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Inexperienced Players ~ Annoying or what?
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Old 10 Nov 2006, 20:17   #1 (permalink)
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Default Inexperienced Players ~ Annoying or what?

Is it me but are loads more n00bs starting Tau now? In the past month or so three people at my school have started tau and they have no idea how to play 40k or how to play Tau. Excuse me for moaning but it that so many people are starting 40k with no regard for how to play, taking up all our time teaching them so that we don't have to watch their horrbily played games over and over. This is just a rant, and most of you will think because of my age that I'm just an unexperienced player, but have any of the rest of you experienced this?
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Old 10 Nov 2006, 20:20   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Inexperienced Players ~ Annoying or what?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shas'o Or'es Mal'caor
Is it me but are loads more n00bs starting Tau now? In the past month or so three people at my school have started tau and they have no idea how to play 40k or how to play Tau. Excuse me for moaning but it that so many people are starting 40k with no regard for how to play, taking up all our time teaching them so that we don't have to watch their horrbily played games over and over. This is just a rant, and most of you will think because of my age that I'm just an unexperienced player, but have any of the rest of you experienced this?
Well, given how GW has started pushing their update cycle harder and harder with respect to advertising, any new book will draw a disproportionate amount of starting players. You will probably see the same thing with Eldar in a few months.
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Old 10 Nov 2006, 20:24   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Inexperienced Players ~ Annoying or what?

I just find it quite annoying that they have no regard for the rules often and you have to teach them yourself, because they cannot be bothered to buy the rulebook - or buy too many minis so cannot afford it - so therefore can't teach themselves.
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Old 10 Nov 2006, 20:34   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Inexperienced Players ~ Annoying or what?

One easy simple solution is just don't play the game with them. If you are tired of teaching them and they don't want to learn the rules, just don't game with em.
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Old 10 Nov 2006, 20:54   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Inexperienced Players ~ Annoying or what?

I have this crazy idea that everyone got atleast 1 rule wrong in their first game. Also, that everyone had a first game. New players are good, fresh ideas, fresh people to play with. If they refuse to learn the rules that's one thing; they really should make some effort if they want to play. But complainign that they don't have a lot of minis and perhaps can only field a combat patrol because they cna't afford more models at the time is pushing it. Some people, don't make it their #1 spending priority. Different play types and activitiy levels. Not everyone can play tournaments or wants to for that matter.
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Old 10 Nov 2006, 21:01   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Inexperienced Players ~ Annoying or what?

Don't complain, with more players and a higher income, GW might just stop putting it's prices up!

I run a club in a secondary school, and it's amazing how many times you have to tell someone something over and over again. You can use analogies and all sorts of different styles to get the point across but it's like talking to a wall sometimes. However it's the new kids getting involved that keep my club running and allow i to survive. Eventually they learn, though it takes considerable coaxing, and they too in turn then help to teach other pupils (which is finally beginning to happen - just as I'm leaving) and keep the hobby going. I've got 4 Tau players in my club (including myself), only 16 regulars attend, most play marines or 'nids, but tau are 3rd ranking. None of them have a clue what stratergy is - and it's suprisingly hard to teach - they just charge in everywhere and shoot while running into slaughter, it's almost funny to watch. Hell, some of the year 11 kids fail miserably, and they've been playing for years.

I suppose it's very true about GW's cycle of armies, however, I've asked every member why they collected Tau, and they all told me the same thing - the fire warrior game, I know this was some time ago (take in mind these kids have been collecting for a year) but they played the game, learnt some more and hey presto, complete warhammer idiots!
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Old 10 Nov 2006, 21:17   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Inexperienced Players ~ Annoying or what?

Just remember you were all little annoying n00bs at one point too :P
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Old 10 Nov 2006, 21:38   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Inexperienced Players ~ Annoying or what?

