Tau Empire Codex 2013 | Army Builder Program
Dark Angels Codex 2013
Chaos Daemons Codex 2013
Chaos Space Marines Codex 2012

Warhammer 40k Forum Tau Online

 

Warhammer 40K Forum

Tau Sniper
Reply
Old 13 Apr 2007, 14:59   #1 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
Shas_O Andrew's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 345
Default Tau Sniper

Why doesn't the Tau include a an Elite Sniper unit like the Imperial Guard?
Shas_O Andrew is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 Apr 2007, 15:18   #2 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: South West Florida
Posts: 321
Default Re: Tau Sniper

Fluff reason , it's not part of their tactical doctrine ( although it is starting to change with the addition of Sniper Drones ).

Real reason , to make sure Tau are not just a IG army with a alien theme and game balance .

Just think of how powerful a Tau sniper unit would be. If based on Pathfinders there would be 4 to 8 models with rail rifles , add marker light support and you have a very nasty unit that can hit on 2+ , wound MEQs on a 2+ , is Ap 3 so no armor saves for the majority of infantry models in the game , and is a pinning weapon ( which can be futher boosted by marker lights ).
__________________
Let them hate , so long as they fear. -Accius

I am your lighted way and I am your darkest day. -Godsmack
Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 Apr 2007, 15:20   #3 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 2,920
Default Re: Tau Sniper

Because the Tau are not Imperial Guard, and we have sniper drones in the heavy slot already.
scoutfox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 Apr 2007, 16:40   #4 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Denmark, home of vikings
Posts: 245
Send a message via MSN to webkilla
Default Re: Tau Sniper

ya - cheap pts for 3 TL sniper rifles, a markerlight AND cloaking

so loving it
__________________
http://psitech.comicgen.com - my NSFW (NC-17... we got teh naughty) webcomic
webkilla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 Apr 2007, 17:43   #5 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
The Orange's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,208
Default Re: Tau Sniper

Why would you wan't snipers. Sniper Drones kick arse. Forget pitiful sniper weapons that only wound on a 4+ and leave your enemy with thier armor save. Hit them with sniper drones that they can bearly see, and who are more likely to do a lot of damage.
__________________
The Orange is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 Apr 2007, 18:00   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: San Jose, California
Posts: 1,269
Send a message via AIM to Tralfagar Send a message via MSN to Tralfagar Send a message via Yahoo to Tralfagar
Default Re: Tau Sniper

As stated,
Reason 1) We aren't the IG, nor part of the Imperium of Man. We jut happen to have a use for the disposable people who breed like rabbits...I menan IG ;D .
Reason 2) IIRC, the snipers have a 1/3*(insert armor save chance) chance of causing a wound. The Rail Rifle has somewhere between 15/36 and 25/36 chance of wounding a MEq, pending how high of a BS you put from Markerlights. Between BS 3 and BS 5.
Reason 3) Compared to a Sniper's chance to penetrate armor, we have 5/36 greater chance to hit AV 12.

That's all I can think of at the moment, but based on those, I'd much rather have the Rail Rifles than Sniper Rifles in my army.

Thank you Trogdor ;D
__________________
Home-Brewed
Tau Mercenary Rubric(Deadnight)
Warhammer 40k d10 Edition(Wargamer)
Codex: Farsight Enclaves(me)

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeekyGator
The divide between what gets put up on an art gallery and what gets you thrown in jail is mostly dependent on the quality of the frame, even though both are just as good for fapping.
Tralfagar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 Apr 2007, 19:50   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Germany
Posts: 750
Default Re: Tau Sniper

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tralfagar
As stated,
Reason 1) We aren't the IG, nor part of the Imperium of Man. We jut happen to have a use for the disposable people who breed like rabbits...I menan IG ;D .
Reason 2) IIRC, the snipers have a 1/3*(insert armor save chance) chance of causing a wound. The Rail Rifle has somewhere between 15/36 and 25/36 chance of wounding a MEq, pending how high of a BS you put from Markerlights. Between BS 3 and BS 5.
Reason 3) Compared to a Sniper's chance to penetrate armor, we have 1/12 greater chance to hit AV 12.

That's all I can think of at the moment, but based on those, I'd much rather have the Rail Rifles than Sniper Rifles in my army.
Not quite: Against AV 12 the sniperrifle needs a double 6 (1/36), the railrifle needs only a 6 (1/6).

When taking the roll to hit in accord, the chances are:
Railrifle (BS3 asumed): 1/12

Sniperrifle: 5/216~1/43,2

The sniperrifle is practically useless, the railrifle a valid option (not near as good as the missilepod, though).

And for killing a marine:

Railrifle: 5/12

Sniperrifle: 5/36

So the railrifle is 3 times better than the sniperrifle in killing marines and 3,6 times better in popping vehicles. And the railrifle can be beefed up with markerlights....

Only thing sniperrifles beat railrifles in: Killing targets with T5+ and an armor of 2+
And then still the sniperrifle has a lame 5/72 chance to kill....

ERGO: Railrifle top, sniperrifle flop.
__________________
Gamestatistics ΄07:

[WHFB] Dwarfs
9 victorious slaughters/ 7wins/ 5 draws/ 7 losses

[WH40k] Tau
17victorious slaughters/ 10wins/ 2draw/ 1 loss
Trogdor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 Apr 2007, 06:37   #8 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 6,130
Default Re: Tau Sniper

Sniper rifles are awesome at dealing with high toughness models, though, like greater deamons. Against such a target, rail rifles would be significantly less effective. Also, more importantly, snipers are reasonably cheap. Ratlings are as expensive as fws with photon grenades, and while being 0-1 does suck...they dont eat heavy slots.

