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Can Deep-Striking Crisis Suits replace the Railhead as anti-tank?
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Old 24 May 2006, 20:13   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Can Deep-Striking Crisis Suits replace the Railhead as anti-tank?

I read Mal's post on why not take a rail head and after comparing it to other threads I have to agree with it.

As an anti-tank platform the Railhead is not the most point effective unit out there. For a tweaked railhead costs 180pts and unless you are destroying landraiders, the avg AV 13-14 vehicle is cheaper then a rail head. Also, Tau do not have spirit stones or extra armor which means a penetrating hit will shut us down for a turn as all results are stunned and a glance will definately shut down our shooting for a turn.

It really seems that a railhead is a one shot wonder, you position yourself to shoot that predator/landraider/leman russ but unless you have a markerlight you only have a 66% chance of hitting and only a slightly better then have chance of hurting it. If you miss, that landraider/pred/russ has a nice bead to you and will have an equal chance of knocking you out. Not to mention Eldar tanks that reduce your strength 10 hit to a str 8.

Since Mech Tau uses mobility to denie VP it seems that Mech Tau could effectively maneuver around terrain to limit or completely nullify the shooting power of these battle tanks for a few turns. Then starting on turn 2 or 3 you deep strike in a couple of battle suits with TL: Fusion Blasters with TA or Shields next to the tanks and blow them up. The cost of one of these battle suits is 53 pts and they have a better chance of destroying a tank then the rail head and since they can't be shaken or stunned they might even stick around a turn or 2 even being hit to kill some more things.

I am really thinking of trying this in my mech tau army, taking 2 ion heads instead of rail heads and then Fusion equipped deep strikers for the AV 13-14 anti-tank work. Do you guys think this would work?
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Old 24 May 2006, 20:15   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Can Deep Striking Crisis Suits replace the railhead as anti-tank

I don't think so.

Yes, the hammerhead might be the most point effective thing around, but crisis suits are relatively easy to kill. So better if you combine the two components together and make a tag-team out of it.
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Old 24 May 2006, 20:20   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Can Deep Striking Crisis Suits replace the railhead as anti-tank

Of course it is possible, but I wouldn't recommend it.

Deep striking fusion is a risky maneuver. A bad scatter roll can result in you losing that precious 2d6 armour penetration or even dying horribly. And a monat suit should not be difficult for most armies to deal with.

There are alternatives to Railheads if you want to be fully mechanized, but the railhead is probably the most resilent anti-tank platform available to a mechanized tau commander.

Personally i like the idea of a single fusion armed pirhana. Small enough to hide, fast, and not nearly as threatening to opponents as hammerheads.
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Old 24 May 2006, 20:21   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Can Deep Striking Crisis Suits replace the railhead as anti-tank

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Originally Posted by crisis_vyper
I don't think so.

Yes, the hammerhead might be the most point effective thing around, but crisis suits are relatively easy to kill. So better if you combine the two components together and make a tag-team out of it.
Ah but by turn 2-3 you have already had at least 1 or 2 turns of shooting so your enemy will have taken casualties and things will have been moving. Which means he won't have full fire power to bear on the crisis suits.

I am going to give it a try and I will let you know how I fair. The more I playtest the railhead the more disappointed I am. Too many times I have rolled the dice and seen it come up a 1 or a 2 and been like "damn" 180 pts 1 shot weapon. But 2 Crisis Suits can kill 2 tanks for 1/3 the points that 2 railheads would cost
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Old 24 May 2006, 20:23   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Can Deep Striking Crisis Suits replace the railhead as anti-tank

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Originally Posted by Fish Ead
Of course it is possible, but I wouldn't recommend it.

Deep striking fusion is a risky maneuver. A bad scatter roll can result in you losing that precious 2d6 armour penetration or even dying horribly. And a monat suit should not be difficult for most armies to deal with.

There are alternatives to Railheads if you want to be fully mechanized, but the railhead is probably the most resilent anti-tank platform available to a mechanized tau commander.

Personally i like the idea of a single fusion armed pirhana. Small enough to hide, fast, and not nearly as threatening to opponents as hammerheads.
I think there is only something like a 10-15% chance your suit will die on a deep strike compared to a 33% chance you will miss with your 1 shot. Also ion heads and missile pods can easily pop AV 13-14 tanks (save landraider) by getting side shots like Mal said.

Piranhas would work too but I shudder moving them across the board without them getting blown up
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Old 24 May 2006, 20:27   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Can Deep Striking Crisis Suits replace the railhead as anti-tank

yes, but without the ability to move after the deepstrike.... I think I'll stay with my hammerhead.
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Old 24 May 2006, 20:33   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Can Deep Striking Crisis Suits replace the railhead as anti-tank

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Originally Posted by Farseer Tanis
Piranhas would work too but I shudder moving them across the board without them getting blown up
Thats why I mentioned a solo pirhana. Its not too many points if it does go up in smoke, but with multiple hammerheads on the table it probably wont be target priority #1. Plus its small and maneuverable enough to hide given adequate terrain
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Old 24 May 2006, 20:34   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Can Deep Striking Crisis Suits replace the railhead as anti-tank

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Originally Posted by Howloutloud
yes, but without the ability to move after the deepstrike.... I think I'll stay with my hammerhead.
Good for you and you should stay with stuff you feel safe with, I am not trying to make you change your mind I am asking if deep striking Crisis Suits can replace the rail head as the AV13-14 tank killers. 2 railheads at 360 pts can kill 2 tanks a turn if both rolls hit and penetrate

2 Crisis suits with TL: Fusion Blasters and TA will hit more often then the railhead and at less then 6" penetrate more often then the rail head and cost 1/3 the points.

I think the problem with this concept is people have become comfortable in thinking the Railhead is Gods gift to the greater good and must be taken in an army list for the list to be considered tournament quality
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Old 24 May 2006, 20:34   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Can Deep Striking Crisis Suits replace the railhead as anti-tank

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Originally Posted by Fish Ead
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Originally Posted by Farseer Tanis
Piranhas would work too but I shudder moving them across the board without them getting blown up
Thats why I mentioned a solo pirhana. Its not too many points if it does go up in smoke, but with multiple hammerheads on the table it probably wont be target priority #1. Plus its small and maneuverable enough to hide given adequate terrain
I was agreeing with you, but added my fears as to why I am hesitant to do so
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Old 24 May 2006, 20:36   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Can Deep Striking Crisis Suits replace the railhead as anti-tank

The lowly bolter take take down a Crisis on a 4+. While on a Fish, it can't even hurt it (unless you aim for the back). There too many risks involved in DS a crisis to take down a Landraider. The disadvantages outweigh the advantages.
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