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My Tank-less army...thoughts and suggestions please!
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Old 03 Aug 2006, 14:59   #1 (permalink)
Kroot Warrior
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 26
Default My Tank-less army...thoughts and suggestions please!

There is another Tau player in the group I game with, who is running a mechanized list that has been so dominating, no one wants to play against him anymore. Or Tau for that matter. Which kind of put me in a bad position.

So I thought, to be different, and to get games with the other player who are sick of being destroyed by 7-8 Tau tanks, I would create a "Tank-less list". Your thoughts and suggestions are appreciated.

HQ

Shas 'O with FP, MP, PR, hard wired MT and TL
2 Body Guards, both with FB, MP and HW Drone Controllers
4 Shield drones
(My thought here was without a multitude of skimmers to draw enemy fire, I needed an HQ that could not only stay safe, but also draw and absorb fire away from the more fragile units. So I sacrificed the commanders IC status, making sure you would have to go through drones and bodyguards to get to him.)

Troops

2 groups of 12 fire Warriors, with EMP grenades
12 Kroot, 2 Kroot hounds and Shaper
(I am not completely sold on the idea of the EMP grenades, but figured I'd try them just in case an enemy decided to get too close with a tank or transport. The Kroot are simply there to work some assault-ty goodness.)

Elites

6 Stealth Suits (or possibly heavy drones)
3 Crisis Suits- 3 MP, 1 FB, 1 BC, 2 PR, all with MT
(The stealth (or drones) are for anti-infantry, but not sure which is the smarter buy for this list. For the crisis suits, I try to configure them so that they are able to fill just about any purpose on the battlefield at a moments notice. Rather than over-specializing them, I like to use them to plug "holes" in my army as they arise.)

Fast

3 Piranhas, with FB, TL, decoys, and targeting array
(Basically, my tank hunters...with a free gun drone squadron at no extra charge.)

Heavy

2 groups of 2 Broadsides, with SMS and advanced stabilization. The leaders have a hard wired drone controller with 2 shield drones.

(Without Railheads, these guys are supplying all my railgun needs. The 2+ save being passed on to the drones helps keep these guys safe, and the 4+ invun. save helps keep the heavy stuff from cutting me up. Even with lascannons, you have 2 drones to get through first)



So far this list has been pretty effective, but against relatively in-experienced players so far. What do you guys think, I don't want to be caught completely by surprise if I run this against someone who is a little more competitive.

Thoughts?
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Old 03 Aug 2006, 16:08   #2 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: My Tank-less army...thoughts and suggestions please!

maybe take out the emp on the troops, you've already got lots of vehicle killing. Maybe add some vespid or sniper drone teams if you like. Other than that looks like quite an effective list. ;D
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Old 03 Aug 2006, 17:57   #3 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 114
Default Re: My Tank-less army...thoughts and suggestions please!

Everything looks pretty good, but heres my 2 cents, incase you wanted to know it

On the HQ unit, it seems like you are using expensive crisis suit body guards as shield drones. You do have an extra elite spot so you can add the body guards to that slot and save some points. I would move the suits to the elite spot and put the sheild drones on the HQ if you are really worried. You might also consider cutting back on the shield drones.

Troops look decent. The EMPs are hit and miss. An expensive hit or miss. I use them sometimes because I get tank shocked lots. I have never lost the morale tests either so lots of times I have a tank sitting in my infantry > I would ditch the shaper, he really isnt doing anything. Hes 21 points pretty much wasted.

If you happen to like my advice, which is not nessicary , you could probably run a extra squad of Firewarriors, an extra crisis, more broadsides, etc.

To me it just seems like that HQ unit is freakishly expensive. You are running 62 models for what looks like a 1500+ pts game. Im usually running like 80ish, but I might be the crazy one.

Good luck with your army!
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Old 03 Aug 2006, 18:49   #4 (permalink)
Kroot Warrior
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
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Default Re: My Tank-less army...thoughts and suggestions please!

