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Rules question for discussion - measuring range from vehicles
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Old 20 Jun 2006, 17:48   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Rules question for discussion - measuring range from vehicles

I have a question regarding the rules for Warhammer 40K that i'm hoping you could help me clear up in preparation for my attendance at this years GT.

My question concerns vehicle shooting.

In the rule book it makes mention of measuring distances from the main body of a vehicle (Page 6 below the sub heading, bases).

However in the vehicles section of the rule book (Page 64 under the heading vehicle line of sight) it states that the LOS is drawn from the weapon mounting. The wording of the rule also seems to state that this is where the shot is coming from (As does a degree of common sense). This therefore leads me to believe that this is also where range should be measured from.

Although it seems a small matter it can have some quite large impacts on a game, especially at a tournament where the points are tight. For example a falcon measuring it's range gains 3-4" if measuring it's range from the tip of it's wings (Body of the vehicle interpretation, following the guidlines on page 6) as opposed to one measuring from the vehicle mounting. The "Body of the vehicle" interpretation of said rule also allows the firer to measure his range inconsistantly from whichever edge of the vehicle is closest to the enemy - thereby giving him an advantage that i feel is unfairly gained, rather than from the same point every time.


Thoughts?
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Old 20 Jun 2006, 17:59   #2 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: Rules question for discussion - measuring range from vehicles

the thing is though, the majority of vehicals, the person who spots the guys they are shooting as in located at the centre of the model, so that where distance to see is started

but los is form the guns because they are at a slightly different possision and because the los is different than the view position you have to take in account both.
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Old 20 Jun 2006, 18:02   #3 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Rules question for discussion - measuring range from vehicles

Gunners are located in the turret besides the gun normally.

Also since LOS isn't an issue - because we are told to take it from the weapon - surely that's where range should be measured from as well.
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Old 20 Jun 2006, 18:06   #4 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Rules question for discussion - measuring range from vehicles

I've always been fairly sure that you measure distance to shoot from the gun, as well as LOS. I guess if it's ambiguous in the rules, you have to use common sense, which would be that you measure from the gun.
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Old 20 Jun 2006, 19:58   #5 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Rules question for discussion - measuring range from vehicles

I would say that it should be messure form the gun mounting because that is where the shot originated. For example on a skyray the shot should come from the markerlight on the wing. Like in all rules they should be agreed upon by the two players as to where the shoot originated from.
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Old 20 Jun 2006, 20:15   #6 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Rules question for discussion - measuring range from vehicles

Don't forget that our models represent the general location of our models. The distance a rail round can go isn't EXACTLY 72". Its not like the round disappears at that point. The origin of the shot comes from the body to represent the vehicles general ability to seek the target. The los is drawn from the actual gun barrel because, even tho the driver or sighter can see the enemy, the barrel might be blocked by a large rock or other object.

If you measure both from the weapon, you are going to have custom vehicles with the barrels sticking WAY out in front.

What do you do about the whirlwind for example. The weapon mount is way in back of the vehicle. While in contrast, the tau vehicles barrels are very long, even going past the actual hull.
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Old 20 Jun 2006, 20:17   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Rules question for discussion - measuring range from vehicles

Guys, you need to follow the rules.

You measure distance from the hull (Page 6 BBB)

You check LOS from the weapon mounting (Page 64 BBB)

That is how it is done. If you want to do it another way you'll need your opponant's permission.
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Old 20 Jun 2006, 20:52   #8 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Rules question for discussion - measuring range from vehicles

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doctor Thunder
Guys, you need to follow the rules.

You measure distance from the hull (Page 6 BBB)

You check LOS from the weapon mounting (Page 64 BBB)

That is how it is done. If you want to do it another way you'll need your opponant's permission.
exactly
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Old 20 Jun 2006, 21:15   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Rules question for discussion - measuring range from vehicles

That is true, strictly speaking from the rules you measure from the hull and check LOS from the actual weapon.

However personally this makes no sense to me and everywhere I play range is almost always measured from the gun itself. This may not be following the rules to a T but everyone I have met does the same thing and nobody complains. If someone did I would of course cease but the general consensus that I find is that players would rather stick to sense and just measure from the gun barrel. Its simpler in many cases aswell as from the hull can lead to quite a few unessesary arguments.
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Old 20 Jun 2006, 22:52   #10 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Rules question for discussion - measuring range from vehicles

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vash113
Its simpler in many cases aswell as from the hull can lead to quite a few unessesary arguments.
Since that is the way the game is played, those arguments are far from unecessary.

Being comfortable with the way you play is not the same thing as playing correctly.
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