP! I kicked myself. Hard.

It was then that I found out that his Swooping Hawks had a Phoenix Lord in with them. Ok, not too bad, I'll lose one squad, right? Well, no... my Stealths were within easy consolidation distance from the Firewarriors which means he's in combat during my turn and will pop out just in time for his turn again! I have to do something or he's just going to run from one combat to another with his d6" consolidation + 12" move + d6" fleet + 6" charge there's no way I'll be able to run fast enough. Then I have a stroke of genius. If I send the Kroot into that combat, he's got a choice. Either attack the Kroot (who will be charging with 42 S4 attacks) or attack the Stealths (who have a 3+ save). Well, he falls for the bait and goes for the Kroot. I lose 9 Kroot, but no Stealths die at all, and I even manage to kill a few Swooping Hawks! Both Kroot and Stealths pass their Ld check and hang around. Now we're going to fight another round of combat during his turn when he'll (hopefully) slaughter me, and I'll be free to shoot him during my turn. The plan is progressing well (all the Stealths die) and I'm left with 2 Kroot. I'm below 50%, and outnumbered 3 to 1 so I'm testing on Ld 3. Shouldn't be hard to fail this one...

So the Kroot pass their check, he whoops them during my turn and the Swooping Hawks come out of combat ready to go again during his turn. AAAAARRRGH! All my worst fears have come to fruition. He spends the rest of the game jumping from one unit to the next rolling 9 and 10 power weapon attacks with his silly Phoenix Lord cleaving though unit after unit.

The other horrible stroke of bad luck came on the last turn. I had just enough units to contest 2 objectives, and he had the other 1. If I could take down his Falcon, my Hammerhead could claim one of the contested objectives and it would be a draw. I had stunned the Falcon last turn, so it could be penned! With 2 Railguns and 5 S7 shots, I can't seem to hit the broad side of a barn... and those that hit fail to penetrate armor. AAAAAAAAARRRRGGG!

So I lose this one on account of my Kroot passing a Ld 3 check and my Broadside rolling a 1 for armor penetration against the Falcon.

MVP: Decoy Launchers - These got used sucessfully 4 times this game.

LVP: Kroot - Damn you Kroot...

[hr]

Game 2

This was against a Slannesh Chaos army with 2 Rhino squads, 2 squads on foot, 2 Havoc squads, 2 squads of Deamonettes and a mounted Lord. The mission was The Hunted (one squad worth double VP's).

Not much to say here. There were 7-8 small copses of trees on the table that I was able to use to deny him LoS to the majority of my army while I concentrated fire on 1 squad at a time. I deployed evenly across the table and then abandoned one flank (leaving the Broadside behind as assault bait) and watched as 1/3 of his army was left with nothing to shoot but my 100 pt Broadside... and him with no AP2 weapons. I deployed my Kroot slightly forward of my main line >6" into a forest so I could shoot out without fear of return fire. I hoped he would feel the need to root them out... and would use his Lord to do so. His lord is an IC and therefore can't be shot unless he ventures away from other units. What better than a 98 pt unit of mercenaries to do just that... especially after their horrendous performance the game before!

So while my entire army is dismantleing his on the one flank, he's slowly advancing his Lord forward under the cover of his 2 footslogging squads. When he's finally in range to charge, he decides to flame them first (Chaos Siren or something like that). They of course decide to flee now. Pathetic. He then charges them anyway, even though they're fleeing, and they fail their leadership check to regroup and are wiped out immediately. This now leaves his Lord a good 18" in front of the rest of his army staring down the barrel of a Hammerhead Railgun and a Fusion Blaster form my Commander. He's got a 5+ inv, but both these weapons can insta-kill him. The Fusion Blaster misses and he makes his inv save from the Railgun! DOH! Fortunately this was the last turn.

End result, I lost a Broadside, a Devilfish, and a Kroot squad while he lost ~ 2/3 his army.

MVP: IonHead. It lost its IonCannon on the first turn at which point he stopped perceiving it as a threat and it became a delivery system for 6 BS4 S5 shots per turn. Sometimes I feel like my Heavy Support would be much more effective if I could bring them without a main weapon. The Broadside and Kroot also worked really well this game as cheap bait units allowing me to dictate his movement.

LVP: Deathrain. This guy traded shots with a Rhino the entire game, immobilizing it on turn 1 and not destroying it until turn 6.

