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Points Efficiency for some Tau Units versus Space Marines
View Poll Results: What do you use for Elites versus Marine Armor?
Stealthsuits 4 12.90%
Crisis suits 10 32.26%
Both 17 54.84%
Nothing 0 0%
Voters: 31. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 24 Jan 2006, 15:35   #1 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
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Default Points Efficiency for some Tau Units versus Space Marines

Okay, so I was doing a little math, seeing what is efficient versus standard Space Marines. I've skipped some of the math in this discussion.

Basically, I was comparing Stealthsuits versus my favorite Crisis suit layout. Currently, I'm using a TL Plasma Rifle, Fusion Blaster weapons load for my Crisis suits. I've skipped adding some wargear like drones and bonding, but this gives you a good idea of what works against Space Marines. Also, I've pointed these units out using a copy of Imperial Armor 3, which should reflect the new codex.

Stealthsuit Squad
6 units, firing at Space Marines at 18", do 2 wounds/turn on average.
At 180 points, that's 90 points/wound/turn, on average.

Crisis Suit Squad (Elite)
3 units, equipped as above, firing at Space Marines at 12", do 2.5 wounds/turn.
At 201 points, that's 80.4 points/wound/turn.

please read my newer post below. I had forgotten to take into account twinlinking.

So the Crisis suits are more points efficient, but they have to be within 12". At beyond 12", they do half as many wounds, meaning 160.8 points/wound/turn. My suits also have a Fusion Blaster, giving them better ability to take out vehicles. However, against weaker armored opponents, the effectiveness of Stealthsuits goes up dramaticly. Against an unarmored foe, or 5+ or 6+ armor foe, the Stealthsuits do 6 wounds, instead of 2. This improves their rating to 30 points/wound/turn.

Here's my Shas'o and Bodyguards. I've heard lot's of people complaining that Bodyguards aren't worth it, but the Hardwired Multitracker option is great. Again, I've stripped some options here.

Shas'o with Plasma Rifle, Fusion Blaster, HW Multitracker, Shield
2.083 wounds/turn at 12"
At 132 points, 63.370 points/wound/turn

2 Bodyguards with TW Plasma Rifle, Fusion Blaster, HW Multitracker
2.5 wounds/turn at 12"
At 164 points, 65.6 points/wound/turn

Total: At 296 points, 64.586 points/wound/turn

So, a HW multitracker, allowing a Fusion Blaster shot, makes the HQ squad very effective compared to Elite Crisis suits and Stealthsuits against Space Marine armor.

The last thing I'll show you here is a squad of Fire Warriors with Pulse Rifles, rapid firing at Space Marines, supported by a Devilfish. The Devilfish is equipped with a Multitracker, Targeting Array, Decoy Launchers, and a SMS, a new option in IA3.

Fire Warriors
2.666 wounds/turn at 12"
At 120 points, 45.011 points/wound/turn.

Devilfish
1.037 wounds/turn at 12"
At 120 points, 115.71 points/wound/turn.

Total
At 240 points, 64.81 points/wound/turn.

So, on their own, rapid firing, Fire Warriors are extremely cost effective versus marines. However, it's rare that a squad of Fire Warriors can simply rapid fire at Space Marines until they are dead. The Devilfish is a points sink, but it can block assaults by Space Marines, and can contribute firepower as well. Together, they are as efficient as my Shas'O and Bodyguards. As they are using Pulse and SMS weaponry, the Fire Warrior squad's efficiency is magnified versus weaker armored infantry.

So, any questions?



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Old 24 Jan 2006, 16:22   #2 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Points Efficiency for some Tau Units versus Space Marines

On a personal note, I just don't go for the weapon that is "Guaranteed to Negate Armour Saves." I actually have come to the conclusion that the more rolls you make an opponent do, the more chances of him failing saves...which is why I chose both.
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Old 25 Jan 2006, 01:38   #3 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Points Efficiency for some Tau Units versus Space Marines

With a system built on dice with only 6 sides, crazy things can and do happen very often. Even when you have a comparatively high number of dice rolls, I find that it's not possible to bring to bear enough firepower to force the statistics to conform. That is why I like AP weapons better. The fact that your opponent doesn't even get to roll a dice is simply a tremendous advantage. It is also very demoralizing, and it feels very good to wipe away that stupid legendary armor.

However, I build my lists around statistics anyway. Pulse fire is ever-so-slightly better for its cost than plasma, at killing regular marines. There is hardly any difference at all though.

Well... from what I'm saying I guess I could use crisis suits too. Unfortunately plasma rifles are one to a box, and I can't pay THAT much for an effective force. As it is, my crisis suits shoot at marines while they wait for things with 2+ saves to show up. It is their REAL job to kill those.
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Old 25 Jan 2006, 01:58   #4 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Points Efficiency for some Tau Units versus Space Marines

crisis suits are currently the best way to kill marines, if the vespids have low AP blast weapons then I shall get several (hundred) but if (as is more likely, me thinks) it's back to the old XV8s. although my friend has a fairly effective anti-marine force, it might not be cheesy if it were 2000 points, but since it's only 100 I think his nine Broadsides w/ Plasmas is a wee bit crazy, but until there kill it inflicts he can kill roughly one shquad every two turns.
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Old 25 Jan 2006, 03:11   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Points Efficiency for some Tau Units versus Space Marines

i some time realy hate 3+ armour. the problem is a lot of wargamers become flickers, its a right pain in the neck aned very few ever noticed. you get 2 types of flicker the 180 and 360

the 180 fliper just stops playing because they roll to hit they pick up the high dice do the flick throw to avoid the dice going every where and end up with roughtly the oppersite of what he rolled last time. so they apper unlucky when they arent.

the 360 fliper just seams lucky but it not they can just flick 360 just like before but the get 360 rotaion on the dice.

the solution to both of these irriations is a shoe box to use there hexodecmial force translators in. this may see like a pain in the neck intead of rolling on the table but most of the table i can play on and have played on arent exactly great rolling areas usaly resulting in dice every where so it makes things easyer in that aspect.

[hr]

right now back to probabilty effecient the best long range system we have is pathfinders at 82 82/215 and pathfinders are likey at least to get another turn of shooting if not until they run out of missles making them probley the most effective
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Old 25 Jan 2006, 03:23   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Points Efficiency for some Tau Units versus Space Marines

I use Crisis suits to get those reliable hits against Marines, and Firewarriors for the high volume fire.
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Old 25 Jan 2006, 04:55   #7 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Points Efficiency for some Tau Units versus Space Marines

Helios:

Plasma, Fusion, Multi Tracker

It is good, but then you add the Markerlights... pwn4g3!!!

I use Rail Rifles now!
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Old 25 Jan 2006, 04:58   #8 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Points Efficiency for some Tau Units versus Space Marines

just test played the new markerlight rules BS+1 is hidious on helios i manged to kill 9 marines
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Old 25 Jan 2006, 08:21   #9 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Points Efficiency for some Tau Units versus Space Marines

statistics are bull. they never work. i will never kill 2.983 marines with my stealthsuits.
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Old 25 Jan 2006, 11:04   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Points Efficiency for some Tau Units versus Space Marines

I like stealthsuits. hey are cheaper, so you can have more of them. Plus, 18 shots a turn will be deadly when the new codex is released. Two markerlights later, 3.35 marines will die, making up for a stealthsuit and a half. Helios suits can't do as much damage as that.
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