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Pathfinder core as a base for "Covert Ops cadres"? Could this work?
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Old 18 Jun 2007, 20:37   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Pathfinder core as a base for "Covert Ops cadres"? Could this work?

***Sits by a tree***

Heya everyone! As many of you might know. I like pathfinders. IMO they have numerous modeling ways, assume basing/camo possibilities and have fluff that almost mesmerize me, They are pretty much a "comando-like" force in TAU. I mean what can't they do? They have special weapons, they can carry heavy weapons as well as assult ones, they've got grenades, enhanced transport, marker lights and cool looks. I mean the only thing they can't do is fight in HtH... but TAU are handicapped by nature so I am not all that disappointed...

BUT thax to GW, these guys didn't get a lot love... any love that they have is mainly based either cool looks or static/hybrid lists. Mech Tau usually leave without them... So I wanted to try something weird. -> A Pathfinder Core... well am I drunk again? Perhaps... but hear me out anyway ;D

So hears the idea. Take 2 pathfinder squads... Before I'll have to dodge the hail storm of bricks that will be thrown at me... I'll say what I want to try.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------->
Assume that we took 3 pathfinders squad.

Ok for the path finders themselves ->

3 X 8 man squads with Rail Rifles. 378 points... That will give us 9 rail slugs and 15 lights. Railslugs can pick any target, Lights can pick 3 separate targets.

Now for their fishes. Unfortunately, they can't be used as "taxi cabs" (stupid dedicated transport rules >_&lt. So the can be used as->
Seeker carriers -> For 3 of those (decoys + 2 seekers) we'll have to pay... 315...
Looks like an over priced sky ray to me...
Warfishes standart way -> 360... thats a lot...
738 points...
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------->

If two squads would be taken...
Then price drops to 492... For normal games I found this as an optimal variation.

So lets see what is possible to build around such core...
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------->
By exploding Tonka's MI we can try to build something like "Covert Ops" Cadre.

Putting down 492 points as core.
Now adding basics

For Troops we can take 4 squads of FW armed with Rifles. or 2 with rifles 2 with carbines. That will cost us 240 points.

With "Centurion/Aurora (which one is with PR/CIB ?) commander that makes another 100 points.

For the rest we can by 5 man Stealth Squad. Or 3 man stealth and 1 Sniper drone Team. The later variation will bump us over 1000 point limit by 2 points...

----------------------------------------------------------------------->

Now we can keep adding XV25 and snipers/XV88s until we will get to the 1500.

As a summery -> This type of cadre should have high nubmer of Rail rifles, marker lights and pulse rounds. With stealth units as a secondary line, main targets will be FW/Pathfinder core. Two Warfishes can aid to block enemy units as well as tank shock them.

In conclusion -> I understand it isn't exactly overcompedetive. It is built with fluff in mind. However, IMO, it shouldn't lose every single battle as well. Note that Stealth Core can be substituted for XV8 deepstriking core. Since We can have re-rollable scatter dice + position relay array.

First tell me what you think.
Second tell me is it possible to improve it.

Also its just an idea. I don't think I will ever use it, just a thought that I decided to share with you guys.

Walk Tall everyone!!!!!
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Old 18 Jun 2007, 21:06   #2 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Pathfinder core as a base for "Covert Ops cadres"? Could this work?

Interesting idea. Christ knows how it'd perform, though.

Also, wouldn't Kroot be a characterful addition? What with their fieldcraft stuff and all they'd be pretty good in a stealth force, at least where forests/jungles are concerned.
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Old 19 Jun 2007, 03:33   #3 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Pathfinder core as a base for "Covert Ops cadres"? Could this work?

I don't see any heavy support....
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Old 19 Jun 2007, 04:33   #4 (permalink)
Tyr
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Default Re: Pathfinder core as a base for "Covert Ops cadres"? Could this work?

I think he is using seekers as his "heavy choice". Still a sky ray would be nice as it is even more markerlights (so stays with that particular theme) and is a support vessel for the "stealthy" army.
Also I think your pathfinder devilfish will attract a fair amount of Anti tank fire. AV 13 is nice and sky rays are cheap.
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Old 19 Jun 2007, 04:50   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Pathfinder core as a base for "Covert Ops cadres"? Could this work?

... Seriously, before you guys post how about reading?

Heavy support are XV88 & Sniper Drone Teams.

Would someone give analysis of this idea from efficiency VS -particular opponent-?

P.S. This cadre might be fun if mounted on Orca. 3 warfishes cost almost as much as Orca, and then 3 pathfinder teams can be taken. List would be mainly compoused out of 3 pathfinders teams, XV25s, Snipers, Commander & XV88s...
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Old 19 Jun 2007, 05:43   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Pathfinder core as a base for "Covert Ops cadres"? Could this work?

Hmm. If I were you I wouldn't expect to win playing this. You would probably get massacred. There seems to be little to no anti Teq in your list, exept for railguns. So a Terminator Heavy army would put the hurt on your list.