[hr]

Game 3

This was against an all-infiltrating, all-foot slogging Marine army. He had 1 large CC tac squad, 2 small plasma tac squads, 2 LasCannon tac squads, a Scout squad, a large Assault squad, a Chaplain and retinue, and 2 Whirlwinds. The mission was This is 'eavy Doc (changing gravity either increases or decreases movement randomly each turn).

With so few heavy weapons and no infiltrate on the mission, I went into this with a good feeling. Again I used the Broadside to bait him into heading into a corner while I took the rest of my army and dismantled him one squad at a time. By the end of the game, he had only his HQ squad left. The changing gravity was incredibly useful with my Commanders and their short ranged weapons. On turns when gravity was light, I could move an extra d6" allowing me to easily get within 12" and then jump away. The highlight of the game was setting up for a Mont'ka, wiping the large tac squad from the table with shooting, charging the Kroot into the weakened Scout squad behind them with their 10" move and 10" charge (yay light gravity!), winning combat and consolidating into a small tac squad behind. This removal of 2 squads and consolidation into a 3rd effectively stalled their advance sufficiently for me to establish a mini-firebase and destroy each new squad as it came around the corner one at a time.

I'm rather proud of how well I played this game... but admittedly there was little this list could have done to hurt me.

MVP: Kroot. I so rarely charge with my Kroot, since it's pointless against Marines with I4 and a 3+ save... but against the Scouts it actually worked quite well. My Commanders were also really useful this game.

LVP: Railhead, if only because it didn't really have an appropriate target. Killing 1 or 2 Marines a turn with a 180 pt tank isn't the most efficient

[hr]

Game 4

This was against Kroot Mercs. With no shooting except a unit of snipers. The only thing he had to take down my vehicles were the aforementioned sharpshooters and 4 Shapers with Eviscerators. We were on a table with lots of LoS blocking terrain (mesas), but no area terrain to give his Kroot cover saves. His whole army infiltrated. The mission was basic VP's with the added caveat that you could "teleport" one unit per turn like a Necron Veil of Darkness. Neither of us really ever used it...

Rightfully wary of assault after the debacle that was my first game, I deployed with extreeme caution. I realized that if I could avoid a first turn assault, I could out-maneuver him and tear him apart... even considering the 150+ models he had in his army. He just had no way to deal with my tanks.

Everything started in their vehicles and the vehicles were deployed in a line as far forward as possible ~10" from each other across my deployment zone. Then, I deployed my suits in a line along the very back of my table edge. The goal here was to create a line of skimming tanks to push back his infiltrators and keep them from being able to get a first turn assault on my suits. Kroot have jump troops who can buy an item that allows them d6" closer infiltration, and I was really worried he was going to be able to infiltrate in a position to charge my suits on the first turn. I deployed my Stealths inside the "protective wall of skimmers" while infiltrating my own Kroot far outside the barricade as a bait unit. Yes... feel free to infiltrate d6" closer to them and charge them on the first turn. I don't care at all...

He fell for the bait, but rolled very poorly for his fleet roll and ended up not being able to assault them. The rest of the game was very predictable. I came out of my skimmers only when I was assured I could take out everything within assault range. He tried his darnedest to take down my tanks with his eviscerators and snipers. My Broadside and Seekers were useless, but everything else was effective x 10. By the end of the game he'd killed both my Hammerheads (this was the only time the Railhead died all day!) and the Broadside, and I'd killed everything except 1 large Kroot squad.

The game was one sided from the start, but fun nonetheless. There were lots of jokes about my Kroot vs. his Kroot exchanged back and forth and a good time was had by all.

MVP: Firewarriors. These 2 squads deployed in a rapid-fire maneuver in a location that gave them good LoS to the rest of the table. I then spent the remaining 3 turns stationary laying down waves of fire that decimated squad after squad. I never thought Firewarriors were useful for much... it turns out they are, as long as it's T3 with 6+ armor.

LVP: Railhead. It missed with it's sub-round on turn 1, was stunned turns 2 and 3, and died on turn 4. Way to suck.

[hr]

So that's how it went. I enjoyed myself very much and felt that I did a really good job adjusting my playstyle to my opponent. I tend to get locked into one style of play and find that it limits my effectiveness in competitive events like this. These 4 games, I tried to free myself from that mindset while attempting to dictate my opponent's game by using bait units and meta-game psychology to give myself an advantage. All in all, it worked pretty well!

