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TO Update: Shas'vesa Kau'ui (Auxiliary Cadres)
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Old 31 Oct 2006, 11:34   #1 (permalink)
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Default TO Update: Shas'vesa Kau'ui (Auxiliary Cadres)

This concept is inspired mainly by Xisor's comments on another thread, and from reading Warhammer Ancients; specifically, the Roman Army.


It think of the Tau much like the Romans; a solid core of Legionaries (Tau) with Auxiliaries (Kroot, Vespid) to bulk them out. However, one thing the Romans did have at time were "imitation" Legionaries, allies recruited from other lands. These troops were based upon the Legionary model, but were nowhere near as good in terms of training... or sometimes equipment.

This army is meant to allow you to field an army of these "Fake" Shas. The army revolves heavily around "Auxiliaries" (which can be Gue'vesa, Tarellian Dog-soldiers, Galg, or whatever race you want them to be), with some "proper" Tau elements in support.


The Auxiliary Cadres (Shas'vesa Kau'ui):
Version 1.1


Not all armies in the Tau Empire are made of the Shas Cadres. As the Empire expands, and more races enter the fold, so too do the number of enemies and battlefields increase. To counter this, it is often necessary for the Tau Empire to make use of auxiliary forces. These forces are known as Shas'vesa Kau'ui (loosely translated "Helper-Cadres"). They are composed primarily of Auxiliaries, and are usually used as a stop-gap force, or to bolster the Tau battle line. Not as well equipped as normal Cadres, they must employ a more static style of warfare, and as such are usually deployed in well-defended positions where the more mobile Tau Cadres can use them as an anvil upon which to break the foe.

Whilst Auxiliary Cadres may be looked down upon by some Tau Commanders, they are not considered expendable. The Tau know very well that without forces such as these, their Empire would be far weaker than it is today.


HQ: 0-1 Shas'El, Shas'vre Bodyguard.
Elites: 0-1 Battlesuit Team (Crisis or Stealth), Yr'vesa Squads.
Troops: Shas'vesa Squads, 0-3 Firewarrior Squads*.
Fast Attack: Kroot Squads**, Vespid**, Drone Squadrons**, Pathfinder squads.
Heavy Support: 0-1 Battlesuit Team (Crisis or Broadside), 0-1 Hammerhead, Sniper Teams.
* = You cannot have more Firewarrior Squads than non-Firewarrior Troop Choices in your army (in other words, you need at least one non-Firewarrior Troop Choice!).
** = You may choose to remove one of these units from Fast Attack and make them a 0-3 Troop Choice. All rules, costs and options remained unchanged. If you do this, Firewarriors become an Elites choice.

Shas'vesa Squads:
The Tau make use of a variety of forces in their armies, from Gue'vesa to Tarellian Dog-soldiers. These are collectively known as Shas'vesa. Whilst exact equipment designs and specifications may vary, the Tau Empire does attempt to equip their Shas'vesa Cadres to a universal standard, and so all Shas'vesa squads operate in a fairly similar way.
[table][tr][td] [/td][td]Cost[/td][td]Ws[/td][td]Bs[/td][td]S[/td][td]T[/td][td]W[/td][td]I[/td][td]A[/td][td]Ld[/td][td]Sv[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Shas'vesa'la[/td][td]7[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]1[/td][td]3[/td][td]1[/td][td]7[/td][td]5+[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Shas'vesa'ui[/td][td]+10[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]1[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]8[/td][td]5+[/td][/tr]
[/table]
Squad: The squad consists of 6-12 Shas'vesa.
Weapons: Auxiliary Rifle.
Options: Any model may replace their Auxiliary Rifle with an Auxiliary Carbine at no cost.
One Shas'vesa'la may be promoted to a Shas'vesa'ui at +10pts. He may have a Markerlight at +10pts.
The squad may be given one of the following upgrades at +2pts per model; +1 Strength, +1 Toughness or a 4+ Armour Save.
The entire squad may be equipped with Frag Grenades at +1pt per model, or EMP Grenades at +3pts per model.

