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carbines vs rifles?
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Old 16 Nov 2007, 12:42   #1 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default carbines vs rifles?

are carbines worth it? chance to pin and a little more mobility but losing the rapid fire shots. ive struggled with this and so far when ive battled ive taken 4 carbines and 8 rifles in my firewarrior squads.
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Old 16 Nov 2007, 13:13   #2 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: carbines vs rifles?

Welcome to TO but you might want to clean up your post a bit. Capitalize some things, apostrophes here and there...

I have my squad set up the same way you have yours, so I have nothing to comment really. I've heard of some people taking whole squads of carbines to pin the enemy squad and have a full squad of rifles to shoot them to heck. Sort of a "Anvil and Hammer" sort of thing.
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Old 16 Nov 2007, 13:27   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: carbines vs rifles?

This is the most recent thread on the topic.
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Old 16 Nov 2007, 13:41   #4 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: carbines vs rifles?

Ah the Eternal Rifle VS Carbine dilemma.

Well it really depends on what yuo wish to do with your Fire Warrior:

For long range static tau: go rifle. The fact that it has 6" of extra range over most of your enemy's gun is great and it's one of the rare guns that can shoot down light armoured tank/transport. and since you are static you don't care about the fact that Rapid fire force you to either shoot or assault.

For the Kauyon tactic in which you are drawing your enemy closer, then one squad of carbine for every 2 or rifle is a good mix. Don't expect the pinning to succeed though (people are notorious for succeeding that leadership test)

For Fish of Fury carbine could be a good option, especially since you expect to lock your opponent in CC (I don't recommend it though), because you are usually closer to his line.

Now as for mixing Carbine and rifle in the same squad, I personally don't recommend it for various reason (but feel free to disregard them):
1- The range difference: The rifle and carbine have a range difference of 12" if you don't move (6" in favor of the carbine if you do move IIRC). So in a mix squad you will rarely have all 12 FW shooting together...Less shot = potentially less dead enemy.

2- The type difference (Rapid fire VS Assault). If you want ot use the rifle at full efficiency, you must not move, or you won't be able to use it at maximum range. and you must decide to either shoot or assault, but you can't do both. Which is a problem you don't encounter with assault weapon. So if you wish to assault your opponent (A desperate last chance move) only the mmember in the sqaud with the carbine could shoot and assault. Those with rifle would have to either forgo the shooting phase or assault phase...making your squad trouly inefficiant in both.

3- Pinning: Like I said before. For the number of time that it will actually going to succeed, you are better off with a full 12 man sqaud with carbine that way one of them might get lucky andf be able to pin the advancing squad...but there are unit out there who can't be pinned so...

I think it's pretty much all. On the plus side the carbine and rifle have the same Strength and AP and both option are free so that's 2 factor you don't need to consider.

Hope it helps a bit.
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Old 16 Nov 2007, 14:11   #5 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: carbines vs rifles?

DON'T put different weapons in the same squads!!!!

Whether you take carbines or rifles depends on what you want to do.

I prefer to take rifles because of longer range, but carbines would be better against low leadership armies. (not tyranids, they can't be pinned.)

Overall its personal preference, carbines are arguably better at mobile attacks
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Old 16 Nov 2007, 15:15   #6 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: carbines vs rifles?

I think my next time out i am going to try seperating those carbines into a seperate squad. Maybe use them to draw in the enemy. >
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Old 16 Nov 2007, 15:25   #7 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: carbines vs rifles?

'Nids can't be pinned? How's that?
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Old 16 Nov 2007, 15:51   #8 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: carbines vs rifles?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Va'Ukos
'Nids can't be pinned? How's that?
When in synapse range.
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Old 16 Nov 2007, 16:52   #9 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: carbines vs rifles?

I agree with Boneguard save for on the issue of mixing them in a squad. I generally field two different types of FW squads - static and mobile. My static FWs have two carbines in a squad of twelve for when enemy models inevitably get close enough (I primarily play against Eldar, so that can happen pretty fast) and for that chance to pin. My mobile squad is mounted in a Devilfish for Fish of Fury attacks and has four carbines and eight rifles - the extra 6" of the carbine can come in real handy when only part of the target unit is in rapid fire range. and those chances to pin can really come in handy vs. Eldar, especially with some Markerlight help...
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Old 16 Nov 2007, 17:56   #10 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: carbines vs rifles?

I find that leaving minimalist foot-slogging fire warrios with carbines behind some LOS blocking terrain is a nice little back up force for anything that deepstrikes or gets back your main defenceses. It can also be good for capturing points, as it can move in towards the point and continue to shoot at the leftovers of squads you have already damaged.

Overall, however, I'd have to say I prefer the rifle. The range is very nice for static fire power, and a markerlight can be equiped to the leader, if you're not moving around all the time. In addition, it's generally better at close range, as well, due to its rapid-fire. FOF is a lot less effective with carbines.
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