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Escalation League Fresh Start
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Old 17 Jan 2006, 23:52   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Sandy Eggo
Posts: 1,954
Default Escalation League Fresh Start

I posted an Army list in the army list section, but it had other stuff regarding Tau army styles and new tactics I'm going to try, So I'll link It here:

http://forums.tauonline.org/index.php?topic=16793.0

This thread can talk about the oddball Crisis setup and useage (specifically, Crisis suits with no multitrackers, and flamers/drones on every one)

and/or the Cose Combat train of thought that has me seriously looking at Shas'Vre upgrades for Crisis teams in larger point venues, from this new and fresh point of view of Tau.

let the derision begin!! Be forewarned, I'm sticking very strongly to this 'new' Tau approach, and will counter any dogma encountered, until a seriously ugly flaw emerges and is shown to me. I think this 'new' approach is onto something, since it makes sense of a lot of underused Tau kit in popular Tau Player 'culture'

So Please: no "You should make them all FireKnife!" suggestions! :
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Old 18 Jan 2006, 01:24   #2 (permalink)
Ethereal
 
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Default Re: Escalation League Fresh Start

So basically, the idea is to use Fire Warrior teams to screen Crisis suits? I am not sure that is going to work very well. Remember that regular Elite Crisis suits can't join squads. The enemy is just going to pass their relatively easy priority test and wipe out the suits, then pick off the Fire Warriors at leisure. Keeping the Fire Warriors back and JSJing with the suits will work fine, but in that case why equip them they way you have?
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Old 18 Jan 2006, 19:53   #3 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Escalation League Fresh Start

well, its not exactly using FWs as a screen. thats off point a bit. but first I'll explain the screening a bit. Crisis suits are Size 2, same as Firewarriors. LOS cant be drawn through enemy formations, only freindly ones, thereby granting a screen. I may be a bit off on this ruling, but thats just a small benefit that may not actually be legal, but if it is, then bonus!

Back to the reply: Thats the new outlook. I dont see the Crisis as lone wolf commandos, or even as seperate from the FWs. I see the FWs and Crisis as a team, even if theyre not attached to each other... and they work as a team. Always. The Kroot, the FWS and the Crisis escorts ALL work as a big unit as well... never is any FOC slot viewed as a seperate entity, for why should they be?

FWs benefit from having Kroot within 7" to pre charge or counter charge after a FW squad gets locked in combat. FWs will survive combat this way in the view point that I WONT simply write them off and back everyone away... nope! the FWs will take the charge, lose some men, but certainly not all... and on my turn the drones, Crisis, and Kroot charge in as well, and knock the chargers senseless! some will die in the melee, since Tau really arent that good at combat, but no units will likely get obliterated with no cost at all to the enemy! Am I making sense?

When you think that the mass CC wil still be a slaughter, I'm going to remind you of the Drones CC ability: any attacks and wounds that CAN be directed at drones, ARE directed at them first. This has nothing to do with majority anything, it has to do with picking which force in a mixed unit and multiple unit CC that youre going to attack... the Drones force the pick their way! No one EVER uses drones this way, and I really wonder why. If you think the kroot will die in CC due to their lower Initiative value, remember the drones that WILL be in that same combat as well. the kroot benefit from the Crisis drones, the FW drones, etc.. ALL the units that are engaged in CC with assault marines are taken into account... meaning the Kroot CANT be singled out for attacks, or anyone else, until all drones are gone.. IF there are still ANY drones engaged in combat with that same unit. This is where Shas' Vres and kroot step in and do the real work, with Kroot Ws4 and S4, and Crisis WS3 and S5... these numbers look a lot better when you realize that usually 8 of 10 drones will bulk up the melee and help EVERYONE out for the greater good!

whew! well, thats the new look at Drones, Tau actually in combat, and possible size 2 screening.... now for the Crisis equipment itsself.

Drone controllers and 2 drones on each and every suit: see above paragraph.

Flamers on Each Suit: A FW Squad about to be assaulted gets the benefit of their attendant Crisis with a Flamer template JSJ the Tau turn before the assault, with the FWs moving forewards and towards the Kroot Center, and the kroot and other FW team converging as well... if set up right, that assault unit gets 3 flamer templates and closer than expected threats during his next turn.

Plasma Rifles and Missile pods: this is the heavy weapon 'for' the FW squads. this slot is open to really anything, but Plasma fits best in a general purpose role, and 1 Missile pod rounds things out a bit in a 500 point game. Fusion Blasters wont be needed very often, and Bursts are a bit underpowered and short ranged, and give the army a lack of target versatility.