I've enjoyed using my Kroot, and occaisionally the Monat Broadside as bait units to distract fast assault units. I have a feeling I'll be able to do this even better with a 2nd unit of Kroot in the list as well. As usual, the Firewarriors didn't do much except preserve their victory points and occaisionally rapid-fire into an enemy unit. Even so, I'm certainly getting better about judging when to deploy them and when to hold off for another turn... often the later is the better option. In point of fact, the only game in which I actually had a Firewarrior squad drop below 50% was the first game where they were wiped out by the Swooping Hawks on account of my careless deployment.

So yeah, that's about it, hope you liked the report!
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"i like to think of playing against my list as being like punching jelly. you put all your effort in but it just moves out of the way and you cause no damage. then your arm is covered in jelly. and the chicks come out and start wrestling in the jelly, and i drink a beer with stone cold steve austin, and we watch the chicks jelly wrestling, and then the slap-bass funk starts wakka chakka wakka wakka woh" -- Spooky, describing Mech Tau

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Old 03 Apr 2005, 05:43   #2 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: RTT Report.

Ruthless luck on the Eldar , but sh*t happens :P.

bummer about the railhead in the kroot game too, could have been a wrecker (not that it would be neccecary ^-^)

so refused flank is working well for you? and people actually fall for the kroot that often?
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Old 03 Apr 2005, 05:54   #3 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
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Default Re: RTT Report.

Yeah, the refused flank worked quite well. I didn't try it against the Eldar since they had so many vehicles that could match my speed it wouldn't have helped... plus I was getting spanked. But against slower armies, or armies with flimsy transports (Marines), I've had good luck with destroying their mobility early and then retreating to one flank and watching a third of their army dance around with a bait unit left behind.

Yeah, they usually go for the Kroot, but I don't really give them much choice. I set up a large-ish shooting gallery with the Kroot, my Commanders and my Hammerheads and they dutifully march up the field to try to get into assault. Then as they get close, everything but the Kroot jets and they're left with the realization that they can either attempt to chase the fleeing units (who are faster than they are) or go after the Kroot and try to earn a few VP's. Well, the secret here is that they only send one or two units after the Kroot... after all, they're just Kroot! So while those one or two units are feeling good about themselves slaughtering 7 pt mercenaries, I'm tearing the rest of their army apart.

By feeding them that 98 pt unit, I can split their forces enough to be able to concentrate the majority of my army on a portion of theirs... one of the primary doctrines of Mech Tau.

As you can see, I never really got around to wiping any of these folks from the table. But in these missions, it didn't really matter.
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"i like to think of playing against my list as being like punching jelly. you put all your effort in but it just moves out of the way and you cause no damage. then your arm is covered in jelly. and the chicks come out and start wrestling in the jelly, and i drink a beer with stone cold steve austin, and we watch the chicks jelly wrestling, and then the slap-bass funk starts wakka chakka wakka wakka woh" -- Spooky, describing Mech Tau

"You can of course make a list that attempts to work via fragility and easy VP donation and Pathfinders fit into that just fine." -- kai
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Old 03 Apr 2005, 06:07   #4 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: RTT Report.

hmmm, maybe its just the way I build my marines but with the realization that you are a 12" army I'd leg it up the boardinto cover and start to try to pick off units that come in with tac weapons and whatnot (but then again my marines are generalists).

I can see the predicaments they get in, maybe its just the fact that I cant visualise the board positions ^-^.
I'm quite lazy with my tactics, I tend to pay a bit too much heed to instinct and the body language of the player as to what he thinks he's doing (damn lazy mind dont want to do math and calculate distances :).

anyone else suffer my condition? ^-^

and how often do you change plans? turn by turn? or try to keep steady to the plan?
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Old 03 Apr 2005, 06:13   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: RTT Report.

You're definately right. The way to beat Mech Tau is to out shoot it. 9-10 LasCannons or Missile Launchers smattered around the Troops and HS sections is usually enough to do it.

Mech Tau can run away from almost anything, but if your opponent has guns, they don't need to chase you. We're the ultimate "fighting retreat" army.
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"i like to think of playing against my list as being like punching jelly. you put all your effort in but it just moves out of the way and you cause no damage. then your arm is covered in jelly. and the chicks come out and start wrestling in the jelly, and i drink a beer with stone cold steve austin, and we watch the chicks jelly wrestling, and then the slap-bass funk starts wakka chakka wakka wakka woh" -- Spooky, describing Mech Tau

"You can of course make a list that attempts to work via fragility and easy VP donation and Pathfinders fit into that just fine." -- kai
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Old 03 Apr 2005, 06:24   #6 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: RTT Report.

