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Pathfinder's fish
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Old 10 Aug 2006, 10:42   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Pathfinder's fish

Does anyone else think that the Pathfinder's fish is a stupid idea probably included for the sole purpose of selling more models?

I mean it is completley preventative of smaller, tactical Pathfinder squads and it is almost entirely useless.
I would be happy to take Pathfinders; if only they didn't have the mandatory Devilfish!
It costs 80 points minimum and by the time pathfinders board, travel a reasonable distance, disembark and then wait 'till they can fire again, the game is over (remember this only happens by the time the enemy get close to your lines).

I only have one modle which I would like to use for my warriors but instead I am forced to either waste it on my Pathfinders or not take the PFs.

I was thinking of just paying the eighty points but not using the model, just throwing eighty points away so that I can Mech my FWs.

I was wondering what other people feel about this rule and how you use your mandatory 'fish.

-drodgers
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Old 10 Aug 2006, 12:55   #2 (permalink)
Kroot Warrior
 
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Default Re: Pathfinder's fish

While the rule is a little dumb i dont think its going to be changed in the near future.
This is the exact reason why i dont take pathfinders...Two expensive for theirs markerlight hits while i can just load up some other of my units with them.
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Old 10 Aug 2006, 13:09   #3 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Pathfinder's fish

If you don't like it don't take pathfinders.

Personally I think it's cool. The fish helps justify their Fast attack slot, keeps them from being ridiculously overpowering and it aids deep striking troops.

Remember you don't need to deploy the pathfinders in the fish, you can deploy the troops and transport seperatley.

Put the pathfinders down where ever you want to and just use the fish as a great distraction. It's non-scoring so it doesn't matter if they kill it.

As for the claim that it was done "...for the sole purpose of selling more models?" all I can say is don't be absurd.

People are quick to attack GW claiming that every single one of their actions is to get more money. It's not, they're trying to make a game that's as balanced, fun and interesting as possible. Yes they want to make money doing that but that doesn't effect codex options!
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Old 10 Aug 2006, 13:28   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Pathfinder's fish

I would think that it's fluffy to include a Devilfish, and justify its position as a Fast Attack Choice.

The Forward Scouts rule was neat, especially when they could use it with their DF in 3rd Ed.

And balance seems like another reason too - if we could take Pathfinders on their own - they would essentially be treated as "Fire Warriors" that pay a few extra points of Markerlights! What's more, you can add Rail Rifles, and really just loadup on Rail Rifles for a ridiculously small cost.

Otherwise, what Falstead said above
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Old 10 Aug 2006, 13:37   #5 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Pathfinder's fish

Heya,

I don't think it's stupid, nor a means to attempt to force more sales upon clients.

Quote:
I mean it is completley preventative of smaller, tactical Pathfinder squads and it is almost entirely useless.
I would be happy to take Pathfinders; if only they didn't have the mandatory Devilfish!
For starters, if this were possible, then everyone would be buying and probably maxing out small, inexpensive squads of Pathfinders and not bothering with a lot of things. They would just be small tiny 4man to 6man teams with rail rifles, ducking in cover. And if that were the case, not having to have a transport, then they would not have any place being a Fast Attack. They would no doubt become a Heavy Support if that happened and.... well, oh look.... Sniper Drones.

Quote:
It costs 80 points minimum and by the time pathfinders board, travel a reasonable distance, disembark and then wait 'till they can fire again, the game is over (remember this only happens by the time the enemy get close to your lines).
I think you simply haven't been using your Pathfinders in a productive way. From the sound of it, deployment and use of the Scout rule are simply not being used well. That doesn't make the unit bad.

Quote:
I was thinking of just paying the eighty points but not using the model, just throwing eighty points away so that I can Mech my FWs.

I was wondering what other people feel about this rule and how you use your mandatory 'fish.
I would invite you to think about your Devilfish in another way. Think of this: You're buying pathfinders, that's good. What if you had the option to just buy a Devilfish, for no reason, that could be upgraded to a Warfish and was always fielded no matter what at the beginning of games? What if you treated it like it was a heavy support tank? What if you treated it like a baby brother to a Hammerhead, and you could just take them? That's what they truly are you know. Your Pathfinders and the Devilfish are separate units. The only thing is, you cannot transport any other units other than the Pathfinders (though really you shouldn't be transporting them anyways typically), and the Fish is not a scoring unit. But it's still a separate unit that you can do whatever you want with! You can't ignore the ability to bring a battle tank to the board, especially if you're playing a mechanized style of play. That's one more tank.

Anyhow, I think maybe an attitude change or a different way to think about things would help you perhaps.

So, I invite you to read the following:

[size=12pt]Pathfinder Teams ~ Tau 2.0, reLoaded[/size]

It's all about how you look at it.

Cheers!
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Old 10 Aug 2006, 14:11   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Pathfinder's fish

With the investment of some more points to the attached Devilfish, you can get an effective fire support platform. Add a couple of Seekers for that first turn strike, and substitute the Gun Drones for the SMS, and just keep firing missiles from a safe location. Deep Strike reserve Crisis Suits to support your Pathfinders.
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Old 10 Aug 2006, 14:39   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Pathfinder's fish

Quote:
Originally Posted by .mace
The Forward Scouts rule was neat, especially when they could use it with their DF in 3rd Ed.
What do you mean? I thought that Pathfinders still count as scouts and therefore are on the board no matter what the scenario.
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Old 10 Aug 2006, 14:43   #8 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Pathfinder's fish

Quote:
Originally Posted by KCKitsune
Quote:
Originally Posted by .mace
The Forward Scouts rule was neat, especially when they could use it with their DF in 3rd Ed.
What do you mean? I thought that Pathfinders still count as scouts and therefore are on the board no matter what the scenario.
Pathfinders are still scouts.

However the Tau FAQ that was (BRIEFLY) posted on the GW website said that the Scouts rule did not apply to the fish.

We're still waiting on a definitive FAQ, apparently it's "Coming soon"
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Old 10 Aug 2006, 14:48   #9 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Pathfinder's fish

i like to mount my devilfish with seekers and gun drones and try to get good angles on other tanks. affter doing that it probobly will go and bother a dev squad or if there isn't one a small tactical squad. people allways try to plasma death or glory me and i always take their plasma out... well at least dark angels anyways. if they have heavy bolters you can realy make them pay, cause they can't hurt you.
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Old 10 Aug 2006, 14:52   #10 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Pathfinder's fish

I never saw that FAQ about the scout move not applying to the Fish. That'd suck if true, but I could adapt. I'm rarely making that scout move forward anyway.

There really is one solid reason to take a PF team w/ DF, and that's the Marker Beacon on the DF. PFs are the only way to get one of those, and having the ability to re-roll a scatter die roll is super useful.

PFs I think remain the single most difficult unit to employ effectively in our army. But they're golden, and I love them, and I don't leave home without them.
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