Quote:
Originally Posted by computerizedfish
Everything looks pretty good, but heres my 2 cents, in case you wanted to know it

On the HQ unit, it seems like you are using expensive crisis suit body guards as shield drones. You do have an extra elite spot so you can add the body guards to that slot and save some points. I would move the suits to the elite spot and put the shield drones on the HQ if you are really worried. You might also consider cutting back on the shield drones....

...To me it just seems like that HQ unit is freakishly expensive.
That is something that I have heard before....and yes, to an extent I am using my bodyguards as high-cost shields for the commander, but they do serve more of a purpose than that. With the shield drones connected to them, they are reasonably protected themselves. I am also obsessed with "balancing" my crisis suits for use in any situation...the commander is armed with mostly anti-infantry firepower (with the exception of his missile pd for light vehicles) so the bodyguards bring some serious anti-tank capabilities to the unit. As they are set now....

If I need to take out Infantry: 5 shots from the Cyclonic Ion blaster, 6 from missile pods, and 2 from fusion blaster = 13 attacks, many wounding on 2+

For heavily armored troops: 6 missile pods, 2 plasma and 2 fusion blasters = 10 hits, 4 of which negating armor saves

For Tanks, 6 shots from the missiles, and 2 fusion blasters = 8 shots, two of which get 2d6 armor pen.

Generally, a KILLER unit that will be effective no matter what situation it is in.


Thats what I'm thinking anyway, but I was never any good at determining whether point costs are worth it. I do see what you mean about being able to take the bodyguards as elites though...but if I do that it will negate their effect as juggernaut of a target that will draw fire away from my less protected units. Also, I'll see them two less effective, separate units (silly I know, but thats how I'll see it). If they are one unit, the shield drones bought for the Body guards will protect all three suits, Commander included.

So what do you think, does this unit config justify the cost for this kind of list, or am I wasting too many points on this concept?
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Old 03 Aug 2006, 19:12   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: binghamton NY
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Default Re: My Tank-less army...thoughts and suggestions please!

The CIB has the chance to get AP1 too. I like that list. If you would have posted it earlier on then I might have avoided buying tanks. I just can't part with them now, though...
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Old 03 Aug 2006, 19:46   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 114
Default Re: My Tank-less army...thoughts and suggestions please!

Ok, so heres my idea:

Keep the Shas'o exactly like you have it. Get rid of the body guards and and two shield drones. Move the body guards to the elite spot. Keep them equipped as you have but take a shield drone away from each of them. So far we have knocked off 50 pts.

Now, I think we should get rid of the shaper. From what I can tell he isnt doing anything that important except for taking up 21 pts. If you decide to do that we now have 71 pts to work with.

As, I re-look over your list, I see that you have Target Locks on your Piranhas. That makes me think that they are all in one group. If they are I would suggest moving them into seperate "monat" groups. I would do this not only to save the pts on the TL but if one of them happens to get stunned or imobilized or something you would have to sacrifice it to keep moving or risk sitting there for it to wear off. If you decide to do this we now have 86 pts to play with.

With those pts I would add a new crisis to your new elite squad. Even if you kit it really expensive you should have enough pts to get what weapons you want and another shield drone.

Now, you have three crisis suits with three shield drones that could walk in front of your shas'o. This would be a tough unit to kill and the commander would be protected by its IC status.

It could be a crazy idea, but you get an extra suit ;D
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Old 03 Aug 2006, 20:35   #7 (permalink)
Kroot Warrior
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
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Default Re: My Tank-less army...thoughts and suggestions please!

Quote:
Originally Posted by computerizedfish
OK, so heres my idea:

Keep the Shas'o exactly like you have it.* Get rid of the body guards and and two shield drones.* Move the body guards to the elite spot.* Keep them equipped as you have but take a shield drone away from each of them.* So far we have knocked off 50 pts.

Now, I think we should get rid of the shaper.* From what I can tell he isnt doing anything that important except for taking up 21 pts.* If you decide to do that we now have 71 pts to work with.

