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Tau Newbie List, please help!
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Old 23 Dec 2004, 02:51   #1 (permalink)
Kroot Warrior
 
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Default Tau Newbie List, please help!

Hi, I am new to Tau and this is my first army list. Please rate it and feel free to give constructive criticism.

HQ; Commander Shas'el, missile pod, plasma rifle, multitracker, bonded, 95 pts

Elite; 3 crisis suits, missile pod, plasma rifle, multitracker, bonded, 205 pts
stealth team 5 normal, 1 team leader, bonded, 195 pts

Fast Attack; 7 pathfinders, 3 w/ rail rifles, 1 shas'ui, bonded
Devilfish, multitracker, targeting array, decoy launchers, 246 pts

Troop; 11 firewarriors, 6 pulse rifles, 1 shas'ui, bonded
Devilfish, multitracker, targeting array, decoy launchers, 240 pts

11 firewarriors, 6 pulse rifles, 1 shas'ui, bonded
Devilfish, multitracker, targeting array, decoy launchers, 240 pts

11 firewarriors, 1 shas'ui, bonded, 140 pts

11 firewarriors, 1 shas'ui, bonded, 140 pts

Heavy; Hammerhead, Railgun, smart missile system, multitracker, decoy launcher, 175 pts

Hammerhead, Railgun, smart missile system, multitracker, decoy launcher, 175 pts

Hammerhead, Ion Cannon, two burst cannon, multitracker, decoy launcher, 145 pts

Total; 1996 pts.

My plan is to use the army's mobility to counteract the enemy. I like the pathfinders first move and I will be moving the devilfish 12 inches and disembarking them during that first movement before the game starts to get a good bead with the rail rifles. The 2 firewarrior squads provide a static defense with the crisis suits right next to them. Everything else will be on a search and destroy and then retreat mission. At least that is my plan, lol.
As a note, the friends I play with have the following armies Black Templar (he uses 2 rhinos and a landraider and 2 assault squads), World Eaters (he doesnt use transports just gives his squads talisman of burning blood, has a defiler and a dreadnaught w/2 cc arms), Dark Eldar (he has alot of raiders, relies on them for getting his incubi or whatever they are called into combat fast) and lastly an iron warriors army (he has a defiler, predator annihilator, havocs with autocannons and obliterators and terminators, this guy never moves anything)
I'm going for a list that will work half decent for each of those armies, I know that for the most part they represent the extremes of close combat and shooty. We always play 2000 pt battles. I am not a newbie to 40k, i play pure grey knight demonhunters, biel ten eldar, necrons and a shooty dark angels army. I win 3/4 of the time with my other armies however, I don't know my butt from a hole in the ground when it comes to tau tactics, units and what works and what doesn't. I've been reading the forums and gathering information so any comments will be greatly appreciated.
The tau models I own include 62 fire warriors 11 of which have pulse carbines, 10 pathfinders 3 of which have rail rifles, 10 stealth suits, 7 crisis suits all with plasma rifle and missile pod, 5 devilfish, 3 hammerheads, 3 broadsides, 16 gun drones and 10 kroot. So if you have any suggestions for what else to do, those are the models I have to work with (thank you ebay and bartertown).
Thx for taking the time to read and reply and sorry I made it so long, just wanted to give you a good idea what I want to do and what I have to do it with.
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Old 23 Dec 2004, 03:02   #2 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Tau Newbie List, please help!

Ok but whats with all the bonded stuff. If the commander Shas'el has no bodyguards... why is he bonded? There is no-one for him to bond with.

Oh and no offence but 3 HH is powergaming by most ppls standards.

I would drop the bonding and add kroot. Also drop an HH. 3 in that army. Yikes. Kroot are good meat shields as you run away.

And DRONES. You have no drones. Drones are very good. Not in firewarrior squads but attatched to suits and as squadrons they form important battlefield roles. You are maxed out on some stuff there and missing others. I think youl run right into the dirt or be accused of powergaming big time. Round your army more. More kroot and drones and perhaps another unit of suits and FCWs for that many HHs. Or drop an HH and get drones. Either way that is an unbalanced army as is. Mobile yes but unbalanced. Drones, Kroot meat shields, Another unit of FCWs and a few more XV8 suits would do that army good.
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Old 23 Dec 2004, 03:12   #3 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Tau Newbie List, please help!

if you drop a hammerhead throw some seeker missiles on the tanks or take more crisis suits....

if anyone puts alot of tanks on the table and you only have 2 shots that can do anything you'll have a few problems...
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Old 23 Dec 2004, 03:55   #4 (permalink)
Kroot Warrior
 
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Default Re: Tau Newbie List, please help!