Yr'vesa Squads:
The Yr'vesa are the most experienced and battle-hardened warriors in the Shas'vesa Kau'ui. Veterans of countless battles, they are valued warriors, easily able to engage and defeat most enemy forces, and have abilities that rival, if not exceed the abilities of most Shas.
[table][tr][td] [/td][td]Cost[/td][td]Ws[/td][td]Bs[/td][td]S[/td][td]T[/td][td]W[/td][td]I[/td][td]A[/td][td]Ld[/td][td]Sv[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Shas'vesa'ui[/td][td]10[/td][td]3[/td][td]4[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]1[/td][td]3[/td][td]1[/td][td]8[/td][td]5+[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Shas'vesa'vre[/td][td]+10[/td][td]3[/td][td]4[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]1[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]8[/td][td]5+[/td][/tr]
[/table]
Squad: The squad consists of 6-12 Shas'vesa.
Weapons: Auxiliary Rifle.
Options: Any model may replace their Auxiliary Rifle with an Auxiliary Carbine at no cost.
One Shas'vesa'ui may be promoted to a Shas'vesa'vre at +10pts. He may have a Markerlight at +10pts. He may also have a Drone Crontroller, and can purchase up to two Drones from the Tau Armoury.
The squad may be given one of the following upgrades at +2pts per model; +1 Strength, +1 Toughness or a 4+ Armour Save.
The entire squad may be equipped with Frag Grenades at +1pt per model, or EMP Grenades at +3pts per model.


Auxiliary Rifle:
Originally, the Shas'vesa used a wide variety of weapons, ranging from Lasguns to Neutron Blasters and everything in between. The Tau have sought to standardise this variety to a degree, generally equipping the Shas'vesa with a weapon similar to the Pulse Rifle. Whilst some units still retain more individualised armaments, the core of the Shas'vesa Shan'al are equipped with Auxiliary Rifles.

Auxiliary Rifles have the following profile:
Range: 30" Str: 4 Ap: 5 Type: Rapid Fire.

Auxiliary Carbine:
Much like it's larger cousin, the Auxiliary Carbine is designed for Shas'vesa units who favour suppressive roles rather than long-ranged firefights. Whilst their exact specifications range from simplified Pulse Carbines to Neuro-distruptors, the Auxiliary Carbine uses the same rules regardless of its specific design.

Auxiliary Carbines have th following profile:
Range: 18" Str: 4 Ap: 5 Type: Assault 1, Pinning.


Design changes:
Version 1.1 - Introduced Auxiliary Carbine option
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Old 31 Oct 2006, 11:58   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: TO Update: Shas'vesa Shan'al (Auxiliary Cadres)

This is like a lot, hell, a hell of a lot. How about making the Shas'vesa Squads a 0-1 troop in a normal Tau army, as this will allow all the players out there with a penchant for auxilleries to take Tarellians, to take the Galg. No new models needed, convert, and the rules mean you can represent any of the Empire's alien races without the need to playtest each race etc, as long as this ruling is right.

This is pretty good, I definatly think this should be submitted.

One question though, if I may, why make the weapons S4, but the range the same? I would have thought, they would have had the shorter range, although at the risk of ripping off a bolter.

How about, to facillitate the making of the individual races, include the following:

Where X is the upgrade that best fits that particular race.

To upgrade your Shas'vesa Squad to Tarrelian Dog soldiers, they may take upgrade X and weapon X at +Y pts.
To upgrade your Shas'vesa Squads to Galg warriors, they may take upgrade X and weapon X at +Y pts.

Then include slightly different weapons, like e.g. Neuro Disrutor - same stas as boltgun, but with pin test, only usable if they are whoever it is who uses them.

Do you get where I'm going? Coz looking back, it seems a bit rambly.
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Old 31 Oct 2006, 12:16   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: TO Update: Shas'vesa Shan'al (Auxiliary Cadres)

I see what you're getting at, but I wasn't too keen on the "20+ options" style for the squads. The Shas'vesa are basically a weaker version of Fire Warriors, and in that light I think perhaps an "Auxiliary Carbine" wouldn't go amiss... that could represent Neuro-Disruptors and the like as you suggest.


