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Kroot...Bad or Good?
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Old 22 Dec 2005, 22:08   #1 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Kroot...Bad or Good?

okay this is how its is, Today i was playing a really annoying kid who thought he knew it all in a SM vs my Tau in a 750 pt battle, when i deployed my kroot on the board he actually laughed and said haha look, this Kid has giant parrots, I ignored this lame comment and carried on, then in turn two i assulted his scouts, he rolled no wounds on me, and i finished off that entire squad, then the next turn i charged a tactical squad, he killed 3 of my kroot, and then i killed the whole squad, and went for his command squad, the kroot were doing all the work! once again he laughed and said,"ha ha those parrots are so stupid!" i just burst! i said" those stupid parrots are eating up your stupid army!, he replyed with "so, there so so stupid, and stupid looking and rubbish then my faithful staff member pat wandered past and said, " erm yeh, but those stupid birds, who are standing about a foot taller than your marines, seem to be completely killing you, i dont think they are rubbish". anyway i beat the living hell out of this kid and he wandered of still calling them stupid parrots...
ok that was a bit of blabber,but what I want to know is, do you think kroot are good? or do you use them as cannon fodder???
thanks
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Old 22 Dec 2005, 23:20   #2 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Kroot...Bad or Good?

The kroot are good, the kroot are very good. They have high strength, 2 base attacks thanks to the kroot rifle, bolter equivilant guns, decent shooting ability, large numbers and are cheap. The one thing they lack are armor, defence. So they are fragile when used incorrectly but used properly they can be quite devastating. It would seem you used them correctly.

I however do not use them as my army is pure mech. No static elements at all. So its a matter of principle. That player sounded like a dumb fool, ignore him. Take satisfaction in pounding him flat and move on. We have all seen such people.
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Old 22 Dec 2005, 23:26   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Kroot...Bad or Good?

Kroot:

[ From Important Topics Sticky ]
How to use your Kroot
Know Your Self
Comprehensive Guide to Tau

[ From Tactics Index ]
Kroot: Discussion Thread on how people use them
Kroot: Are Great!
Kroot: Why do so many of you think that Kroot suck? Or maybe why do you like the Kroot?

Kroot are very good, and come very, very cheaply. See above threads, and also see the Kroot Charge article on the main site.

Their disadvantage - lack of armour - can usually be overcome by placing them in forests etc where they get a really good cover save, due to their special rules etc. This is particularly easy when they can infiltrate too.
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Old 22 Dec 2005, 23:34   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Kroot...Bad or Good?

I'm a believer. I played Static and later went on to Mech, now Hybrid. I now use Kroot, not in every army list but they help out greatly, (but must be used correctly).

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Old 22 Dec 2005, 23:40   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Kroot...Bad or Good?

your aboslutely right about the way you handled it....destroy him and show him what stupid parrots can do. *my kroot have never failed me even though everyone says they are the most ugly worthless models. but once they start emerging from the cover to slaughter whatever stands ahead people stop laughing and start crying. Kroot are a valuable choice for tau, they offer a new range of possibilities as in all fairness they have not bad shooting to be fair and you can get a good volume of shots as well as pretty good close combat. Unfortuneately most people use kroot as a meat shield.... as it does work, i am ashamed to say i have done this before but i usually use my kroot for the right reasons. The ability to infiltrate is extremely useful as it can hold up enemies for the first one or two turns, i mean my kroot were able to take 3 wounds off a carnifex and hold it for two turns which gave me a great confidence in kroot and now they are influencing nearly every roster i make as they can hold back enemies so you can prepare to unleash hell with your more powerful weapons and also can be positioned to keep other infiltrators away from you as they have to be 12" away *:P. As well as the fact i am going to start a kroot merc. Never underestimate kroot especially not in numbers. try to use em as much as possible after a while you'll wonder how u managed without em. sorry for the long speech but i love kroot. *
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Old 23 Dec 2005, 00:06   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Kroot...Bad or Good?

Great for the points.

I like to tag team them with stealth suits. everything infiltares into a nice enfile firebase.
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Old 23 Dec 2005, 00:14   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Kroot...Bad or Good?

Kroot are cool. And good. I haven't used them before but i Still say they're good.
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Old 23 Dec 2005, 01:41   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Kroot...Bad or Good?

Ok, I think I'll answer this one properly..

[size=14pt]Kroot - Truths and Tactica[/size]

[size=12pt]Common Misconceptions[/size]
Armour: Kroot armour isn't all that great.. infact - what armour? I'll admit that Kroot can get shot up very easily, and don't have much to protect them in CC. However, it appears then that the Kroot aren't being used properly. If you take full advantage of their Fieldcraft and Infiltrate special rules, they can potentially get a 4+ cover save (or even 3+) by infiltrating into jungles/woods. Their main disadvantage is made up for by their special rules, and at least give them decent protection from shooting.

Points Cost: They're cheap. But that doesn't mean they're not good. They have a decent statline, equal to, if not even better than your standard Fire Warrior - better WS, higher S, Higher I, more attacks (Kroot rifle counts as additional CC weapon) - made up by a lack of an armour save. And they're even cheaper than a Fire Warrior. Weapons - they basically have bolters, which are still pretty decent when it comes to shooting. You can seriously take masses of Kroot, for their low points cost and large squad size. Don't underestimate them based off their points cost.