The last thing I want to be accused of is powergaming. I wasn't aware that it was thought of as power gaming to have 3 hammerheads. Noone I play with has a tau army so I just assumed that since they were a fairly "shooty" army it would be no different than a gaurd army taking 3 leman russ's? The bonding is a waste on the leader, I just reread the codex, I had it confused with the erethreal's ability to allow a reroll for leadership, whoops! Do seeker missiles really work out alright? Should I put alot on one devilfish or spread them out? Do I just use the pathfinders solely for seeker missiles or do you recommend having a markerlight on the fire warrior leader? I don't really want to use kroot as I only have 10 and everything I read says take 20. Which hammerhead should I drop, one with a railgun or the ion cannon one? If I put drones on the crisis suits should I drop the multitracker and get bitz to make them twin linked plasma rifles? With gun drones do you use them as cannon fodder or keep them back? Thanks for the advice!
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Old 23 Dec 2004, 06:37   #5 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Tau Newbie List, please help!

Ok, to allay your fears, 3 HH is only powering if its in 1000pts, 2000pts its fine ;D

at an ninitial glance I am very impressed with your list although it needs some tweaks for more efficiency w/ those armies its by far the best I've seen from a new player in my time here.

HQ; Commander Shas'el, missile pod, plasma rifle, multitracker, bonded, 95 pts
yeah the bonding is kinda stupid as there is no option to bond the commander ;D +10pts

Elite; 3 crisis suits, missile pod, plasma rifle, multitracker, bonded, 205 pts

Stealth team 5 normal, 1 team leader, bonded, 195 pts
ok, the Team leader on the stealths is also pointless , but keep the bonding, so invaluable. +5pts
Crisis are almost perfect.


Fast Attack; 7 pathfinders, 3 w/ rail rifles, 1 shas'ui, bonded
Devilfish, multitracker, targeting array, decoy launchers, 246 pts
only suggestion is drop the Target array, a BS 4 BC isnt worth it +5pts

Troop; 11 firewarriors, 6 pulse rifles, 1 shas'ui, bonded
Devilfish, multitracker, targeting array, decoy launchers, 240 pts

11 firewarriors, 6 pulse rifles, 1 shas'ui, bonded
Devilfish, multitracker, targeting array, decoy launchers, 240 pts

11 firewarriors, 1 shas'ui, bonded, 140 pts

11 firewarriors, 1 shas'ui, bonded, 140 pts
ok, some minor niggles, I assume that the "rifles"mean carbines.. drop them, RF is better +10pts
than pinning that wont happen vs those opponents. drop the T.arrays on the fishes.


Heavy; Hammerhead, Railgun, smart missile system, multitracker, decoy launcher, 175 pts

Hammerhead, Railgun, smart missile system, multitracker, decoy launcher, 175 pts

Hammerhead, Ion Cannon, two burst cannon, multitracker, decoy launcher, 145 pts
ok, even vs. marines the railgun is often better (exeption: terminators) so drop the ion for a railgun to add more tankbusta vs DE and templars (tankbusting looks to be the gamebreaker vs these armies. and when the tanks are gone the pie plate of the railgun kills just as many marines(doesnt scatter) as the ion cannonn on average. so use the points freed up to upgrade to railgun


ok so only a few minor changes in there, just some efficiency issues. next comes how I would make it.
so personally those pathfindes would make better use as a 20 man squad of kroot to guard the semi-static FW base (140pts) and 2 more fireknife suits made possible by dropping the SMS on the HH (130pts). thats just my take but IMO its better for the armies you play vs as the kroots really do swamp marines in 4thed as with all models in 2"getting full attacks its actually possible to get all 60 of the kroots attacks on the marines which will fail some saves ;D adn the crisis IMO will make better marine hunters aswell as serving to pop raiders vs the DE (once their footslogging it they are FW meat).

my favourite tacticis to fly the 'Fish within 12"(just, so maybe 9" in or 10"if i need to be safe) and unload the FW behind the fish (turned it sideways) and RF the opposition then even though i just shot under my skimmer they cant assault under it ;D, evil but fun. I assume you know how to IC hop the commander? I find it best if the mobile elements are never clustered together so as to split the attention but this must never override the crucial Tau doctrine"focus fire".

nice list, made some minor changes, good job, gets the seal of approval.
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Old 23 Dec 2004, 12:30   #6 (permalink)
Kroot Warrior
 
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Default Re: Tau Newbie List, please help!

