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Bodyguards
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Old 07 Jan 2006, 01:06   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Bodyguards

Do you like to use bodyguards in 1500-2000pts or not? I don't really care about fluff and theme, good on you and all that, but I'm just talking about effectiveness.

I say yes.
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Old 07 Jan 2006, 01:19   #2 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Bodyguards

no. Body guars cost to much and take away your IC status. The only reason I can think of to use them is if you are playing a fifty billion point game with only one force organization chart and can't fit in enough suits.
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Old 07 Jan 2006, 03:42   #3 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Bodyguards

Bodyguards are useless right now. As Worm mentioned, they drop your IC status, painting a big "SHOOT HERE" sign on your commander. Word on the street says that bodyguards will be able to access all the exclusive HQ suit wargear, which should make them viable again.
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Old 07 Jan 2006, 05:12   #4 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Bodyguards

I said yes, here's why.

Tau are best as a fluid army. Tau can concentrate on the objective without having to worry about having to defend any static forces. That's the best way to play tau, nothing to defend that's holding your units back, letting the table be the limit.

This means 3 units of stealths. You need 3 units of stealths to replace the fire warriors, so you no longer have anything to defend. What we are now stuck with is no room for any more crisis, and at 1500-2000pts, no more heavy support or elite spots to get any more stealths or hammerheads.

This is where bodyguards come in. At 1500pts, you can fit in 2 bodyguards with one shas'el, take another shas'el by itself, have 18 steaths, 6 fire warriors, 10 kroot, and 3 railheads.

The bodyguards work better than more fire warriors or a devilfish. Here's a list why:

-provide more medium range weaponry that stealths fail to cover
-provide more high strength weaponry that stealths fail to cover
-provide more AP2 weaponry stealths fail to cover
-provide another target for high strength weaponry (S8+) to dilute firepower targetting hammerheads
-provide further denial of victory pts through jump shoot jump
-provide an extra scoring unit

What you lose is being able to have your commander safe from being a target. What I've found playing with 3 units of stealths and 3 railheads is that I don't have a lot to actually protect my commander with. The fire warriors and kroot usually die in the first few turns, simply because it's an advantage to use them as a distraction. I'm often hiding my commanders behind terrain instead of using the independent character rule.

When the commander is with a bodyguard, I am still be able to hide like normal. If I fail to find suitable terrain, I'll be providing an extra target to the opponent to shoot high strength weapory at, keeping my hammerheads safer.

I use bodyguards because I require the extra high strength low AP weaponry. My stealths can't kill terminators very well, When you're facing 10 with 4 assault cannons you want something that will do some damage. 3 Wraithlords used to walk freely on the battlefield against me, now I have a safety net against them coming too close. Stealth cover my anti-infantry, I needed the extra special weapons that crisis suits provide against the tougher lists.

Bodyguards also provide an extra scoring unit. Two bodyguards count as a two man scoring unit, lose one out of two, and you still have a scoring unit. This can be very helpful. The commander provides the extra leadership that is very useful when taking a casualty test. Lose the two bodyguards, and the commander does not have to take all alone tests, and gets the protection of IC again. It takes a lot of small arms fire to kill off the bodyguards and commander in one turn. 6 marine missile launchers (that aren't shooting hammerheads), or 27 bolters.

It's further denial of victory points, and fills in the gaps stealths create. Bodyguards may be an extra 10pts for useless stats, but they're worth it.
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Old 07 Jan 2006, 05:31   #5 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Bodyguards

Interesting but that is fatally flawed logic to me. Your whole premise is to remove the Firewarriors in favor of stealths because you dont want to defend static Firewarriors. Well unless you havent noticed Firewarriors work very well mechanized and I would take a mounted Firewarrior squad over a stealth team any day.

The commanders are not supposed to be used as scoring units, this is another reason why firewarriors are good. They are a nice cheap unit that if necessary can be kept in the fish till late game and then rushed into objectives.

Also with 18 Stealths on the board you arent going to have much room for JSJ, even in large games your going to be easily restricted and cut off rather quickly as you run out of terrain to duck behind and at the high coste of Stealths even with their night fight rules leaving them out in the open usually spells doom to my stealth teams even when they are supposed to be at a safe distance.

Also with so many Stealths you have almost no models on the field. Thats lets see, 36 infantry models on the board and 3 tanks. Thats not a whole lot. At 1500 points thats very little. The only armies I usually see that small are Daemonhunters.

Firewarriors are an awesome unit, certainly not dead weight. The Devilfish is also an excelent tank. If this works for you go with it but I am sad to see that you hold Firewarriors in such a low oppinion.
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Old 07 Jan 2006, 05:35   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Bodyguards

I've played most of my 70 games in 4th edition with tau with fire warriors in devilfish. You may believe it's fatally flawed, for some reason, but I'd just like you to try it first.

It gets scary when you get to a point where you say "no that's bad" and don't question it. That's how it is with bodyguards, and I think it's quite a huge thing that I've discovered that everyone (most people would post the same response as the first two) was wrong about it (including me).

Anyway, I'd take stealths over mounted fire warriors anyday, sorry but that's what I've found works better when trying to capture objectives, and stealths fire more often than fire warrior in fish.

You've never played with 18 stealths, I wonder how you know there's not enough room for jsj.

Clearly, this is only useful advice if you get in the mindset that stealths can replace fire warriors in fish. Fire warriors are good in my opinion, they are not good enough.
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Old 07 Jan 2006, 06:14   #7 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Bodyguards

Thats... Interesting. Of course, you will have a dangerously low model count, making it less viable in a tournament setting, but it is an interesting idea.
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Old 07 Jan 2006, 06:36   #8 (permalink)
Ethereal
 
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Default Re: Bodyguards

Quote:
Originally Posted by the_vilest_worm
Thats... Interesting. Of course, you will have a dangerously low model count, making it less viable in a tournament setting, but it is an interesting idea.
It is insanely min-maxed, squeezing the maximum amount of elites and suits in at the expense of troop choices. Even if I suspected that it would be effective, I still would not use it.
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Old 07 Jan 2006, 07:06   #9 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Bodyguards

Quote:
Originally Posted by Earlydawn
Word on the street says that bodyguards will be able to access all the exclusive HQ suit wargear, which should make them viable again.
That's even true to a small degree now, in that they're the only way to get a whole squad with blacksun filters. That said, I plan on taking bodyguards for fluff reasons, anyway.
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Old 07 Jan 2006, 11:56   #10 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Bodyguards

All I know about my stealth team is that if there's anything truly fast around, like gaunts, they have to hide until those things die. The best thing to kill gaunts with is fire warriors. But let me guess, this hypothetical list probably has three hammerheads, right?

It could work, and in such a context bodyguards would be necessary. I can't help but feel that most of my opponents would hate me for a long time though.
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