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Shooty, annoying Tyranids
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Old 12 Apr 2007, 06:03   #1 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
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Default Shooty, annoying Tyranids

O.k., so let's jump right into this. I'm a n00b, and I got my arse handed to me against my friend's Tyranids. We're both rather new, and so didn't have our ideal armies, but pulled some stuff together for a 1000 point game, and he had a slightly MC w/ big guns theme. 2 Carnafex with venom cannon/ barbed strangler, dual TL devourer hive tyrant, and 2 Zoanthropes.

I Suppose I was running a hybrid, with 2 hammerheads, 2 12xFire warrior squads, 10 Kroot, 2 crisis suits (1 shas'o firekife, one sunforge) and a broadside. He infiltrated Broodlord and Gensteler brood, removing my broadside, and 1 hammerhead (got rid of the Railgun and 1 burst cannon at least), and 1 Firewarrior squad.

As the game went on, he took a large bunker w/ 3+ cover save and camped it very well. My remaining Firewarior squad and Kroot squad didn't see action because there was about 40" of open space between the closes spot with line of sight to the bunker, and the bunker, with no cover in between.

I used the Jump, Shoot, Jump trick a bit with the missle pods, but when I brought my healthy hammerhead, not only was my attack blocked by the bunker, but he destroyed it with his venom cannons. With the remaining threat gone, he closed in and demolished my infantry with barbed stranglers. I did kill his Lictor in Close Combat with my Crisis Comander however...

In any case, what are some helpful things to do/remember/not do when going against a shooty based Tyranid army?
Thanks for the help,
Dredrick
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Old 12 Apr 2007, 06:06   #2 (permalink)
Ethereal
 
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Default Re: Shooty, annoying Tyranids

Welcome to the forums!

I can sympathize with you. Shooty Carnifexes can be very hard to deal with for Tau, especially if your opponent has them stuck in decent cover. And they can shut down Hammerheads with very little trouble, even if they aren't that good at actually killing them. I am not sure what the answer is, except to try and minimize what they can draw a line-of-sight to. They are still pretty slow.
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Old 12 Apr 2007, 07:55   #3 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Shooty, annoying Tyranids

The only absolutley reliable way of dealing with shooty Carnifexes that I've found is lots of Broadsides (I run four). They have enough railguns to kill Carnifexes relativley quickly, and the 2+ save makes them really hard to kill with return fire (espescially with shield drones) But doing this will invariably make your army a mostly static one, and that's something many players want to avoid.

The only other option I can think of if Crisis Suit teams with plasma guns and fusion blasters. The plasma guns will do reasonable damage to Carnifexes, and getting within rapid - fire and fusion range will almost certainly kill one. If it dosen't, the opponent may charge you, and that's an expensive unit down the drain (shooty Carnifexes aren't awesome in combat, but are far better then Crisis Suits).

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Old 12 Apr 2007, 14:26   #4 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: Shooty, annoying Tyranids

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dredrick
O.k., so let's jump right into this. I'm a n00b, and I got my D'yi handed to me against my friend's Tyranids.
We all started somewhere, no one expects you to start off winning 100%, well, if you did, where would the fun be in that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dredrick
I Suppose I was running a hybrid, with 2 hammerheads, 2 12xFire warrior squads, 10 Kroot, 2 crisis suits (1 shas'o firekife, one sunforge) and a broadside. He infiltrated Broodlord and Gensteler brood, removing my broadside, and 1 hammerhead (got rid of the Railgun and 1 burst cannon at least), and 1 Firewarrior squad.
Well when i know theres some CC infiltrators, i use my skimmers to my advantage, because remember, the only thing that blocks LoS to skimmers is forests, or other skimmers. Or put some units ontop of cover so they draw a LoS to the infiltrators. Also, if you really want to, you could try to counter infiltrate them with your kroot. Try to MAKE him have to infiltrate 18" out, that way he can't assault first turn no matter how hard he tries

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dredrick
I used the Jump, Shoot, Jump trick a bit with the missle pods, but when I brought my healthy hammerhead, not only was my attack blocked by the bunker
Attack from your Hammerhead was blocked by a bunker? Your Hammerhead is a skimmer, it sees (And can shoot) ALL (Except through forests or through other skimmers)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dredrick
With the remaining threat gone, he closed in and demolished my infantry with barbed stranglers.
Were your men out in the open? If they were in cover i'm sure (Depending on who was closing in) they could have survived the shooting

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dredrick
I did kill his Lictor in Close Combat with my Crisis Comander however...
That Alone is a victory for the Tau! I love it when specialized CC units are beaten by our suits, shows 'em whos boss

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dredrick
In any case, what are some helpful things to do/remember/not do when going against a shooty based Tyranid army?
Thanks for the help,
Dredrick
No problem, never be afraid to ask ;D
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Old 12 Apr 2007, 17:10   #5 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: Shooty, annoying Tyranids

Thanks for the help guys. The Carnafex has a 3+ armor save unless they give it some biomorph (extended carapace I think) and Rail Rifles have ap3, so maybe that'll work if they don't bother with the biomorph.

