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I Might have Found the Key to Vespids
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Old 19 Feb 2006, 16:49   #1 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default I Might have Found the Key to Vespids

When you look at the Vespids, you see something of a weakness. 5+ saves and no assault jump for protection. In addition, with only BS3, only 5 of the 10 shots would hit and 3.3 would die. This means that if the marine squad you are hunting survives, the Vespids will be shot up by rapid firing bolters. This means that Vespids need to do one thing to insure their survival, make sure they obliterate the squad and shield from all returning massed fire.

There are many ways to help insure that the Vespids kill off the squad. The first way is to offer some outside support. Other AP3 or below weapons are more precise, but massed S5 firepower could also do some damage. First, you need some ranged support. Put 3 squadrons of Sniper Drones tucked away behind your firebase or mechanized squads so they are in the range of the target. Then put a Skyray nearby, or a Pathfinder squad with some seeker boat Piranhas or Devilfishs, so you can shoot Seeker Missiles at the enemy squad. Another good thing to use are Crisis Suits. If you give them Helios, Fireknife, or Burning Eye with TA, you will unleash either dead-on or massed AP2 firepower. Remember you don't have to use all of the above just to kill one Tactical Squad. Two Sniper Drone squads and one Crisis Suit should be enough.

Another way to make the Vespids more precise in being a mean killing machine is to increase their numbers. Ten 12'' shots at BS3 is usually something to laugh at, so using 2 squads would work extremely well. Shooting with 20 Vespids, you would have 10 hit. Then, 6.6 would wound and die. That is over half of a Tactical Squad, which would result in a morale check with a -2 modifier, which might cause them to run out of range and save your Vespids. However, there is still a chance at passing and having 6.8 bolter shots bombarding into the Vespids. This would result in 3.4 Vespids dieing, which is nearly half of the casualties the mariens took, except they used more primitive guns. You must put all risk aside and make sure they die. That is where an outside Markerlight would play an important roll.

You will need a few outside Markerlights, as they will hit half the time and you want the odds to lean towards you. Two Marker Drones and a Shas'ui Team Lighter in a FW squad wpuld be adequate enough, but no one is more efficient with Markerlights than Pathfinders. However, since you don't really need any deep-striking units (unless you want a Gun Drone harrasser or a Fusion-toting selfdestructing suit, you won't deep-strike much). With 1 Markerlight shot, you will hit with 13.3 shots and kill approximatly 8.9 marines. This means that the marine will be useless, only killing 2/3 of a Vespid (meaning usually no casualty with such low numbers, but 1 casualty may happen) and can be dealt with by smaller arms such as a Devilfish or Hammerhead Burst Cannon. With 0 to 1 casualty, you can go and hunt another squad down next turn.
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Old 19 Feb 2006, 17:13   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: I Might have Found the Key to Vespids

The problem is that you can only target lone squads that are not supported. Which most SMurf players have all their tatical or devastor squads close together.

I find that a Vespid squad closely supported by a Kroot squad and markerlights can dispatch an assault squad quite easily. At least in theory.
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Old 19 Feb 2006, 17:43   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: I Might have Found the Key to Vespids

This is why you try and isolate squads. Deep-striking a Gun Drone squad and trying to lure them away from the main firebase will really help isolate them and kill them with the above tactic.
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Old 19 Feb 2006, 18:02   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: I Might have Found the Key to Vespids

You could say this about any unit in the Tau list. Isolate an enemy squad, hit it with fire until it's dead, move on to the next unit.



Also, Vespid can come in squads of 11.
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Old 19 Feb 2006, 18:20   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: I Might have Found the Key to Vespids

squad of 11? Is it 10 vespid and 1 strain leader? I was under the impression it was 9 vespid and 1 strain leader.
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Old 19 Feb 2006, 18:34   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: I Might have Found the Key to Vespids

I'm with Tonka, for all that work you could've just used something else. I mean, that's a LOT of focus on destroying a single squad. With all that focus what are you doing about the rest of the army? You don't have unlimited resources after all.