Keep in mind the Crisis suits are a bit odd because of point constraints.. its a 500 point list, and at higher points will almost certainly get team leader and HW multitracker upgrades.... and mutiple suit teams for each FW squad.. Drones on each suit will be mandatory, Flamers optional though, freeing up a slot for more focused Crisis setups, like Deathrain Drone, or Burning Eye Drone. lets not forget the HQ special gun goodies coming out soon as well, such as the Cyclic Ion Blaster, and the Air Fragmentation Projector (or whatever their names).... Tau Dogma may make these guns seem weak or useless, but this approach may make them glow! I guess we'll see in a few months, when we all get the details. When the new Codex comes out, Krootox for this Kroot squad element may look very promising as well, replacing the missile pod hardpoint on a crisis suit, maybe making kroot more self sufficient.

OK, thats prolly enough to read for one post, I hope I didnt ramble on excitedly a bit too long, and did make some good points.
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Though I walk through the valley of the swarms of the clueless, I shall fear no idiocy, for the M-STAR flagged them 12 seconds ago, and the JDAMS are already freefalling.
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Old 18 Jan 2006, 20:46   #4 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Escalation League Fresh Start

i like the use of the drones to draw away attack from the kroot. a squardon could reach a whole new level of scary! that must be why they are a 0-1 option in farsight it would be hidous.

so if your going down the CC root may i suggest XV8's with flamer 2 gun drones and sheild generator
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Old 18 Jan 2006, 21:11   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Escalation League Fresh Start

well, a Crisis Drones/flamer/shield is lacking another of the Crisis functions I may not have cleared up:

the Crisis grants the FW team the Heavy weapon guy theyve always wished for.... FWs always wished they could have a missile launcher Firewarrior like the SMs have, so now, with a missile pod, they get a Tau version of a missile launcher: a bit weaker, but more shots, and shootable on the move.

Plasma Rifles also add a good heavy weapon to the team. Taking a shield generator takes the bigger gun away... the suit can cound on its armor save, its multiple wounds, and its afforementioned screening, or Ld shield to survive.

to talk a bit more about the crisis setup, theres no multitracker, and really, having one would only benefit things rarely if at all.... a flamer/rapid fire shot, followed by an assault may warrant the upgrade, however.. but the wow factor will only come up once or twice a game, so I dont know if its worth it, or better worth spending the points on mutliple drone equipped Crisis suits. another thing about the suit config is that its CHEAP! 52 points, not counting drones.. thats cheaper than even the cheap crisis setup: deathrain, AND thats WITH the expensive Plasma Rifle! Building an entire army around this concept may give a suprisingly different style of Tau... and I wanna do it!
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Though I walk through the valley of the swarms of the clueless, I shall fear no idiocy, for the M-STAR flagged them 12 seconds ago, and the JDAMS are already freefalling.
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Old 18 Jan 2006, 22:23   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Escalation League Fresh Start

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calaban
well, its not exactly using FWs as a screen. thats off point a bit. but first I'll explain the screening a bit. Crisis suits are Size 2, same as Firewarriors. LOS cant be drawn through enemy formations, only freindly ones, thereby granting a screen. I may be a bit off on this ruling, but thats just a small benefit that may not actually be legal, but if it is, then bonus!
That is what I noticed. It looked like some of the tactics the Tau used in 3rd Edition. Screening was removed completely in 4th edition for infantry, with only the target priority checks left to account for the effect (see page 20). LOS can be drawn through friendly and enemy units with no penalty, unless the aforementioned units are engaged in an assault.
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Old 18 Jan 2006, 23:31   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Escalation League Fresh Start

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calaban
CHEAP! 52 points, not counting drones.. thats cheaper than even the cheap crisis setup: deathrain, AND thats WITH the expensive Plasma Rifle! Building an entire army around this concept may give a suprisingly different style of Tau... and I wanna do it!
good pionts but i use IA3 costing now (cant be bothered to play so much) so it is 41 for me.

got to real think what level of damage you can execpt and if the drones are all ready taking hits your right there is no piont in sheild generators. i use IA3 so i would swap it for TL flamers. thought i would posibley swap it for another wepoan depending on my armies needs of anti-tank, anti- heavy armour, etc.

thought just a small note due about the shas'vre upgrade and drones because it is another model with a different Iniative that mean when you have 3 drones your I overal is still 4 for running away.
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Old 22 Jan 2006, 00:32   #8 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Escalation League Fresh Start

First battle report is a massacre Victory for Tau... and I mean Massacre! Not a single SM survived. ;D some pretty interesting things happened. Both armires are mine that I built with what I had, and I talked a guy into playing the SM side with me at the store. First, the Forces:

