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Tank Shock
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Old 09 Aug 2006, 10:24   #1 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Tank Shock

Under Tank Shock it says you can't go over your own units. This seems to suggest that you can't go under/over another skimmer when you do this.

Just something else to prove you can't do the FF. Not that I thought for a second you could FF a unit on foot.
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Old 09 Aug 2006, 10:31   #2 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Tank Shock

Eh?

If you're refering to the Fish of Fury (FoF) - you're not supposed to be placing your own units under the Devilfish anyway, seeing as it's a little.. illegal by the rules. You can however, shoot under skimmers, which is what is happening in the FoF. Other than that, it just blocks movement both ways.

Otherwise I'm a little lost at what you mean by FF.
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Old 09 Aug 2006, 11:36   #3 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: Tank Shock

I think he means the Feeding Frenzy tactic Israfel40 concocted in the recent Pirahna tactics thread. But I don't really understand why its necesarry just to make a topic to say to say something doesn't work.

Though I will make the point that I think the feeding frenzy was meant for the pirahnas to encircle the unit as such. Where the {p}s are pirahnas and the ^ is the tank shocking unit, x is the enemy unit being shocked.

* **{p}
{p} x {p}*
* * *^

x has no where to go, therefore it would be destroyed. But I don't think its wise bringing this topic up when the parties involved with dissecting the tactic got the previous thread closed through the veritable 'feeding frenzy' they themselves had with it.
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Old 09 Aug 2006, 12:16   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Tank Shock

Feeding Frenzy eh? *searches*

Ahhh, I see.

Well upon closer inspection, the original thread was locked, thus this thread I guess. Nonetheless, it looks like the rules to that tactic were the point of an ongoing debate in that thread, no need for more here. However this thread doesn't appear to prove or disprove the legality of the tactic, if I'm not mistaken you could just declare the tankshock and make it successfully without having to move into or through the friendly Piranha models?
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Old 09 Aug 2006, 12:28   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Tank Shock

Gafgarion has the right of it, that is how FF works. Whether or not it's legal, is a discussion we'll have to wait for, as official ruling by GW has been sought.
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Old 09 Aug 2006, 13:16   #6 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: Tank Shock

GW is not going to say anything on Feeding Freenzy. They are going to say read your rulebook it is in there. I can tell this site is new. Everyone who plays 40k should know that you never call Games Workshop for a rules question. First of all the Rulz Boyz are just people like you and me that read the rules and tell you what they think. They are not the game designers and do not know the intent of the rules. You have had more than 1 top 100 player in the US tell you how it works. Some of you still argue that FF is legal when it is not.

I have just showed you that you can't do the FF with a Skimmer passing under or over another skimmer. This means that there is an opening in this tactic. That opening is the escape route the squad being tank shocked would go through.

So as I said Feeding Frenzy doesn't work on troops on foot.
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Old 09 Aug 2006, 14:53   #7 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: Tank Shock

I think it's clear that TauCaptain doesn't understand the Feeding Frenzy idea as Israfel suggested it.

My understanding of FF was that, with the piranha's a "U" shape was created (as diagrammed above), and that the Devilfish was driven INTO the "U", providing the enemy unit with nowhere to move to, legally, and that the unit was therefore destroyed even before they could make a leadership check.

Tank shock rules in the book say specifically that a unit is not Tank Shocked unless some of its models end up under the vehicle being used to "shock," and that AFTER the models are moved away the shortest possible distance to be safe (maintaining unit coherency), the units leadership is checked. After a successful leadership check, the unit may attempt Death or Glory.

Anyway, here's another way of wondering what happens when Feeding Frenzy is used : What happens if you Tank Shock a unit in a dead-end alley in Cities of Death?

______
| X X X |
| X X |
| |
| ^ |
| || |



If the tank is travelling into the alley (represented by the <=) and the unit is in the alley (represented by the X's), what happens to the unit if the tank comes to rest on top of them? Assume, for the sake of arguement, that the alley is less than 2" wider than the tank model, meaning that the unit may not legally move past the tank.
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Old 09 Aug 2006, 16:03   #8 (permalink)
Ethereal
 
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Default Re: Tank Shock

We should see if GW has any replies to Israfel's query before the "Feeding Frenzy" gets turned back over to rules lawyering. I don't want to have to lock this one, too.

You can not perform a Tank Shock if the path of the vehicle will take you over any of your own models.

The Tank Shock rules represent two different scenarios. Neither one involves the vehicle actually ramming troops. If they break, the unit runs away from the tank, getting caught in the crossfire if they are surrounded by enemy troops. If they hold, they simply move out of the path of the tank by any means available, which may lead to them ending up behind the tank. People are considering the Tank Shock as if the tank were simply pushing the enemy in front of them, and this is not how it was originally described.
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Old 09 Aug 2006, 16:07   #9 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: Tank Shock

Oh my. I going to be nice and not insult people.

If you have a U you have an opening in it. If you have an opening you have a way for the squad you are tank shocking to get out. How more clear can this be put.

YOU CAN"T TANK SHOCK A UNIT ON FOOT AND KILL THEM IF THEY MAKE THEIR LEADERSHIP TEST.
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Old 09 Aug 2006, 16:30   #10 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Tank Shock

TauCaptain has the righ answer IMO. Also, as stated before this could be incredablely cheesy this was legal. Besides, in the skimmer rules, it is stated that they could pass over enemy troops if they want. So in tank shock, why can't the enemy just duck and get out of harm's way?

Anyway, this thread has served it's purpose. Just like the other FF thread, it will desolve into piontless argument.
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