And clarification, when I said "blocked by a bunker" I mean he made the 3+ cover save roll that it gave him.

Also, there wasn't much terrain other then large rocks to hide behind, and he started to advance on me, when I had only open field to my back.

The map was rather interesting actually, there were two sides, separated completely except through one passage about 3" wide. Most of the terrain was used making that wall, so there wasn't a whole lot, and what there was, he controlled.

I can't see how anyone can pass up stimulant injectors for a mere 10 points. Sadly, it's special issue, but damn is it good. I would have taken 3 wounds from the Lictor, but the SI saved 2.
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Old 12 Apr 2007, 17:37   #6 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: Shooty, annoying Tyranids

Ah, ok, for a second i thought you were horribly cheated.
Also no terrain for 4+Saves (Or none in the case of kroot) can be pretty lethal. I try to always have my FW in cover, for the save and if they try to assault them, i can move the FW out of the terrain, rapid fire them, and then laugh as they try to assault next turn and roll a 1-3 for difficult terrain ;D

Would you say that the infiltrators really turned the tide of the battle?
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Old 12 Apr 2007, 19:00   #7 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: Shooty, annoying Tyranids

Oh yea. Like I said, most the terrain on the map was simply large rocks, but clumped together. His assault weakened me enough that he had more long range firepower.

3 friends of mine started playing at the same time as me, one Tyranids, one Necron, and one Chaos. I've played 2 2v2 games w/ them, 1 1v1v1, but this's my 1st 1v1 game, and 4th game overall. I literally forgot that Kroot could infiltrate. I deployed before him, and knew that he had his broodlord and where he was going to place them (a little cave like area just to the left of my units), but he had 1st turn. I deployed my kroot in the troop phase, so once It came to deploying infiltrators/scouts, i was kicking myself, knowing that he would place those assaulter's.

That's the first, and arguably largest mistake I made.
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Old 12 Apr 2007, 20:40   #8 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Shooty, annoying Tyranids

I think it's kind of funny that you all started playing at the same time, and they chose what are arguably the 3 worst match-ups Tau have.

Oh well, at least you can challenge yourself
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Old 12 Apr 2007, 21:18   #9 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Shooty, annoying Tyranids

The first issue here is cover. He had it, you didn't. For a shooting battle, this means a great deal. I see many...possibly most battles won or lost by the time deployment has finished. Army list, terrain, and deployment count for a lot in this game.

First off, I highly suggest a broadside w shield drones for dealing with carnifexes and the like. One won't solve all your problems with them by himself, but he'll help out greatly, and be nearly invincible.

Secondly, when placing terrain, make sure the two of you take turns, or at a minimum, play on a field with evenly spread terrain. Tau does best with a moderate amount of terrain...enough to get cover saves, but not enough that it jacks up all the lines of fire. Also, a nice forest midfield will give you something to infiltrate kroot into.

Thirdly: Kroot rock. Even if he has the biomorph equiv of frag grenades, you should get enough attacks in to deal some serious damage if he's attacking you in cover. If he doesn't attack, simply use them to push back infiltrators, and shoot up whatever comes close. They're a terrific roadblock, provided you keep them in 4+ or better cover.

Fourth, you have at least one crisis suit always...I suggest using one high strength weapon, such as a plasma gun, and the CIB. It's great for dealing with a wide variety of stuff, and with BS 5('el w TA is awesome), it's pretty reliable.

Fifth, note that a broadside unit with shield drones is actually really efficient at tying up in melee anything without a way to ignore armor saves. Same goes if your HQ has iridium amor and shield drones.

Sixth, try not to deploy units so far to the side that they end up trapped and unable to fire on anything. Exception...broadsides. If they have sufficiently good lanes of fire from there, range isn't an issue.
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Old 13 Apr 2007, 03:13   #10 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Shooty, annoying Tyranids

I have the same problem, except mine comes from his Hive Tyrant with a Venom cannon and six warriors.

For the Genestealers, use the Firestorm Configuration (Burst cannon, Missile Pod, Multi-tracker) and a CIB on the Commander. Also, use the Fish of Fury for a devistating effect! ;D

Also, with your Hammerhead, if you have the Railgun, you can use BOTH the single-shot AND Submunition rounds!!! ;D

Also, just shoot at the broodlord first, then you could do something called TANKSHOCK in which your hammerhead or devilfish skims right over the ground and crushes everything to nice, gory bits? >
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