Tau

7 Firewarriors, Shas'ui, HW drone controller/2 Gun drones

7 Firewarriors, Shas'ui, HW drone controller/2 Gun drones

11 Kroot

Crisis: Plasma Rifle, Flamer, Drone controller/2 Gun Drones

Crisis: Plasma Rifle, Flamer, Drone controller/2 Gun Drones

Crisis: Burst Cannon, Missile Pod, Drone controller/2 Gun Drones

499 points



Space Marine

7 Tac Marines: Missile launcher, Plasmagun, frag grenades,
1 Vet Seargent: plas pistol, CCW, krak gren, auspex, melta bombs

5 Tac Marines: Flamer, frag grenades
1 Vet Seargent: Plaspistol, Powerfist, bionics, meltabombs
Razorback: Hvy bolters, Pintle storm bolter, extra armor, searchlight

Land Speeder Tornado: Hvy Bolter, Assault Cannon.

500 points


4 Foot table, pretty much combat patrol scenario.

Both my crisis teams and plasma crisis stuck together, and moved towards table center, while my missile monat duelled with the landspeeder on the other end of the table. The landspeeder/Missile monat duel was awesome!

so Ill do that one first, and its worth a bit of narrative: The monat jumped out to missile pod the speeder, but missed. then he jumped back behind a building for cover. the LandSpeeder raced up 12", so to still shoot, and angled a shot at the monat. The assault cannon and heavy bolter shredded up the monat and his escorting drones, rending a Drone, and killing the other drone, AND wounding the Monat! but the monat was still there, and passed his morale and last man standing... barely. he then jumped out, and with his missile pod managed an immobilized on the fast moving skimmer... LandSpeeder goes SPLAT! (dude forgot about fast moving and immobilized skimmers wiping out!), the wounded monat heads over to the main battle, confident that those nasty guns that chewed him up so much wouldn't hurt anyone else that day... He gets an MVP award, as his story isn't yet over.

On the other side of the table, the two main forces collided, each side advancing and trading shots. the foot slogging tac squad advanced a little and stopped at a rough 24" to start bombarding crisis suits with krak missiles and plasmagun fire, while the razorback ran right up to around 7" of the kroot firing line to unload and flamer/ plasmapistol/ rapidfire bolter them to death. the kroot were decimated, going from 11 to 4, but didnt fallback! The kroot were in no shape to charge, so rapid fired, while the two FW teams angled in from around the hill to rapidfire them in return before they charged. The shooting up to this point was odd, since really no one died to shooting, and the krak missiles kept missing! The plasma Crisis suits' single shot wasnt hitting much of anything, so really, all the sniping was a prelude to the big melee at the base of the hill.

The big melee was odd, and intense! So the kroot rapidfired, and the firewarriors rapid fired, killing 2 of the 6 marines before they could charge, while the missile monat popped the rhino (finally!). when the marines did charge, the flamer and plaspistol were ineffective (killing just one kroot leaving 3), and they charged the kroot in frustration. the powerfist killed all the kroot, but the kroot managed to bring them down to a powerfist guy, a flamerguy, and a bolterguy. the massacre move engaged the leading firewarrior team, and they were still stuck in.. feeling a little worried, but smug. The something weird happened. on the Tau turn, all 3 crisis and remaining drones charged into combat with the beleaguered Firewarriors! That close combat round wound up in an annihilated SM tac squad... while I only lost 2 drones (he had to pick the crisis suit+ drone unit to attack because of the drones special rule), the drones swung with the SMs, then the Firewarriors and Crisis suits swung, and these are the guys that actually killed all 3 marines! no powerfist action! I'm definitely upgrading those crisis to 'Vres for the higher I and WS, since it was their 3 S5 attacks that did all the actual work.

so, after the.. ahem.. massacre of the tac squad, their massacre move brought them close to the remaining foot slogging squad. they stood their ground, and rapidfired/frag missiled the firewarrior squad closest to it (heh! failed target priority check!), hurting it pretty darn badly. but in return, the wounded missile monat flamered them, while another wounded plasma crisis rapid fired, and another plasma crisis rapid fired as well, and... wiped them out to a man!!

Game Over. killed every single thing he had, and only lost kroot. everything else was pretty much mauled, but scoring and not wiped out! what was amazing was the firewarriors that got consolidated into close combat didnt lose a single guy! I really Like this game, it was a very very different way to play the army, and it worked well. granted I had numbers on him, and that may have made for an unfair game, but.. I'll take it!
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Though I walk through the valley of the swarms of the clueless, I shall fear no idiocy, for the M-STAR flagged them 12 seconds ago, and the JDAMS are already freefalling.
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