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Quality vs. Quantity ... Upgrades to vehicles, suits and troops.
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Old 12 Apr 2007, 17:34   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Quality vs. Quantity ... Upgrades to vehicles, suits and troops.

I've been reading the various articles in the stickkies. There seems to be a general consensus that more trumps better.

Many of the upgrades to the Tau units are very tempting, yet they seem to be seldom used. The argument would appear to be - it's just better to buy more of X, than to make the X you have better.

In particular - it seems fairly tempting to me to include a Marker Drone in a unit of Firewarriors. But the consensus seems to be that the 30pts (plus upgrades to team leaders etc) for the Drone would be better spent on more firewarriors.

But markerlights don't seem to be that popular.

Well, anyway - what's the theory - keep the costs down on a per unit/vehicle and save points for more units, or make the units you have all they can be?

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Old 12 Apr 2007, 18:58   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Quality vs. Quantity ... Upgrades to vehicles, suits and troops.

It's true this seems to be the main consensus, but I think it's even a bit simpler than that...40k, despite whatever stat lines you are fighting with, tends to be a dice game...more dice = more death. Adding more basic guns seems to swing the averages more than upgrades do.

Although with your example (assuming you're using a full unit) adding a marker -drone would remove your ability to use a transport (too many models) so perhaps the upgrade wins here, if you want the markerlight you could still give it to the shas-ui (making him the 30 pointer) ;D
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Old 12 Apr 2007, 19:03   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Quality vs. Quantity ... Upgrades to vehicles, suits and troops.

Well I like striking a balance between the two. Having enough bodies to last a while, and making sure those bodies can do their job well.

I've been running some very suit heavy armies recently and they really can benefit from a few well chosen upgrades.
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Old 12 Apr 2007, 19:04   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Quality vs. Quantity ... Upgrades to vehicles, suits and troops.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazadvorn
Well, anyway - what's the theory - keep the costs down on a per unit/vehicle and save points for more units, or make the units you have all they can be?
You need to take it on a case by case basis. If your options are to pay 30 pts for a BS3 Markerlight (hits 50% of the time) or to buy 3 more Firewarriors, you can use math to figure out which gives you more return on your investment. Frequently, the math works out such that it's better to buy more shots than it is to buy Markerlights. There are a few notable exceptions.

There's more to it than this though. Paying points for defensive upgrades (decoy launchers, shield drones, etc) allows the shots that you've bought to stick around longer. Points spent on Shas'ui and Bonding help mitigate morale mishaps. Are you aiming more for a front loaded list or an end loaded list? Offensive efficiency is only one part of the equation. I'd suggest using the search feature and reading up on some of the articles in the stickies above.
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Old 12 Apr 2007, 20:14   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Quality vs. Quantity ... Upgrades to vehicles, suits and troops.

I always get worried when I start spending a lot of pts on a single unit. I've always liked alot of bodies in my lists. What's wierd is my mechanised tau lists tend to be the reverse of my usual philosophy. My hammerheads tend to be pretty pimped out, I'll often take Warfishes and Piranhas aren't exactly cheap either. It only really comes into play when I start arming my suits. That's where I tend to be pretty darn frugal with my pts. I guess it's because they've proven rather fragile to me in the past, so I don't like to spend too much on them. Commanders are very often the 97pt efficient, yet rather boring, "wondersuit", Stealths are stock, no fancy stuff there and the crisis teams themselves tend to be JSJ TL missile pod+targeting array transport wreckers
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Old 12 Apr 2007, 22:43   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Quality vs. Quantity ... Upgrades to vehicles, suits and troops.

My fire warrior squads are bare-bone - they're there to use their rifles, absorb charges (if any) and die gloriously.

My Hammerheads are loaded to the gill, they're there to survive as part of the skimmer wall, and deliver death.

My suits are moderately loaded:
xv15s dont get upgrades, they're already great the way they are.
xv8s gets them depending on their role - PR/FB/Mtrk units are loaded with shield drones, bonding, and such
Commanders get whatever's left over in terms of points

My kroot gets a shaper. period.
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Old 12 Apr 2007, 22:44   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Quality vs. Quantity ... Upgrades to vehicles, suits and troops.

Quantity is a quality all it's own. - Lenin
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Old 12 Apr 2007, 23:33   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Quality vs. Quantity ... Upgrades to vehicles, suits and troops.

when i take questions like this i pull in the classic IGs and Terminators. how would you fight IGs or Terminators. you have to realise where the balance is. 5 fusion blasters plow through terminators but you don't have the numbers to kill the IGs. and as a classic example was this.

Terminators deep strike in between my kroot and my stealth squad. he shoots at the stealth squad. i assult him with my Kroot with honestly 50 attacks. i killed only 4 but thats about 120 points on his side witch is worth more then the kroot squad i attacked him with.

so what i love doing is having mostly numbers with a dash of good stuff. i have numbers then i have my Crisis commander pimped out beyond reason. shield drones and everything. the ion blaster on a commander crisis is surprisingly good. chances are all 5 attacks will hit. ageist terminators 5+ wounds and a 6 is an ap1. so i can kill them with that and the plasma rifle.

but instant death on my commander blows away all of his wounds in one shot. kinda like dont put all your eggs in one basket.
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Old 13 Apr 2007, 00:59   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Quality vs. Quantity ... Upgrades to vehicles, suits and troops.

What I think it really gets down to is the usefullness of the upgrades. If its something that, while it could save a game, will only come into use every fourth or fifth battle, I would say leave it at home and bring a couple more pulse rifles. However, if you will be constantly using it to the point that it really helps your list, I say you keep it where it is.

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Old 13 Apr 2007, 02:59   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Quality vs. Quantity ... Upgrades to vehicles, suits and troops.

It depends on who your enemy is. If you have someone with many instant-death weapons, like what happens to Funshade, you'll need more troops, or (even better) an upgrade that boosts your toughness, which the Tau lack. If you are fighting someone in which you'll have a hard time hitting or doing damage (eg invulnerable saves, three landraiders, stealthy crud, etc) you might want the Bs upgrade or the seeker missiles provided by markerlight support.
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