The reason I don't want to have anything specific is we don't know enough. For example, I might think Tarellian Dog-Soldiers are Str 4... but someone else might think they're Str 3 and have 2 A... someone else might decide they should have a Str 3 Ap 6 Assault 4 gun... because we have no hard-and-fast rules for them, I think a non-specific methodology is better.
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Old 31 Oct 2006, 12:35   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: TO Update: Shas'vesa Shan'al (Auxiliary Cadres)

True, but it could be done without using 20+, maybe 6, allowing you to either:

Create the three listed races, with a defining stat characteristic, and a unique gun
Or:

Create your own, with a mix of stat/gun.

The auxillery carbine would work, making a version of the pusle carbine, would still give the pin, so could be called neuro-disruptor if people wanted to create tarellians e.g.
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Old 31 Oct 2006, 12:42   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: TO Update: Shas'vesa Shan'al (Auxiliary Cadres)

That's partly the point... say we both take Shas'vesa with 4+ Armour.

You might decide your Shas'vesa represent Gue'vesa Grenadiers equipped with a modified Hellgun that has been fitted with larger power packs and superior focussing-lenses.

I might decide my Shas'vesa are Skiv'xh armed with shard-rifles.

Again, however, I'd like to avoid making new races if we can; I'd much rather keep it vague, so as to reduce the chance of people (and ultimately GW) turning round and saying "we don't think race x should have y, so we won't like it".

That said, any other suggestions for what the Shas'vesa could be equipped with would work. I still like the idea of being able to have Firewarrior-style units, but ideas for other weapon types, other unit options, etc. are welcome.
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Old 31 Oct 2006, 13:23   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: TO Update: Shas'vesa Shan'al (Auxiliary Cadres)

How about:


Know their place: Special Rule, +X pts (I can never price something well)
These Shas'vesa know their place in the Empire, and to fight for the Greater Good. They benifit from the ethereal rules (so, re-roll LD or whatever it is they do now)

Fluff wise: This race/unit has seen the light, and near fully converted to the Tau'va. They treat the ethereals with utmost respect, and while still not the devotion of the Tau, they have come to see them as an inspiring presence on the battlefield, and to dread their loss.

Honour of the Lure: Special Rule, again +X pts. This unit hsa worked with the Kauyon cadre many times, and have been given the honoured position of the Lure. This unit sets up first, anywhere not in the enemy deployment zone.

Realworld note: As said in the TE dex, the lure is not expendable, but considered honoured for its role. Making the unit set up first anywhere means they can actively be given the role of Lure, without simply infiltrating/scouts.
While not always a good idea, in recon it may be a bonus.

Weird-Uber-Alien-Gun (insert better name) +Xpts per model. Their auxillery rifle is upgraded to become some kind of weird-uber-alien-gun, giving them the following weapon: S4 Ap4 24" Assault 1.
Fluff wise - this is some gun, with whatever effect, using whatever as a power/projectile/hurled sock with half brick in from the unit's homeworld. It allows moderate S, with decent Armour Penetration at mid range, but has a slow RoF.

Tanglefoot rifle +X pts. Tanglefoot rifles, rather than doing damage to the enemy, constrict their movement. Roll to hit as normal, range 18" Assault 1, then roll to wound. The weapon has a nominal S of 4. Do not make armour saves for the unit. For every "wound" taken, the unit loses 1" to a min of 1 of their normal move. Fleet is unaffected, but charge moves are as well.

Cons: The problem here is there is no defence against it, but then allowing armour saves means you would really do sod all against them. And then there is the problem of "but my men have jumppacks/wings" etc, in which case, tough. You are getting a smaller reduction than infantry, but to give it so many rules would make it pointless. This would allow them to slow the enemy without hurting them, allowing your pansy tau to maybe get away.
I made the range 18" only, as 24" seemed to long, and you should have to expose your men to some danger to get this bonus.


