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Will I ever play a tournament?
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 05:01   #1 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Will I ever play a tournament?

Okay, when I started playing the Tau I never heard of the "what you see is what you get rule" so I assembled every one of my models just to look cool. Like every one of my crisis suits has different weapons (some have all four harpoints taken up). I converted one of my firewarriors with a cool burst cannon, but apparently I cant use him in a real game. Lots of my guys would be illegal in a tournament. Since I have so many "not practical models" will I ever play in a tournament?
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 05:10   #2 (permalink)
Kroot Warrior
 
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Default Re: Will I ever play a tournament?

It depends on what kind of tournament. Most official GW tourneys will generally enforce WYSIWYG rules, though small discrepancies will usually be overlooked unless you have a really competitive/anal opponent.

Having a different weapon load-out than what is actually in your list will probably not fly anywhere except in friendly games, however.

A good option is to magnetize the vehicles/models you use. That way, you can switch weapons, upgrades, support systems, etc, for every game you play. You can get a lot of rare-earth magnets for less than 20 bucks, and it just takes a little bit of drilling/gluing to make a lot of modular models.

Sorry, but if you want to play in tournaments, you'll probably need to get the debonder and redo some of your models. Good luck!
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 06:58   #3 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Will I ever play a tournament?

Quote:
Originally Posted by moomeyer
Okay, when I started playing the Tau I never heard of the "what you see is what you get rule" so I assembled every one of my models just to look cool. Like every one of my crisis suits has different weapons (some have all four harpoints taken up). I converted one of my firewarriors with a cool burst cannon, but apparently I cant use him in a real game. Lots of my guys would be illegal in a tournament. Since I have so many "not practical models" will I ever play in a tournament?
If you`ll ever play in tournaments depends on the amount of work you`re willing to invest into your army. As it stands, it is illegal in most tournaments, and I know alot of people who would also refuse to play friendly games agains you (I would, too), because it is just too confusing to remember in the heat of the battle what your Crisis are armed with. You can`t expect your opponent to deal with this AND fight your army

Besides, WYSIWYG is been featured quite prominetly through the Rulebook, and it is also mentioned in the Codex - did you build your models before reading through the compelte Codex and/or Rulebook? In any case, a bad idea.
I`d suggest you try to tear off the weapon (which shouldn´t be too hard, as long as you didn`t dip the whole model into plastic glue), and magnetize your suits - this way, they are kept flexible.

Cheers,
-Bone
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 08:36   #4 (permalink)
Kai
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Default Re: Will I ever play a tournament?

* Disclaimer: The opinions about tournaments expressed in this post are solely those of the post author. They are formed from bad past personal experiences, some when he was working for the store and running tournaments. Do NOT use this a a spring board to launch to the defence of tournaments, especially if you play in them. There is no need to defend your passtime, I respect it and hope you enjoy it. You have better things to do than argue with me. *

I don't see why you care about playing in tournaments; the thought of spending hours arguing over minor discrepancies in the rules with a novelty sized guy with poor personal hygiene, fielding an army of models painted the minimum of three colours and trying to convince me if I can't fit a tape measure past something I can't have line of sight... lets just say this is firmly engraved in my mind an experience I've never wanted to repeat.

I've never liked 40k when it becomes that competitive, and tournaments seem to bring out the arsehole in everyone.

Everyone else is right though, you should at least have your weapons configurations right (Personally I would be lenient on support systems, especially because no one cares if you say 'he doesn't have that really&#39 and GW has done a great job of trying to provide enough parts to make different weapon set ups and swaps easier over the last few years (which saves us time and money).

As for the firewarrior with the burst cannon. I think you'd get away with 'counts as pulse carbine' in friendlies at least, but if you want to use him with a burst cannon then thats just silly, illegal and you should have known better if you'd read your codex.
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 09:38   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Will I ever play a tournament?

I wouldn't bother to play tournaments or any of these other people who won't let you use it unless its on the model!

Who looks that closely at an opponents model to see if a grenade is represented or not anyway!
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 12:11   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Will I ever play a tournament?

ok u must have some legal models that dude with a burst i really think u should just smash him boom he he anyway whats that guy above said if they got the rong gun ud notice but some sets dont give u enough grenades as the SM assault squad only has 3 not 5 u dont need to spend like 15£ or $ for 2 grenades
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 18:13   #7 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Will I ever play a tournament?

Quote:
Originally Posted by StaffordGames
I wouldn't bother to play tournaments or any of these other people who won't let you use it unless its on the model!

Who looks that closely at an opponents model to see if a grenade is represented or not anyway!
Grenades are specifically excempt from WYSIWYG, at least according to the BB (IIRC).

Demanding strict WYSIWYG (or at least when it comes to weapons) might seem overly rules-lawyerish, but fact is - it is a more relaxed game if you can SEE what you`re dealing with. I remember a Hammerhead that looked like a Devilfish once... <shudder>

There is nothing more disturbing during a game than when you suddenly realize the Plasma-Burst Cannon Suit that just jumped next to your Land Raider is in reality equipped with TL Fusion Blasters.

Yes, gaming should be fun. But it IS not fun if I have to remember that every model in the enemy army is not equipped as it looks like. It is common courtesy to make the game as uncomplicated (and thus as fun) as possible for your opponent.

