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Few questions
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Old 11 Jun 2007, 21:09   #1 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Few questions

Ok, I&#39;m thinking about starting a Blood Ravens army over the summer. As such, I have a few questions about the stuff in codex &#39;Dex.

1. If multiple Librarians use FoD in the same shooting phase and they are close enough to affect the same unit, does the unit test once at -4, or twice at -2 each time?

2. If a unit has both Furious Charge and Counter-Attack, and is charged, do the models who use the Counter-Attack move count as having Furious Charge kick in?

3. For Veteran Squads, in the part talking about Terminator Honours, can you give Terminator Honours to any individual member of the squad (provided the Sergeant already has them), such as a man with a powerfist, or does the entire squad have to buy them? I.e. is it an "all-or-nothing" deal?

4. For thunderhammers, I don&#39;t think I&#39;ve ever seen this addressed: when does the hammer count as wounding? Suppose the hammer rolls a wound against an enemy with an invul, and the enemy saves the wound. Does he strike at I1, or no? Sorry if this sounds idiotic, but I want to make sure I get it right the first time (got Assault Termies in the mail).

Thanks in advanced to anyone willing to answer these questions.
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Old 11 Jun 2007, 21:15   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Few questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by titankiller
Ok, I&#39;m thinking about starting a Blood Ravens army over the summer. As such, I have a few questions about the stuff in codex &#39;Dex.

1. If multiple Librarians use FoD in the same shooting phase and they are close enough to affect the same unit, does the unit test once at -4, or twice at -2 each time?
I&#39;d say twice at -2 each time.

Quote:
2. If a unit has both Furious Charge and Counter-Attack, and is charged, do the models who use the Counter-Attack move count as having Furious Charge kick in?
Nope, counter charge does not count as a charge, hence no gaining +1 attack etc.

Quote:
3. For Veteran Squads, in the part talking about Terminator Honours, can you give Terminator Honours to any individual member of the squad (provided the Sergeant already has them), such as a man with a powerfist, or does the entire squad have to buy them? I.e. is it an "all-or-nothing" deal?
I&#39;m not completely sure but I think you can take as many or as few as you want and it&#39;s not an all or nothing thing, but it doesn&#39;t give them access to the armory.

Quote:
4. For thunderhammers, I don&#39;t think I&#39;ve ever seen this addressed: when does the hammer count as wounding? Suppose the hammer rolls a wound against an enemy with an invul, and the enemy saves the wound. Does he strike at I1, or no? Sorry if this sounds idiotic, but I want to make sure I get it right the first time (got Assault Termies in the mail).
Wounds actually inflicted, thus those that are not saved as far as I understand it.

Quote:
Thanks in advanced to anyone willing to answer these questions.
I hope that helps and is correct. It&#39;s nice to see someone who knows how to use marines starting a Blood Ravens army, they are a fun chapter when you use the traits. I love my 1000pt list which has only 22 marines and a Land Speeder in it.
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Old 11 Jun 2007, 21:20   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Few questions

I think the terminator honours on a veteran squad are all or nothing. I know for sure that&#39;s how it was in the older codex. I don&#39;t have a new copy with me at work though, so I suppose it is possible (however unlikely that may be) that I&#39;m incorrect here.
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Old 11 Jun 2007, 21:50   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Few questions

I have my copy here:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Codex: Space Marines, pg. 32
If the Sergeant has Terminator Honours, every other Space Marine in the unit may be given them too at a cost of +10 points per model.
That&#39;s what the codex says, so I&#39;ll let you guys figure it out. :P

Also, Vash, I know they don&#39;t get the +1 attack for CA, but on the USR page of the main book it says:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Warhammer 40,000 Rulebook, Universal Special Rules, pg. 74
Treat the counter-attack as you would an Assault move, so take terrain into account as normal.
To my understanding, that means that you treat the move as a charge, but the model simply does not gain +1A for it. Hence why I believe that Furious Charge kicks in. However, if there has been a specific ruling against this, I&#39;d like to see it.

Thanks for the replies.
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Old 11 Jun 2007, 22:04   #5 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Few questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by titankiller
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warhammer 40,000 Rulebook, Universal Special Rules, pg. 74
Treat the counter-attack as you would an Assault move, so take terrain into account as normal.
To my understanding, that means that you treat the move as a charge, but the model simply does not gain +1A for it. Hence why I believe that Furious Charge kicks in. However, if there has been a specific ruling against this, I&#39;d like to see it.

Thanks for the replies.
I think the ruling implies that you are to treat the counter-attack as a charge in movement only. Thus the "assault move" part, it doesn&#39;t say "charge" so I don&#39;t think you would get the benefits.
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Old 11 Jun 2007, 22:50   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Few questions

As ThatGuy said the USR specifically says it is an "assault move," which implies only movement, not the other aspects, and then continues saying that the counter charging unit does not get +1 Attack. If they do not get that basic aspect of chargint I doubt they would still get another different Special Rule.

And given the text for Terminator Honors it does not say that if you use the option that all must have it, so I would say it is not one of those all or nothing things.
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Old 12 Jun 2007, 07:28   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Few questions

When I read the passage about the terminator honours, I thought that it was all or nothing, but I can now see how it could be seen to go the other way. All or nothing is how it goes for the game shop I go to, if that helps. :
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Old 12 Jun 2007, 08:23   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Few questions

Well then I&#39;d say the game shop is wrong, there is nothing in the passage that says anything about it being all or nothing.
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Old 12 Jun 2007, 13:30   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Few questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by Codex: Space Marines, pg. 32
If the Sergeant has Terminator Honours, every other Space Marine in the unit may be given them too at a cost of +10 points per model.
The every seems to imply the whole unit to me. It&#39;d be very difficult to track who had extra attacks and who didn&#39;t otherwise.
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Originally Posted by heliodorus04
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Originally Posted by Farseer_Emlyn
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Originally Posted by Rafe (Autarch Kiardras)
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Old 12 Jun 2007, 13:36   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Few questions

I have a question on something else that is also all or nothing. I always thought that frag grenades and krak were all or nothing for the entire squad, but my friend bought it only for four marines in his unit, and he as dead set that you could do that. Now that doesnt sound right, is it?
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