N.B. I'm not sure still what I think of special weapons in teams, even if they are not Shas as such, but they still from your rules seem to follow slightly the Shas way of fighting, with the team size etc. Therefore, I made the guns an all or nothing, either you have a unit that is technically incapable of hurting the enemy at range, or you have the weird-uber-alien-gun which gives better AP than a bolter, but with less potantial shots.

Good? Bad?
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Old 31 Oct 2006, 13:32   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: TO Update: Shas'vesa Shan'al (Auxiliary Cadres)

Even the lesser auxiliaries have better weapons than a Guardsman without any apparent downsides. 7 points is close to a Guardsman. Heck the rifle is better than a bolter!

I think this is simply too good, especially the Veteran Auxiliaries.

I think allowing 1 in 3 an auxiliary squads to upgrade to the equivalent of a single heavy bolter or up to 2 grenade launchers would suffice.
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Old 31 Oct 2006, 13:43   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: TO Update: Shas'vesa Shan'al (Auxiliary Cadres)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Forbidden knowledge, the shadow ninja rabbit!
How about:


Know their place: Special Rule, +X pts (I can never price something well)
These Shas'vesa know their place in the Empire, and to fight for the Greater Good. They benifit from the ethereal rules (so, re-roll LD or whatever it is they do now)

Fluff wise: This race/unit has seen the light, and near fully converted to the Tau'va. They treat the ethereals with utmost respect, and while still not the devotion of the Tau, they have come to see them as an inspiring presence on the battlefield, and to dread their loss.
Interesting idea... but I'm not sure about it myself. We don't really understand why the Aun are held in such high regard yet... too many theories and unanswered questions.

Quote:
Honour of the Lure: Special Rule, again +X pts. This unit hsa worked with the Kauyon cadre many times, and have been given the honoured position of the Lure. This unit sets up first, anywhere not in the enemy deployment zone.

Realworld note: As said in the TE dex, the lure is not expendable, but considered honoured for its role. Making the unit set up first anywhere means they can actively be given the role of Lure, without simply infiltrating/scouts.
While not always a good idea, in recon it may be a bonus.
Interesting idea... might be worth looking into.

Quote:
Weird-Uber-Alien-Gun (insert better name) +Xpts per model. Their auxillery rifle is upgraded to become some kind of weird-uber-alien-gun, giving them the following weapon: S4 Ap4 24" Assault 1.
Fluff wise - this is some gun, with whatever effect, using whatever as a power/projectile/hurled sock with half brick in from the unit's homeworld. It allows moderate S, with decent Armour Penetration at mid range, but has a slow RoF.
I actually had a weapon like this in a home-made army... interesting idea, might be worth looking into.

Quote:
Tanglefoot rifle +X pts. Tanglefoot rifles, rather than doing damage to the enemy, constrict their movement. Roll to hit as normal, range 18" Assault 1, then roll to wound. The weapon has a nominal S of 4. Do not make armour saves for the unit. For every "wound" taken, the unit loses 1" to a min of 1 of their normal move. Fleet is unaffected, but charge moves are as well.

Cons: The problem here is there is no defence against it, but then allowing armour saves means you would really do sod all against them. And then there is the problem of "but my men have jumppacks/wings" etc, in which case, tough. You are getting a smaller reduction than infantry, but to give it so many rules would make it pointless. This would allow them to slow the enemy without hurting them, allowing your pansy tau to maybe get away.
I made the range 18" only, as 24" seemed to long, and you should have to expose your men to some danger to get this bonus.
I see what you're getting at, but I'm not sure if it would work. Seems... well... overly complex.

How about a weapon that anyone hit counts as being in Difficult Terrain from then on? Perhaps make it some form of "Graviton Gun", able to damage people as well as slow them down?


Quote:
N.B. I'm not sure still what I think of special weapons in teams, even if they are not Shas as such, but they still from your rules seem to follow slightly the Shas way of fighting, with the team size etc. Therefore, I made the guns an all or nothing, either you have a unit that is technically incapable of hurting the enemy at range, or you have the weird-uber-alien-gun which gives better AP than a bolter, but with less potantial shots.