Why not just use the Vespids for the occassional isolated squad? Really, using them as shock troops seems to be a no-no so use them to tick off devastators, scouts, or maybe a commander or something.
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Old 19 Feb 2006, 18:52   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: I Might have Found the Key to Vespids

Tonka and foxx say my toughts.
All that just to use vespids
As you say a few lines later. You can also dispatch of the squad with 2 sniper squads and a crisis.
Its good that you figured out a way to use vespids, but its far to much effort
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Old 19 Feb 2006, 19:15   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: I Might have Found the Key to Vespids

I think their best use would be on a Commander with a small Command Squad where the damage they inflict is done to far more expensive and important (but no harder to kill) models...meaning the risk they face is more worthwhile. Throwing them into that role of finishing off a weakened Command Squad (4-5 models) would work wonders and surprise an enemy with their speed...expecting them to, instead, go after Devastators...for instance. ESPECIALLY with those expensive units, he only needs one or two models to get into combat and you're dead. Easily. While mass S5 firepower will weaken a full squad, it won't kill them in one turn unless you get VERY lucky- that's where some nasty heavy weapons come in. A Space Marine Commander has 3 Wounds and unless you have a Railgun to ping him on his own, he will take a lot of killing ON HIS OWN from a Fire Warrior squad, moreso if he has Artificer armour (as many sadsacks insist on buying). Even if not, they may opt for an Iron Halo (or he may be a Chaplain) and so killing him is a nightmare...that 4+ save on a 3-Wound model makes even plasma fire quite useless- better to rely on mass firepower.

In any case, I believe the real use of Vespid squads are to finish off weak but expensive units and to provide rapid response to several immediate assault threats and finish off a lucky unit that is about to hit your lines- your opponent will be resting a lot of hope on this isolated squad more than likely. Why not just kill them? Command Squads, Incubi, Grey Knights and so forth are all nasty pieces of work...but all just have a 3+ Save. Give them some Vespid dakka if there simply is no other option to wipe them out in time. Otherwise, in an army without these heavy (and expensive) assault options, just use them to hunt minimised anti-tank heavy weapon squads (like Devastators- 4 Missile Launchers or Lascannon won't do a lot of hurt to Vespid in a 5/6-Man squad, especially after 3-4 members get fried :P) or Carnifex nastiness.
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Old 19 Feb 2006, 19:40   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: I Might have Found the Key to Vespids

As said already too much work but you can run up to them and fire. and then because the weapons assualt (im pretty sure may be wrong)stat you charge +1 attack at least 2 initiative 5 strike first then you make the marines take lots of armour saves so they run or just get massacred by the 11 strong squad then. you run away and repeat as neccesary.
note: this may not be a perfect strategy but it should work
 
Old 19 Feb 2006, 19:47   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: I Might have Found the Key to Vespids

Vespids can also benefit from charging right in after shooting, Neutron Blasters are indee assault weapons, and Vespids indeed have a higher I than... well.. the guys we're talking about.. This means that if firepower wasnt up to wiping out an enemy assault marine squad, they can do a double duty of charging in and holding them in place, and get first sticks in each round of combat, and also protecting them from enemy fire. IF they lose combat, and of course all b2b vespids are removed, they also benefit from a 3d6 fallback, seeing as how theyre jump infantry (right?)

but one thing to keep in mind when thinking about these guys is they never engage solo. I mean why would you ever send any Tau unit out all on his own, and expect to do anything except hand them to the enemys kill board? So, a Vespid stingwing jumps up to shoot MEQs.... but alongside them is a Gun drone squad, and a Kroot Pack with hounds... all of them itching to assault if the MEQs dont politely evaporate. with these units closing in, imagine for a seconf that your the MEQ guy... who do you target? can you target enough? can you spread out your fire enough to deal with all of them adequately over the course of the game?

just some more to think about.
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