Against Horde armies, I think your list would do just fine.
Against Meq Armies, you have a lot of AP3 Weapons, So you could easily take out one of these list.
Against Teq Armies, You would get owned, Your only hope would be your commander and plasma on your Broadsides
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Old 19 Jun 2007, 05:48   #7 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: Pathfinder core as a base for "Covert Ops cadres"? Could this work?

Meq's would not fair well with this list.

Fun idea, good job.
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Old 19 Jun 2007, 11:51   #8 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Pathfinder core as a base for "Covert Ops cadres"? Could this work?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Red_dog
Assume that we took 3 pathfinders squad.

Ok for the path finders themselves ->

3 X 8 man squads with Rail Rifles. 378 points... That will give us 9 rail slugs and 15 lights. Railslugs can pick any target, Lights can pick 3 separate targets.

Now for their fishes. Unfortunately, they can't be used as "taxi cabs" (stupid dedicated transport rules >_&lt. So the can be used as->
Seeker carriers -> For 3 of those (decoys + 2 seekers) we'll have to pay... 315...
Looks like an over priced sky ray to me...
Warfishes standart way -> 360... thats a lot...
738 points...
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------->
short version, three squads will run him at least 650ish points. He'll need to blow about 100 pts more on an HQ, and pick up at least one firewarrior team.

Quote:
For Troops we can take 4 squads of FW armed with Rifles. or 2 with rifles 2 with carbines. That will cost us 240 points.

With "Centurion/Aurora (which one is with PR/CIB ?) commander that makes another 100 points.
So, roughly 1k points and counting.

Quote:
For the rest we can by 5 man Stealth Squad. Or 3 man stealth and 1 Sniper drone Team. The later variation will bump us over 1000 point limit by 2 points...
Unless you're only taking 2 pf squads, you're already over. A five man stealth team runs a minimum of 150 more. At 1500, you're looking at having three DFs, and around 50 infantry on the board. Not a huge model count. The more seekers and stuff you throw at it, the lower it will be.

Minimally sized fw teams get less out of ml hits than full ones. In fact, you really have nothing that takes good advantage of these ML hits.

Quote:
In conclusion -> I understand it isn't exactly overcompedetive. It is built with fluff in mind. However, IMO, it shouldn't lose every single battle as well. Note that Stealth Core can be substituted for XV8 deepstriking core. Since We can have re-rollable scatter dice + position relay array.
Posit relay, pathfinder centric, minimally sized unmounted firewarrior squads with carbines, and heavilly under utilized heavy and elite choices.

You will die horribly. Think about it. What do you have for armor 14? Perhaps a single broadside if you managed to squeeze one in? You can't possibly have all the stuff you listed, and fusions are not sufficient as the only form of heavy armor busting, due to limited range. How will you deal with terminators? swarms? The only thing this list is even marginally good at is meqs, and that's only due to the rail rifles.
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Old 19 Jun 2007, 14:45   #9 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Pathfinder core as a base for "Covert Ops cadres"? Could this work?

I like the idea and one that I've been exploring, though not as extreme as yours!

With all those Pathfinders and homing beacon equipped DF, one thing to consider is to use parts of a Deep-Striking Tau army.

You can field a commander with a positional relay and TLMP for relatively cheap, which would allow you to pick and choose when a deep strike would occur. Then build your force around our deep strike capable units, like Pirahnas and Sunforge equipped Crisis suits. Have a team of Helios suits on standby prepared to counterstrike any Terminators that land. The Positional Relay, again, let's you delay the Crisis Teams until the best time to strike.

The list below is ~1500 points and has 5 deep strike capable units, with 3 Warfish, 2 Sniper teams and 24 pulse weapons on the board. The Kroot are there to hopefully push off enemy infiltrators and/or sit on a piece of nice terrain until the seeker salvos pound on enemy positions. One thing I dropped was the Rail Rifles on the PFs. With 2 sniper teams, my thought was that we had too many rail rifles and not enough Markerlights/seeker launchers on the board.

My suggestion:

HQ
Crisis w/ Positional Relay and TLMP.

Elites:
Crisis Suit w/ TLFB and Flamer
Crisis Suit w/ TLFB and Flamer
3 Helios suits (for counter-striking Termie teleporters)

Troops:
8 FWs w/ Warfish
16 Kroot

Fast Attack:
8 Pathfinders w/ Warfish w/ 2 Seekers
8 Pathfinders w/ Warfish w/ 2 Seekers
2 Pirahnas w/ FB w/ 2 Seekers (more deep striking tank bustin' goodness)

Hvy Support:
2 Sniper Teams

The list also has the added advantage of being fluffy! Kroot and Pathfinders are out scouting when they encounter an enemy force. The pathfinders first try to neutralize the threat with sniper and their own seeker fire, but then call in tank-buster Sunforges to take out tanks since Rail Guns are not available on this front. Then the Helios rapid strike team is deployed to smash any of the toughest opposition.
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Old 19 Jun 2007, 16:35   #10 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Pathfinder core as a base for "Covert Ops cadres"? Could this work?

Firstly i love pathfinders... they are just the best fast attack in the army. But still. I dont think this list will work in any way. Maybe giving the enemy some large losses but nothing more...

Secondly.... Whats a warfish??? I know its a devilfish but i have no clue to setup...
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