As, I re-look over your list, I see that you have Target Locks on your Piranhas.* That makes me think that they are all in one group.* If they are I would suggest moving them into seperate "monat" groups.* I would do this not only to save the pts on the TL but if one of them happens to get stunned or imobilized or something you would have to sacrifice it to keep moving or risk sitting there for it to wear off.* If you decide to do this we now have 86 pts to play with.

With those pts I would add a new crisis to your new elite squad.* Even if you kit it really expensive you should have enough pts to get what weapons you want and another shield drone.

Now, you have three crisis suits with three shield drones that could walk in front of your shas'o.* This would be a tough unit to kill and the commander would be protected by its IC status.

It could be a crazy idea, but you get an extra suit ;D
Believe me I'm not attached to the shaper..I only started using Kroot for the first time with this list (sooner or later I'm going to have to post my "Fire-Strikers" unit....they count as Kroot...but they are Tau with lightsabers)

Its a good idea, adding the extra suit...It seems to me that the "Bodyguards" whose job it is supposed to be to "protect" the Shas O' actually end up making him far more vulnerable by making him targetable...ironic, is it not?* ;D

The only problem I see, is that I was only able to equip my bodygaurds as they are because they are an HQ choice...They each have two weapons, and a multitracker (I may have forgotten to mention that) with a hard wired drone controller. As I recall I'm only able to HW the unit leader in a standard elite Crisis squad. I could just give the leader his 2 drones, and do without the third...

And you know I hadn't even noticed I don't have any other fasts on this list...so I might as well make the piranhas monat units....come to think of It, I see virtually no advantage to keeping them as a single unit! Seriously..is there ANY advantage at all to grouping them???

Thanks for the great suggestions guys!

(PS. Tanks ARE fun too..this is just the most recentlist I've made..I have somewhere around 5000 points of Tau total, and I've never regretted using my tanks!)
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Old 03 Aug 2006, 22:48   #8 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 114
Default Re: My Tank-less army...thoughts and suggestions please!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Surge38
Believe me I'm not attached to the shaper..I only started using Kroot for the first time with this list (sooner or later I'm going to have to post my "Fire-Strikers" unit....they count as Kroot...but they are Tau with lightsabers)

Its a good idea, adding the extra suit...It seems to me that the "Bodyguards" whose job it is supposed to be to "protect" the Shas O' actually end up making him far more vulnerable by making him targetable...ironic, is it not? ;D

The only problem I see, is that I was only able to equip my bodygaurds as they are because they are an HQ choice...They each have two weapons, and a multitracker (I may have forgotten to mention that) with a hard wired drone controller. As I recall I'm only able to HW the unit leader in a standard elite Crisis squad. I could just give the leader his 2 drones, and do without the third...

And you know I hadn't even noticed I don't have any other fasts on this list...so I might as well make the piranhas monat units....come to think of It, I see virtually no advantage to keeping them as a single unit! Seriously..is there ANY advantage at all to grouping them???
well, you can take out the shaper and add 3 extra kroot. YAY! more kroot!

.... I guess you can keep the HQ they way you want it :P The multi-tracker kinda screws up my idea.

The only reason you group the piranhas is if you run pathfinders and also vespid

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Old 04 Aug 2006, 10:55   #9 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Melbourne
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Default Re: My Tank-less army...thoughts and suggestions please!

Give the Broadside leaders a HWTL.
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Old 04 Aug 2006, 17:22   #10 (permalink)
Ethereal
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 18,087
Default Re: My Tank-less army...thoughts and suggestions please!

I would also split one of the 2-man Broadside teams into two seperate units. One of the key concepts in the Tau army is maximizing your Force Organization Chart. Since we can take more single-model scoring units than anybody else, it pays to take advantage of this fact. This saves you points on Target Locks, protects you from a single Devastator Squad or its equivalent wiping out two suits in a turn, allows you to split your forces more precisely, protects you from assaults, gives you more scoring units in a pinch, wards off Last-Man-Standing tests, etc. The list just goes on and on. If you are not using all of your specialist FOC slots, you should be asking yourself why not. Troops, on the other hand, are better off maximized or close to it.
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