Personally i dislike pathfinders, i can't find them useful but.... if you can go for it... O0

dizzygamer are u sure u can shoot under a devilfish? Do you know where is it said on the manual?
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Old 23 Dec 2004, 12:37   #7 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Tau Newbie List, please help!

yep, skimmers dont block LOS and thus you can fire under.

Cref.: pg. 20 BGB, uses an eldar falcon as example.
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Old 23 Dec 2004, 13:03   #8 (permalink)
Kroot Warrior
 
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Default Re: Tau Newbie List, please help!

Thanks for the reference....this is a great news for me > > >
Now i'll increase my devilfishes to 2 i think
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Old 23 Dec 2004, 13:53   #9 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Tau Newbie List, please help!

Okay Dizzy is a good army builder but on somethings we disagree.

He's Right Bonding a leader without bodyguards is pointless. Also make the MT hardwired and get him a sheild gen so he can live. If dice hate you take the BS5 guy, if dice are your friends take the BS 4 guy.

Devil fish with fire warriors in my opinion is a waste of points and a targeting array on one is a bigger waste. For the price of the 2 fish you could have 18 more firewarriors or a large group of Kroot. Dump the Pulse carbines too- Path finder job.

HH weapons- Ion cannons are great against power armored guys- they are worthless against terminators (they are ap 3 weapons). If i were you I'ld buy an extra turret sprue from GW and make 2 Ion and 2 Rail- this is what I did- Now you can switch between them based on who you are fighting. Ion for marines necrons and sisters, Rail for guard, tyranids, orcs, anyone who likes lots of vehicles and so forth. Also take a target lock for your tanks- especially the Rail ones so they can fire the missiles at a separate target-Rail shoots tank, missiles shot infantry. its only 5 points.

Your crisis suits are good all-purpose configs, Later you can make opponant- specific crisis suits- anti marine ones with TL PLasma, anti-nid ones with burst and flamer and so forth.

Diz is right about the squad leaders and markerlights, dump them, you have path finders for that.
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Old 23 Dec 2004, 14:36   #10 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Tau Newbie List, please help!

For ease of typing feel free to acronymize ( ;D) my name to "DZG" nice and simple.

while my ego agrees I am a good army builder the clashes of opinion between me and Wolfie arise from differing views on the proper way to play Tau.
Wlolfie subscribes to the view of static firepower, which IMO is a worthless tactic (no offence) as it neglects the most useful squad in the whole army, firewarriors. they have the best infantry weapon in the game and flack armour, strong for only 10pts, however when left standing in the open their flak armour is insufficient protection as all the enemy guns can me brought to bear while leaving the vunerable units out of LOS.
mobile firewarriors however Gain the Ability to chose their battles and take advantage of openings in the opponents battle lines and isolate units as well as the hugely sucessful Refused flank shock tacktic where the whole of the mobile army is brought to bear on a small part of the opponent at a time. the mobile squad also has the fished BC and drones for support along with the fish body itself to block charges and serve as a mobile peice of transparent terrain.

for these reasons the Fish IMHO is a Very Good Buy for Only 80pts.

on the Railgun vs ion issue: the railgun IMO is better as it kills tanks (the best thing we have for it) and kills marines at the same if not better rate than the ion, as well as being death to anything not marine or harder ;D and as this is an all purpose list as he hasnt stated opponents the Railgun is just a better choice than the ion cannon by merit of versatility (not even mentioning power)

TL IMO is a waste as I take BC only because I am required to do so as I belive in minimising and not spending points where they arent needed, also the only time I'll use the SMS more than the railgun is when I'm out of LOS, no point spending 30pts if you dont have to IMO (thats a stealth or 3 FW that die if the HH bites it aswell).

Good luck
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