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Broadsides in the new era, Protection vs Manoeuvrability...
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Old 09 Mar 2006, 11:44   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Broadsides in the new era, Protection vs Manoeuvrability...

Hi,

With the new codex Broadsides have had improvements.

Firstly shield drones have been improved so broadsides can have better protection, secondly they have access to the Advanced Stabilisation System (ASS) which gives them better manoeuvrability.

Both improvements I really like, however I canít seem to design a good broadside unit that has enough protection yet can take advantage of the ASS. With the current codex I add plasma to my broadsides so they can move and fire at infrantry while moving to a better firing position mid game.

Iím playing in a 1750 tournament soon with a hybrid style army. Iíve decided on a heavy support section of Railhead, Ionhead and a 3-man Broadside team. The only set-up I like at the moment is:

2 Broadsides with, Plasma Rifles, Drone Controller & 2 Shield Drones Each
1 Broadside Team Leader with Plasma Rifles, Targeting Array, Hard-wired Drone Controller with 1 Shield Drone, Hard-wired Target Lock & Hard-wired multi-tracker

This blinged-up squad costs a whopping 340 pts for an 8 model squad. Can anyone suggest a better set-up, given that I only have one Railhead for 1750 pts ?

I believe I need 3 broadsides for this size list, as 3 railguns (2 broadsides & 1 railhead) would probably be a bit stretched. Whatís your experience on playing higher than 1500 pt battles ?

Am I being a bit paranoid about protection for the broadsides ? Should I drop all the plasma rifles and upgrades and just take 3 ASS Broadsides and give the leader 2 shield drones ?

An alternative ASS set-up would be:

2 Broadsides with ASS
1 Broadside Team Leader with ASS, Hard-wired Drone Controller with 2 Shield Drones & Hard-wired Target Lock

This would only cost 280 pts, is this more effective for the pts (being 60 pts cheaper), or will there be enough lascannons etc. in 1750 pts to blast past the drone protection and kill the squad ?

All comments welcome

Rathstar
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Old 09 Mar 2006, 12:14   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Broadsides in the new era, Protection vs Manoeuvrability...

I'd personally take three broadsides with ASS, make one a team leader and give him two shield drones and bonding. You've got mobile SMS/railguns with decent drone protection, and the unit can regroup when two shield drones and a broadside die.

The ASS turns the SMS/railgun into assault weapons. This allows you to start the game behind some area terrain. If your opponent gets first turn he cannot shoot at them. If you start (or when it's your turn) you simply move them into the area terrain and shoot. You also have two shield drones to soak up hits before things start going south, and even then you should be in cover with your broadsides for extra protection.

The only way one can effectively field lascannons is with heavy support choices, which are going to be expensive and relatively fragile. If he's spending a lot of points on lascannons he isn't spending a lot of points on assaulty elements or raw numbers, meaning your fire warriors will be very effective.
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Old 09 Mar 2006, 12:25   #3 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Broadsides in the new era, Protection vs Manoeuvrability...

2 broadsides with ASS + shas'vre with 2 shield drones

=180 points
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Old 09 Mar 2006, 12:34   #4 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Broadsides in the new era, Protection vs Manoeuvrability...

2 ASS broadside 160pts
Team leader 5pts
2 shield drones 30pts
Total 195 pts

Watching a land raider blowing up 1st turn.... priceless
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Old 09 Mar 2006, 12:50   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Broadsides in the new era, Protection vs Manoeuvrability...

Actually I meant:
3 ASS broadsides - 240 points
team leader + 2 shield drones + bonding - 40 points
total - 280 points
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Old 09 Mar 2006, 14:26   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Broadsides in the new era, Protection vs Manoeuvrability...

I think that you should look at it in a different way......

Prior to ASS, the broadsides where in some area terrain and shot each turn. If you did not go first then the Broadsides had one round of firing at them before they got to shoot. If they survived all well and good. The protection then was not as helpful as it is now.

