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Monat vs Squad: What's best?
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Old 07 Jun 2006, 13:22   #1 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 445
Default Monat vs Squad: What's best?

I used to play squads of crisis suits. Lately, I've been trying the Monat route, and I quite like it. I used each HQ, Elite, and Heavy slot for a Monat suit at a tournament last weekend.



The Monat

Advantages
- No unit coherancy needed
- No target locks needed
- No bonding needed
- No Morale checks for shooting or Last Man Standing needed, unless using drones
- Easy to jump behind terrain with only one suit.
- Suit casualities don't cause other suits to fallback
- All suits can be team leaders with wargear access
- ICs get IC status
- Monats can shoot and assault independant targets
- Enemy Assaulters cannot assault units they did not shoot at, providing some protection from assault

Disadvantages
- Can't share 'O or 'El Leadership
- Can't share a couple shield drones with other suits
- Single suits don't use Markerlights effectively


The 2 Suit Squad

Advantages
- No bonding needed
- Loss of one suit still allows unit to regroup
- More efficient use of a slot
- Drones can protect more than one suit

Disadvantages
- Well, every advantage for Monats becomes a disadvantage for squads. Squads have to shoot the same target, make morale checks for enemy fire, etc.
- One kill means Last Man Standing tests every turn


The 3 Suit Squad

Advantages
- Most efficient use of a slot
- Drones can protect more than one suit
- Best usage of Markerlight support

Disadvantages
- Same as the 2 Suit Squad
- A single, surviving suit cannot regroup without bonding. In a squad with 3 suits and 2 drones, the loss of 2 drones and one suit appears to put the squad below half strength and unable to regroup without bonding, as the rules appear to apply to number of models, not total squad wounds like assault rules.
- Last suit has to make Last Man Standing tests.



Alright, so if anybody has some other advantages or disadvantages I haven't thought of, let me know. Also, if anybody has some good tactics specific to a squad of a certain size, let's add that too.

Monat Tactic 1: Against a player with assault troops, a squad means one assault target. Monats can be used together to draw assault troops, and then split up to prevent assault on all the suits. One suit can even be sacrificed by leaving it for assault troops, hoping that the suit with tie up the assaulters while other suits escape to a better position.
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Old 07 Jun 2006, 13:30   #2 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Monat vs Squad: What's best?

2 words:

Marker Light
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Old 07 Jun 2006, 14:43   #3 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Monat vs Squad: What's best?


I'd say a monat is better is smaller games as you can afford only one Crisis in a slot. In the higher point games you just need those Crisis suit's and you fill them up with 3.
Never ever use 2 man suit's, they only have to kill one to make you take the "last man standing" test.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Knight Actual
2 words:
Marker Light
What does that have to do with the squad or monat thingy?

Greetz
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Old 07 Jun 2006, 15:29   #4 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Monat vs Squad: What's best?

1 squad of 3 helios makes 5.9 killing hits with 2 mklights markers
3 squads of 1 helios would need 6.
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Old 07 Jun 2006, 16:17   #5 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Monat vs Squad: What's best?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pisces_808
I'd say a monat is better is smaller games as you can afford only one Crisis in a slot. In the higher point games you just need those Crisis suit's and you fill them up with 3.
Never ever use 2 man suit's, they only have to kill one to make you take the "last man standing" test.
Well, the last four games I played were 1700 points, and with three FW squads and a squad of Pathfinders, I was hard pressed to even fill my slots with Monats! I think with more points, I'd add more FW squads before anything else. Especially since I'm becoming such a Monat advocate!

I added your Last Man Standing comments. Thanks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Knight Actual
2 words:
Marker Light
Markerlights are already mentioned as an advantage, but I'll add it to Monat Disadvantages. I don't normally use Markerlights for Crisis suits, as I generally take 'Os and Targeting Arrays. Markerlights look better for Fire Warriors and Stealthsuits. And Broadsides(I hate missing with an 80 point unit).
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Old 07 Jun 2006, 16:54   #6 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Monat vs Squad: What's best?

Well recently I've been running a squad of 2 Deathrains. It's brilliant, very cheap, easy to hide, long range and a real terror for enemy vehichles.

In the last game I played some daemonettes got to close to them so rather than running I just moved up and dropped a pair of flamer templates on them to send them howling back to the warp. The next turn I did the same thing to a squad of noise marines.

So I'd heartily recomend this:

2 Crisis suits w/ twin-linked missile pods, flamers
94 points.

It's fantastic!
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Old 07 Jun 2006, 21:14   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Monat vs Squad: What's best?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Falstead
Well recently I've been running a squad of 2 Deathrains. It's brilliant, very cheap, easy to hide, long range and a real terror for enemy vehichles.

In the last game I played some daemonettes got to close to them so rather than running I just moved up and dropped a pair of flamer templates on them to send them howling back to the warp. The next turn I did the same thing to a squad of noise marines.