I could write hours about this, but I have a cinema to catch right now, so maybe later more...

Cheers,
-Bone
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 18:20   #8 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Will I ever play a tournament?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kai
I don't see why you care about playing in tournaments; the thought of spending hours arguing over minor discrepancies in the rules with a novelty sized guy with poor personal hygiene, fielding an army of models painted the minimum of three colours and trying to convince me if I can't fit a tape measure past something I can't have line of sight... lets just say this is firmly engraved in my mind an experience I've never wanted to repeat.

I've never liked 40k when it becomes that competitive, and tournaments seem to bring out the D'yime in everyone.
True and valid, course not only true for Tournaments, most of the rules lawyers and anal players I've gone up against have been outside of tournaments. It's a sad reality that pick up games are a toss up, you might get a good opponent, you might not. This is why I prefere picking my games more carefully and playing campaigns instead of tournaments, where I can usually pick my opponents much more than I could in a tournament.

Quote:
Everyone else is right though, you should at least have your weapons configurations right (Personally I would be lenient on support systems, especially because no one cares if you say 'he doesn't have that really&#39 and GW has done a great job of trying to provide enough parts to make different weapon set ups and swaps easier over the last few years (which saves us time and money).
Another valid point, and as a lot of people have said as well. Basically WYSIWYG is not just GW being anal, it's also a courtesy to your opponent. Especially if the opponent doesn't know your army very well then it can be extremely unsportsmanlike to expect your opponent to keep track of what your army is really equipped with and personally it really isn't that hard with Tau to remedy the problem. Tear off the extra equipment and put a bit of work into making your force at least mostly WYSIWYG legal, not just to participate in tournaments, but as a simple courtesy to your opponents. And personally it's not much fun to face an opponent whose army is not WYSIWYG legal, for me it makes me feel like an insult, that my opponent can't take the time to properly build his army, especially if it's a sizeable force and he/she has had it for a while. The mistakes of a new gamer are one thing though and can easily be remedied with a little time and elbow greese.

Quote:
As for the firewarrior with the burst cannon. I think you'd get away with 'counts as pulse carbine' in friendlies at least, but if you want to use him with a burst cannon then thats just silly, illegal and you should have known better if you'd read your codex.
I've personally done that to two Firewarriors as part of my "Kill Team" and I've made house rules for them. The squad uses the upgraded BS of the Etherial Honor Guard, has a mandatory Devilfish and the shas'ui pays for a pair of pulse pistols instead of a rifle or carbine. I only use the squad in games of over 2000 points and only after asking my opponent of course. It's a very fun squad to use, not because it's very effective, far from it the extremely pricey unit usually tears into the enemy before being shredded ingloriously, but it's still fun and the work of the conversions and the paint scheme usually get more than a little admiration from onlooker and opponent alike. Such things can be very fun, but one must also keep the practical aspect in mind. The two Firewarriors I modified to have Burst Cannons are the 11th and 12th Tau in the team, and easily dropped from the squad to make it legal, and the shas'ui has a Pulse Carbine strapped under his backpack to use him legally with the pistols relegated to an aesthetic value alone and those simple practical considerations allow the squad to serve as both a tournament WYSIWYG legal unit, and as a fun and fluffy Kill Team or Veteran Shock Team when in a less competetive environ.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tau hunter
ok u must have some legal models that dude with a burst i really think u should just smash him boom he he anyway whats that guy above said if they got the rong gun ud notice but some sets dont give u enough grenades as the SM assault squad only has 3 not 5 u dont need to spend like 15£ or $ for 2 grenades
I see you are new to the forum, however that is not acceptable posting quality, please read the forum rules and use proper grammar and spelling. This is not a chat room and "u" is not a word. The rules are there for a reason, many members do not speak english as their native language, for the sake of everyone on the board and to fascilitate constructive posting at least a modicum of proper grammar, punctuation and spelling are required.

"Ok you must have some legal models. That dude with a burst cannon, I really think you should just smash him. What that guy above said if they got the wrong gun you'd notice but some sets don't give you enough grenades as the SM assault squad only has 3 and not 5 Melta Bombs, you don't need to spend like 15 dollars for 2 grenades."

That is an example of what you could have said to make more sense, and "boom he he" is not constructive, helpful or amusing. This is a forum for serious and constructive discussions and the requirements of the forum are high, the members of the forum are expected to produce quality posts, and as you can see, they do. It is an insult to them to believe it ok to post with a lesser quality.

This is a warning and reminder to everyone, swearing, leet speak, spam, these are all against the forum rules and the tolerance for such breaches are by necessity having to be lowered by the entire janitor... I mean mod staff, who would rather not spend their time having to punish members when patience and the spell check can avert it.
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 19:18   #9 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Will I ever play a tournament?

Just pull the weapons off and remount them(I'd recommend magnetizing them so you can change setups between tourney's/games). If you're carefull you should be able to remove the weapons without causing significant damage to the weapons and/or model. Any damage that is caused can be fixed with files, sand paper, and/or green stuff.
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 19:47   #10 (permalink)
Kroot Warrior
 
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Default Re: Will I ever play a tournament?

Actually, you can buy debonder that will loosen/dissolve plastic glue and super glue without ripping or deforming the plastic. It's great for taking apart someone else's models! :-)
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