Good? Bad?
I want to avoid special/heavy weapons in squads. They don't fit the Tau pattern, and as such I can't see Auxiliaries making use of them either.

Obviously, specialist units (Pathfinders) are an exception to this rule... but for the rank and file I think we should keep the upgrades to "whole squad", not individuals.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dal'yth Dude
Even the lesser auxiliaries have better weapons than a Guardsman without any apparent downsides. 7 points is close to a Guardsman. Heck the rifle is better than a bolter!

I think this is simply too good, especially the Veteran Auxiliaries.

I think allowing 1 in 3 an auxiliary squads to upgrade to the equivalent of a single heavy bolter or up to 2 grenade launchers would suffice.
Have you considered comparing them to Firewarriors, perchance?

Assuming you take Carapace, they're 9pts per model, but with only a Str 4 gun. Yes, they're Ws and I 3... but as the Tau are a shooty army, not a close-combat army, that isn't really that useful.

These are not Guard. They do not have Guard options, nor Guard units, nor are they even strictly Gue'vesa! It is not valid to compare them to Guard.
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Old 31 Oct 2006, 13:57   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: TO Update: Shas'vesa Shan'al (Auxiliary Cadres)

Quote:
I see what you're getting at, but I'm not sure if it would work. Seems... well... overly complex.

How about a weapon that anyone hit counts as being in Difficult Terrain from then on? Perhaps make it some form of "Graviton Gun", able to damage people as well as slow them down?
It is a bit complex. Hmm, making them count as Dificult Terrain would work better, as then it represents the affected units ability to struggle through the graviton rays/whatever.

I do like the lure one, as it provides an interesting twist to deployment, which could dictate where the enemy places a unit, and can also represent the lure "luring" the enemy force into postion, only to find out that a Tau army is waiting for them.

Definatly stick to the Fire Warrior pattern, with regards to specials, otherwise they will just be a guard unit in a tau army, which is wrong.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dal'yth Dude
Even the lesser auxiliaries have better weapons than a Guardsman without any apparent downsides. 7 points is close to a Guardsman. Heck the rifle is better than a bolter!

I think this is simply too good, especially the Veteran Auxiliaries.

I think allowing 1 in 3 an auxiliary squads to upgrade to the equivalent of a single heavy bolter or up to 2 grenade launchers would suffice.

But bear in mind, they are not guard, they are not even close. Heck, Guard in tau are Gue'vesa, these guys mostly won't even be human!

They are inferior compared with Fire Warriors, but add a nice twist to the army in general.
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Old 31 Oct 2006, 14:27   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: TO Update: Shas'vesa Shan'al (Auxiliary Cadres)

Okay, how's about this...

One unit of Shas'vesa may be upgraded to a "Lure" squad at +3pts per model. They become a Fast Attack choice, and replace their Rifles with Graviton Guns.

Lure:
The Lure unit must be the first unit deployed by the Tau army. They follow all normal deployment rules.

In addition, the Lure unit may attempt to bait out an enemy unit. Choose any enemy Troop Choice on the board, which must take a Leadership test. If failed, the Tau player may move the unit up to 6" towards the Lure unit. Note that all the usual rules for Leadership apply (such as re-rolls or bonuses from other units).


Graviton Gun:
Range: 36" Str: * Ap: - Type: Assault 2 OR Heavy 4.

The Graviton Gun does not function like a normal weapon. Instead, it is designed to suppress enemy movement.

Choose your target, and roll to hit as normal. Count the number of models in the unit (count Monstrous Creatures as 10). If the unit suffers half this number of hits, it counts as being in Difficult Terrain. If it takes equal to or more than this number of its, it is pinned, even if normally immune to pinning.

For example, a squad of ten Space Marines would count as being in Difficult Terrain if they took 5-9 hits, or Pinned if they took 10 or more.

Where fractions occur (eg: the unit is 9-man strong), round fractions up.


What do you think?
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