Its odd to hear that so many noobs are getting into Tau in your area.
Where I'm from its not the case at all.
When the new codex was released i thought,oh boy here we go..
Never happened.
I'd say most noobs here are either into marines,chaos marines,or nids.
Eldar....too soon to tell yet.
I am a returning player after a few years absence, I actually had a Tau army before and when I saw the new minis for the new codex that sold me on doing them again.
As to noobs having to be taught,well you can only learn so much from reading a rulebook.
Sooner or later someone has to help them along.
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Old 10 Nov 2006, 21:45   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Inexperienced Players ~ Annoying or what?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shas'o Or'es Mal'caor
Is it me but are loads more n00bs starting Tau now? In the past month or so three people at my school have started tau and they have no idea how to play 40k or how to play Tau. Excuse me for moaning but it that so many people are starting 40k with no regard for how to play, taking up all our time teaching them so that we don't have to watch their horrbily played games over and over. This is just a rant, and most of you will think because of my age that I'm just an unexperienced player, but have any of the rest of you experienced this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shas'o Or'es Mal'caor
I just find it quite annoying that they have no regard for the rules often and you have to teach them yourself, because they cannot be bothered to buy the rulebook - or buy too many minis so cannot afford it - so therefore can't teach themselves.
What about you when you begin warhammer? That time you are what you would call a 'annoying little brat who doesn't know anything'. Just zoom past and go back to the beginning. Can you see yourself then? Yeah, that's right you are clueless, even with the exact instructions in front of you face. You are just another face in the big horde of newbies.

We all have that phase when we enter something new. We are clueless and devoid of the thing that we have just entered in. And even with the rules in front of us, we will not understand anything in a flash. And as a result of that, we do not know what is good and what is bad for all of us, and thus we often make mistakes that we would later regret and laugh later.

Take for example maths. we don't know what math is exactly. We always ask the teacher and friends how to do your math work. And you jumble up all the formulas into one big ugly paste.

So what if you are an experienced player? It is your job to make certain that they do not remain this way

Peoplelearn by trial and error alongside proper guidance. If there is proper guidance and no trial and error, you will know in theory how to do it,but you will not know how to do it in real life. If you have not proper guidance, and use trail and error, for all you may know you can do it totally wrong and not knowing it. So a balance of the two is essential in any type of learning. We try one method, then we fail, and then we try again with a better or new method.


he best example for my point would be learning how to ride a bicycle. Fiirst your parents will try to teach you how to ride a bike,and then they will ask you to do the same. An example for this would be larning how to ride a bicycle. You first fall down since you can't balance you bike, and then you get up again and try riding it again. Many times you would have fallen off your bike, and many more times where you will egt you butt up and try to rife it again. After some hwile you parent will help you to do it again, only this time thy will support you when you try to balance yourself on the bike, and after you are able to balance yourself on the bike, then your parents will let go of the bike and ask you to paddle. Suddenly, will be able to get up on the bike and ride it like the wind. As you get more accustome to your bike, you will get better at it.

The same goes with warhammer. They all begin as little seedlings that know not of anything. But as they try to do it, they will bound to be lost and get confused by the things veteran players find trivial. But with the proper guidance, these seedlings will be able to be better at what they do, and then they will become better gamers with each progressing game.

In addition to that, you have to remember the fact that if it not for them, most of the wargaming committte will not exist as a result of;

1) They put in fresh blood into an otherwise stagnant game.

2)They replace those gamers that decide to quit

3)They boost our numbers

4)They replace those gamers that will die (this one is an overexaggeration)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Khanaris
Well, given how GW has started pushing their update cycle harder and harder with respect to advertising, any new book will draw a disproportionate amount of starting players.* You will probably see the same thing with Eldar in a few months.
This is the fact of any game, whether this is Pokemon or World Of Warcraft. People will get interested in anything that fancies them. Whether it is to become a sommelier, a scientist, a acountant, a slacker (:P) .....you name it, they do it because they fancy what they do.

We, as experienced gamers are there not to mock them, but to make them enjoy the game more. You want soemthing new? Go with the flow and m,aybe you will find yourself something new.These newbies are the future, and it is wise that you teach them, so that they can pass down the knowledge to the next generation and make this hobby stay alive. I have known too many hobbies whichh died as a result of not getting any new blood.


As a saying goes, "Catch a fish for a man, you will feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish, and you will feed him for a lifetime".


Think twice before you think about all these types of things. And by the way, a newb is a new player that needs guidance, while a noob is an arrogant player that knows not of the rules of the game.

Here is a link to what I mean.

http://www.ctrlaltdel-online.com/comic.php?d=20060823

Enjoy.
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Old 10 Nov 2006, 22:30   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Inexperienced Players ~ Annoying or what?

A lot depends on how you teach people, I found that teaching them the broad ideas of strategy before the actual rules themselves made things a lot easier (though this was for WFB). Things like to aim for flank charges and moving the focus of the army around his concentrations of troops etc.

After a game or two you then start focusing more on the mechanics, once they know a bit more about what they are trying to acheive.
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