So I'd heartily recomend this:

2 Crisis suits w/ twin-linked missile pods, flamers
94 points.

It's fantastic!
Wow, a Tau player actually making use of a flame template. Amazing!* :sadnshocked:
No but seriously, I love Deathrain config., as you can see on my Commander- TL MP + AFP =*
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Old 07 Jun 2006, 21:32   #8 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Monat vs Squad: What's best?

The size of your Crisis and their configuration as such, should greatly depend on what you're doing with them.

For example, in a game where I have a medium Troop count like Fire Warriors and Kroot, and/or Stealth Suits who all have a single type of firepower and variable ranges, I will probably take less Crisis Suits, with more specific weapons for what I lack--such as Missile Pods, or Plasma for AP goodness.

However, in games where I'm not so interested in FireWarriors or Kroot to deal damage, and more in the mood to throw more Battlesuits on the board, I'm going to fill out my slots to pump up the damage, the resilience and of course.... the points.

So for example, a dedicated role:

Elite1 - 47 points.
XV8 x 1
-Twinlinked Missile Pods
-Flamer

Obviously a little monat like this is only going to do one thing really, and that's glance vehicles. When firing at infantry, while it's accurate, it's not a great use of the Elite slot.

Alternatively, if I go a bit harder on suits:

Elite1 - 190 points.
XV8 x 3
-Missile Pods
-Burst Cannons
-Multi-trackers
Team Leader
-Bonding, Hardwired Drone Controller
-2x Shield Drones

This is less dedicated, and a whole lot more expensive. However, it's also 15 shots that can take down infantry, or a little light vehicle action if need be. But more importantly, it's resilient. That's 8 wounds at T4 with 3+ saves. It's like a squad of 8x space marines, for example, in terms of resilience (the catch being they're more vulnerable to Str8+ attacks than marines). However, instead of moving around and slinging bolters--I can move, and output 15x dakka shots at good strength value, to hose infantry. Add a markerlight to the mix and it gets better and better.

Back to the Monat:

Elite2 - 53 points.
XV8 x 1
-Twinlinked Fusion Blaster
Targetting Array

Let's say I was packing this little variant of a sunforge to have a pretty reliable way to put a fusion ray into any facing of an armor value, or a hiding vehicle out of line of sight. Pretty useful, but also dedicated. Without such a target, it's not really efficient, as you're throwing 50+ points to one shot which is a waste if you're firing at a Guardsmen or something. Even if I sub in a flamer, it's a waste. But in it's dedicated role, it has a function and is well worth his place.

What if I wanted to go a different direction and make a full use of that Elite slot though?

Elite2 - 214 points.
XV8 x 3
-Plasma Rifle
-Burst Cannon
-Multi-trackers
Team Leader
-Bonding, Hardwired Drone Controller
-2x Shield Drones

Youch look at those points. However, again, we're talking about 8 wounds at T4 with 3+ saves. What do they do? They hose infantry, but even more tough infantry. They're closer range though on the other hand. Add a markerlight and things get incredibly deadly at close range. At a distance, ie: 18" range, we're looking at 4 shots per suit. When we get closer though, it becomes 5 shots per suit at 12" range. That's where a markerlight kicks in and you suddenly have some serious damage being pumped from that elite slot. Hosing terminators, hosing marines, and overkilling normal infantry that don't even get saves.

--- Anyhow, as you can see, it totally depends what you're doing. A squad is great at doing several things, such as survival, resilience and over all damage output. Monats are better at being built for a single task, and being used to accomplish that task. Typically monats are for taking out single targets, while a squad is more equipped to take out several types of targets.

--- It all just boils down to role and use.

Cheers!
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Old 08 Jun 2006, 13:25   #9 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Monat vs Squad: What's best?

Thanks, MalVeaux. Good points there.

I think the number of slots one has is still important to determine squad size. If you have 3 Elite slots and 180 points to spend, you're better off making 3 Monats in every case except when using shield drones to protect the squad.

I like the idea of the Dedicated Monats. A single Elite suit is not going to be terribly efficient unless specialized for their role, compared to a squad. And even a specialized suit can get an attack of the 1's when it comes time to roll the dice. Squads can change odds dramatically by multiplying dice rolls, making them more reliable, plus take other weapons for greater value.

In my current army, I have two Dedicated Monats. One is a Shas'o with a Plasma Rifle and Vectored Thrusters, used for Deep-Striking to attack Heavy Weapons squads and rear vehicle armor. The other is a ABFP/TL Flamer unit I want to use to counter-charge assaulters and hit units holed up in buildings. The unit also carries a Failsafe Detonator for when he is overwhelmed. Both these units have specific jobs and they are tooled for those tactics. They act independantly from the rest of my army.

I also have two Elite Monats using BC/MP/TA. They act as a dispersed unit that provides supporting fire to Fire Warriors or wherever needed. The last suit is a Shas'o with PR/FB/MP. This is another fire support unit, equipped for everything but light infantry/swarm targets and protected by IC status. These suits basically act like a squad with the two Devilfish. The Devilfish protect them from assault, and the suits destroy transports for the Fire Warriors inside the Devilfish, then support the Fire Warriors. This is the core of my army.

This works for me well, and I've no points left for any other Crisis suits.
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