Now we have ASS and most people thinks it's brilliant.

I think, it just stops your broadsides being shot at in the first turn (if you go second); that's it. This is the main thinking with regards to ASS that I have seen posted in this forum.....

Quote:
This allows you to start the game behind some area terrain. If your opponent gets first turn he cannot shoot at them. If you start (or when it's your turn) you simply move them into the area terrain and shoot.
...... so the same as before ASS except you are behind the area terrain when deployed.

Ask yourself the question ..... How often would you move the Broadside's during a game? Now seriously think about how long you expect them to last. Other forums will also have tactics to deal serious damage to any railgun wielding model; we do not have sole rights to tactics in 40k. No matter how well we plan the opponent has also planned to beat you, and the railgun.

Now is it worth 60 points to move during the game? ... or ... Are you probably not going to move that much; because you are already dead, or it is to dangerous to move around?

If you don't go with ASS you can use the 60 points to protect your broadsides. Protection now is far better than pre Tau Empire.

I personally, will not in all probability use ASS as I believe it is too expensive for what you get; to hide behind area terrain for the first turn if you don't go first, if you do go first then your opponent is still going to target you on his first turn, just as he did pre ASS.

These are just my own thoughts. I am inexperienced when it comes to 40k and the Tau. There are some very experienced players that use this forum, I am sure they will be better advisers than myself, and can see other tactics with ASS that I cannot.

I welcome comments and critics on my thoughts; that's the only way I will learn. Better advise may be needed because of the tournament Rathstar will be attending.
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Old 09 Mar 2006, 14:57   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Broadsides in the new era, Protection vs Manoeuvrability...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shas'el Sa'cea Ev'ets
I personally, will not in all probability use ASS as I believe it is too expensive for what you get; to hide behind area terrain for the first turn if you don't go first, if you do go first then your opponent is still going to target you on his first turn, just as he did pre ASS.
The reason Broadsides are shunned in competative circles using the current codex has nothing to do with Durability, or being shot first turn, or in fact anything that you mentioned. The reason competative players don't take Broadsides in the current codex is that they have no ability to score. That's it. Their durability is fine, their cost effectiveness is fine. But investing 200+ points in a 2-strong Broadside team with Drones is like investing 200 more points in Devilfish... since their lack of mobility means they'll never be able to claim an objective.

The primary value of the ASS is not in any fancy-pants "tactics" you can employ to deny shots to your opponent (although there is value in this too). Paying 20 points to allow a 200+ pt squad of Broadsides to move has value because it allows this expensive unit to score. Over 6 turns you can easily trudge this unit over and plop them down on a nearby loot counter and claim +200 VP's for yourself. Heck, these guys can even score in Recon missions with a bit of forethought!

In any case, The squad I've been running and have had good luck with is:

Broadside Teamleader [ASS, HWDC + 2 Shield Drones]
Broadside [ASS]

Total: 195


Occaisionally I'll add Plasma and a HWMT to the teamleader for +15 pts, although I'm enjoying the SMS a lot so I find myself doing this less and less.
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Old 09 Mar 2006, 15:19   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Broadsides in the new era, Protection vs Manoeuvrability...

didnt the braod side already have an ass : lol jokes

an ya i would take 3 casue if you take more there not really going to do any thing after you kill the oppoments tanks
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Old 09 Mar 2006, 16:48   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Broadsides in the new era, Protection vs Manoeuvrability...

I don't think Broadside are gonna score too much! They're really slow and not so well protected...they can stand well against a little amount of fire...
The drones will save you from 2/3 lascannon shots...
If you start running for objectives i think i'll be wiped out ...
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Old 09 Mar 2006, 16:48   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Broadsides in the new era, Protection vs Manoeuvrability...

With my move and shoot broadsides, I am only going to take the SMS. They are expensive enough as is and those extra points you pay for the plasma is not really that worth it as you get 4 times as many shots at range and double up close. If marines are threatening your broadsides... then you have more serious issues.
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