I'm curious as to your strategies on how to beat this ^-^, castling is a pet hate of mine but something we have to deal with, when there isnt a convenient objective to draw him off how do you deal? unload and out range him and try to get rid of the las and missiles?.

shooty marines seem to be a big problem in the ever moronicly simple pitched battle ^-^
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Old 03 Apr 2005, 11:28   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
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Default Re: RTT Report.

Nice report and nice job. I can feel your pain with what happened with the eldar - the last RTT I played in I blew game 3 against some Dark Angels by being stupid and getting within assault range of some assault termies; they then steam-rolled over the rest of my army. I went from being on track for a solid victory to giving up a victorious slaughter in 2 turns. :-[ It sounds like you had a good time and had some cool missions to deal with.

I would agree that smartly played super-shooty marines are the bane of the list but their pretty much the bane of any list - 6 tactical squads each with a PG/LC plus a set of ML devastators (just fill in the rest with a librarian and some counter-assault stuff plus a few assault canons) is a lot of very accurate fire power that's very difficult to beat. Those are the kinds of armies, when played well, that win tournaments easily - luckily for the rest of us most people aren't willing to play that army (it's pretty boring) or don't have a clue how to use it to do well.
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Old 03 Apr 2005, 12:47   #8 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: RTT Report.

great games, 3 wins 1 loss, not bad! but how did your kroot pass a leadership test with LD 3? and also, this is slightly off topic but is there like a codex for a kroot mercenary list or is there like a mercenary codex?
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Old 03 Apr 2005, 15:54   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: RTT Report.

Nice reports Tonka! Good reads all around. I really am surprised someone fielded Kroot. They really don't stand chances against almost any army that has a vehicle. I love the Kroot and would build my own Kroot Merc army, but I think after game after game of total whipe outs, it would be disheartening. Oh well. Poor Krootzies!

KILLAELITE132:

Yes, there is a Kroot Merc codex, from Chapter Approved 2004. It's available for free from the UK GW website in their chapter approved section via PDF.
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Old 03 Apr 2005, 16:30   #10 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: RTT Report.

Eviscerators are actually a halfway decent anti-tank weapon, especially when you put a Master Shaper in a squad of 20 Carnivores + 20 Hounds with fleet. That's 8 Eviscerator attacks in a 40 model unit that has Ld 10. The real problem is against Skimmers where you need 6's to hit. A (mounted?) Shaper Council with a few melta-guns would have done him good against me...

Dealing with shooty Marines... it's this quandry that led me to the "No LoS" concept that I started a thread on a while back. The problem though is that this list concept would suck against everything but shooty Marines! You can't rely heavily on Crisis Suits since you really can't depend on terrain, and there are enough insta-death weapons to keep you bottled up behind cover. You can't rely on Hammerheads since there are enough anti-tank weapons to make short work of them by turn 2. Stealths would work well, but one lucky spotting distance roll by a Dev squad and they're toast.

Broadsides with large numbers of Shield Drones (perhaps an attached Aun with HW SD's?) would be effective I think, if only as a fire-sink. A properly deployed large unit of Kroot (perhaps with Anghkor Prok?) would be effective, especially if you could get a charge off. They would have the same problem with an assault unit rampaging through their lines as we do. If the Kroot were able to finish off one squad on the charge and tie up another for a turn or two, you could take that chance to pop out of cover and blast 'em hard and fast with your shooty stuff while their shooty stuff was tied up with Kroot. Of course they'd eventually whittle you down and react with an assault unit of their own, but with some luck, 20 Kroot + Hounds could give you a brief respite from a few LasCannons. The big reason I don't usually charge with my Kroot is their I3. The Marines can put a serious dent in your unit before you get a single swing in. The cool thing about Hounds is their I4. So when you charge with Kroot + Hounds, your Hounds go simultaneously with their attacks and then when the Marines inflict casualties, you remove the Hounds, so that way every model in your unit gets all their attacks in!

So yeah. I don't really have an answer. It would take a well designed list, probably a few units that are traditionally shunned in true Mech armies (a few Broadsides and Kroot Hounds), some luck with the terrain at the table, and a very shrewd commander.
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"i like to think of playing against my list as being like punching jelly. you put all your effort in but it just moves out of the way and you cause no damage. then your arm is covered in jelly. and the chicks come out and start wrestling in the jelly, and i drink a beer with stone cold steve austin, and we watch the chicks jelly wrestling, and then the slap-bass funk starts wakka chakka wakka wakka woh" -- Spooky, describing Mech Tau

"You can of course make a list that attempts to work via fragility and easy VP donation and Pathfinders fit into that just fine." -- kai
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