In short, both have their advantages, neither is "better" overall, and they're distinctly different.
__________________
Latest Project: Game Design Forums. Register now to get a low user ID, or reserve a forum for your own project.

My various opinions and tacticas, in article form: Ad clicks always appreciated.

Latest article topic: Video game design

Best free webhost Ive found yet: http://www.ultrawebsitehosting.com/2353.html
Tyndmyr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 Apr 2007, 13:32   #9 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Somewhereshire
Posts: 6,214
Send a message via MSN to Ravager
Default Re: Tau Sniper

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trogdor
Only thing sniperrifles beat railrifles in: Killing targets with T5+ and an armor of 2+
And then still the sniperrifle has a lame 5/72 chance to kill....
I'd like to point out a few things wrong with that statement.

Sniper Rifles do not become better at wounding until we get to T7. Rail Rifle will wound T6 on a 4+, equivalent to a Sniper Rifle. At T7 a Rail Rifle wounds on a 5+, slightly worse than the Sniper Rifle's 4+. This statement assumes we are firing at a target with a save of 3+ or worse.

Mathhammer
0.416• (30/72) chance to wound T5 2+ with any Sniper Rifle. 0.0694• (5/72) chance to kill T5 2+ with a Sniper Rifle.
0.333• (24/72) chance to wound T5 2+ with an unguided Rail Rifle. 0.055• (4/72) chance to kill T5 2+ with an unguided Rail Rifle.
0.444• (32/72) chance to wound T5 2+ with a Rail Rifle with effective BS 4. 0.0740• (11/144) chance to kill T5 2+ with a +1BS Rail Rifle.

An unsupported Rail Rifle fares worse than a standard Sniper Rifle, however this is can be changed by the addition of a single markerlight. (We'll assume you use a Sniper Drone Team for your rifles, and that the spotter's light hit). We must also take into account that the above maths only take into account 2+ save high toughness models. Against any other model, with a save pf 3+ or worse, and toughness 6 or less the Rail Rifle is clearly the better option.

Also, the Rail Rifle is an excellent tool for destroying light vehicles, transports with AV 11 or less, or Fast, Non-Tank, Skimmers of most types.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by CmdrBonesaw
"Drop the shovel, and stand back from the keyboard!"


We have done the impossible... and that makes us mighty.
Firefly is pretty much made of Awesome, Funny, and Aww. Sometimes simultaneously. We'd better stop before we quote the entire script.
–tvtropes.org
Ravager is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 Apr 2007, 15:34   #10 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 6,130
Default Re: Tau Sniper

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ravager Zero
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trogdor
Only thing sniperrifles beat railrifles in: Killing targets with T5+ and an armor of 2+
And then still the sniperrifle has a lame 5/72 chance to kill....
I'd like to point out a few things wrong with that statement.

Sniper Rifles do not become better at wounding until we get to T7. Rail Rifle will wound T6 on a 4+, equivalent to a Sniper Rifle. At T7 a Rail Rifle wounds on a 5+, slightly worse than the Sniper Rifle's 4+. This statement assumes we are firing at a target with a save of 3+ or worse.

Mathhammer
0.416• (30/72) chance to wound T5 2+ with any Sniper Rifle. 0.0694• (5/72) chance to kill T5 2+ with a Sniper Rifle.
0.333• (24/72) chance to wound T5 2+ with an unguided Rail Rifle. 0.055• (4/72) chance to kill T5 2+ with an unguided Rail Rifle.
0.444• (32/72) chance to wound T5 2+ with a Rail Rifle with effective BS 4. 0.0740• (11/144) chance to kill T5 2+ with a +1BS Rail Rifle.

An unsupported Rail Rifle fares worse than a standard Sniper Rifle, however this is can be changed by the addition of a single markerlight. (We'll assume you use a Sniper Drone Team for your rifles, and that the spotter's light hit). We must also take into account that the above maths only take into account 2+ save high toughness models. Against any other model, with a save pf 3+ or worse, and toughness 6 or less the Rail Rifle is clearly the better option.

Also, the Rail Rifle is an excellent tool for destroying light vehicles, transports with AV 11 or less, or Fast, Non-Tank, Skimmers of most types.
Yeah, but rail rifles only have BS3...what do sniper rifles hit on again...twos? Assuming that the spotters ML hits is optimistic, and lets not forget the cost.

A sniper team will thus get you three rail rifles, while the same points cost can grab you seven ratlings(sniper rifles). They lack the handy dandy stealth field, but volume compensates for many things.
__________________
Latest Project: Game Design Forums. Register now to get a low user ID, or reserve a forum for your own project.

My various opinions and tacticas, in article form: Ad clicks always appreciated.

Latest article topic: Video game design

Best free webhost Ive found yet: http://www.ultrawebsitehosting.com/2353.html
Tyndmyr is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Tau Sniper Team (Spotter/Sniper) Conversion (Fire Warriors with Devilfish Bitz) Shadowclaimer Conversion 11 01 Jan 2010 21:23
Sniper fex Biotitan Painting 3 02 Sep 2008 11:12
Sniper-Fex Gamblor Tyranids 8 02 Nov 2007 18:04
tau sniper munkey House Rules 21 13 Feb 2007 22:10
tau sniper Hex Conversion 15 21 Mar 2005 21:55