[size=12pt]Tactica[/size]
Infiltrate: Make good use of the infiltrate special rule. It gives you a lot more freedom than you would've normally, when deploying, and allows you to quickly close in on the opposing army, setting up firezones etc, holding objectives before the game even starts, and camping in a good terrain piece that would give them a decent cover save (anything is better than nothing!). Infiltrating gives you a bigger tactical advantage, and forces your opponent to decide which is the bigger threat - a squad of 20 Kroot (or more!) in front of him, or the broadsides and hammerheads in the background waiting to pound at their armour. If he goes for the Kroot, as long as they aren't locked in combat, it won't detract from the effectiveness of the rest of your army, and allows the Kroot to rapid fire or charge (see below), to wipe out the squad (I would prefer rapid firing, as they don't have armour saves in combat). If they ignore the Kroot, the Kroot can either shoot or charge (again, I'd prefer shooting, as it doesn't lock up units, and becomes a big pain in the backside for the opponent picking off models and again forcing him to decide which is the biggest threat) and allowing the rest of your army to open fire normally as well. Infiltrating is probably the most useful special rule for Kroot, as it allows many of the following tactics to be used effectively.

Flankers: Taking up a flank and advancing under relatively little fire is something that can be done, should you're opponent underestimate the Kroot (well, a squad of 12 is only 84 points). Infiltrating allows them to quickly take up a position, from which they can advance and harass the flanks of the other army. Should the need to, they can assault/charge in order to avoid incoming fire, and lock up some stationary units that are probably sitting and shooting at the back of the army. This of course, stops them from shooting at the rest of your army - which is a good thing.

Firebase: A full squad of 20 can dish out 20 to 40 bolter equivalent shots. That's a lot of shots if you ask me. In some situations, Kroot can be used to set up an efficient, and often invulnerable (nearly!) firebase. Making use of the Fieldcraft and Infiltrate special rules, if there is a terrain piece big enough (12"x12" jungle/forest anyone?) - the Kroot can infiltrate into it, gaining both a cover save, and the use of their fieldcraft ability, to see through 12" rather than 6" of forest/jungles. Sit them 7" away from the edge closest to the enemy, and they are immune to all incoming fire (apart from indirect) as enemy models/units can only see through 6" of wood. Any unit that strays too close to the terrain piece will be on the receiving end of many shots, and if they try to assault them, it is highly likely they will get stranded in the middle of the jungle (difficult terrain tests) allowing the Kroot to charge and bring down a large amount of attacks each (see below). If they do somehow make it through, the Kroot strike first at I10, as they were in cover.

Diversion: Basically what I described under Infiltrate - though the Kroot are solely used to create a diversion, be a big nuisance to the enemy, and make lots and lots of noise. And hurt stuff. Their aim is to draw fire, units, and attention away from the rest of your army, increasing their lifespan and allowing them to pick off units etc. Often this allows a crossfire to be set up, where an enemy unit is threatened by both the Kroot and the rest of the Tau army, and has to pick one to shoot at/attack. Small, cheap units are useful for this, as they are only 70 points at the minimum, yet could get the attention of hundreds of points worth of enemy units, whether it be in shooting or combat. Placing them in cover to get cover saves makes the squad last that little bit longer, extending the length of the diversion.

Kroot Charge: When Kroot charge, they bring down a lot more attacks than you might expect from a 140 point squad (maxed out squad of basic Kroot). Against higher Initiative armies, they do have a problem of attacking second, however when they do, they get three attacks each if they charge. With their MEQ WS and S, they have a pretty good chance at doing some major damage, however due to their lack of armour saves, and basic LD, they do have a problem of being killed pretty quickly or running away. Against armies with lower I, they don't have so much of a problem, as they can usually get away with attack first, or simultaneously, and for a full squad, can dish out 60 attacks, which is very likely on wiping out the squad they charge, just off the pure volume of attacks (well, Guardsmen at least).

Counter-Assault: A less aggressive use of charges - sitting them behind another unit, that has a decent chance of surviving a charge, and so that they don't absorb as much incoming fire as they might normally (though screening doesn't work anymore), and basically using the other unit as bait. Once that unit gets charged, and hopefully survives, the Kroot move in and charge, attacking to their full efficiency as they would not have taken any casualties as a result of the initial charge. Taking Kroot Hounds for both charges and counter-assault no longer has any disadvantages associated with the lack of a weapon - the Kroot have to choose whether to shoot rapid-fire weapons or assault anyway, under the new rules. And so, Kroot Hounds help to boost the squad size, attack simultaneously against marines, and inflict automatic hits should the enemy unit disengage from combat.


[size=12pt]Conclusion[/size]
Kroot are a bargain for their points cost. Their special rules (especially Infiltrate and Fieldcraft!) are really handy in making them effective, and allow them to be put to good use. I'm currently toying with the idea of a 2000 point list containing 100 Kroot. That's 5 whole squads that are able to infiltrate and assault on turn two. Though at first, it doesn't seem like too good an idea, I have some interesting tactics that I want to try with them.. not that I have that many Kroot in the first place, nor would I share them at the moment (until they're tested and proven of course :P).
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Old 23 Dec 2005, 02:21   #9 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Kroot...Bad or Good?

Remember that a 5+ save would be negated, anyway, by almost every weapon in the game. Its their only flaw.
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Old 23 Dec 2005, 02:30   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Kroot...Bad or Good?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MechTau
Remember that a 5+ save would be negated, anyway, by almost every weapon in the game. Its their only flaw.
No.. Cover Saves don't take AP into account (and so don't get negated, apart from by flamers) - so the Kroot get their saves.
[ See the top paragraph on Cover Saving Throws on page 25 of the BFM (Battle for Macragge) Rulebook ]
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