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Whats your perspective on Black Templars?
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Old 19 May 2007, 14:33   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Whats your perspective on Black Templars?

Im starting their army and read through some of the codex. Seems pretty fun with the vows and close combat weaponry. I love the look of their ornate armor and flags. High marshall helbrect seems to be a force to be reckoned with as well. What do you guys think?

I chose them because while space marines have good shooting, I wanted to be an expert in close combat. And these Black Crusaders basically whoop ass I've heard.
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Old 19 May 2007, 15:04   #2 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Whats your perspective on Black Templars?

Quote:
Originally Posted by F3Zero
And these Black Crusaders basically whoop ass I've heard.
You heard right. Black Templars are expert CQC fighters and will never run in CC due to their "No Pity, No Remorse, No Fear" rule. Helbrecht and Grimaldus themselves are strong enough to kill whole squads. There was once a time where I had stuck Helbrecht in a command squad of all CC weapons and I charged my opponent (chaos) and obliterated most of his army. Though I lost (forgeworld Bloodthirster) I killed.

What you should never do though is to just charge at the enemy, especially tau. Long-range armies are a devestaion to all-out charging armies. Ensure you have one or two tac squads with well fortified positions to cover your charge units.
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Old 19 May 2007, 16:36   #3 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Whats your perspective on Black Templars?

Im new to this and dont understand close combat. It says I can equip one guy with either a powerfist, or powerweapon for extra points.

Whats the difference between a chainsword, powersword, and powerfist? Basically my regular troops are going to be like this 4 with bolt pistols and chainswords, 4 with bolters, one with a melta gun, and my squad leader with the powerfist and pistol I guess.
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Old 20 May 2007, 01:07   #4 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Whats your perspective on Black Templars?

Don't mix bolters and Bolt Pistol/CCW, because if you fire the bolters you can't charge and if you want to charge you then waste the bolter shots.

I don't want to give out too many rules here, but all the rules are on Page 46 of the Rulebook.

A chainsword is just a type of Close Combat Weapon (CCW). All it does is give +1 Attack in close combat.

A powersword's rules are described on page 46 of the rulebook. It's a CCW that ignores armor.

A powerfist is again described on pageg 46 (Page 46 has most of these things, like Thunder Hammers, LIghtning Claws, etc.). It counts as a powersword that doubles the users strength and strikes at Initiative one.
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Old 20 May 2007, 04:12   #5 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Whats your perspective on Black Templars?

Just a little note, lightning claws don't function as power fists. On to the subject, Black Templar actually don't have as much special CC abilities as the fluff suggests. I'm just pointing this out so you're not disappointed. They are good in CC though, and have several special rules that help them. The main thing I have to say with BT is make sure you have a way to shut down extremely powerful shooting lists from annihlating your units. Be that bikes, drop pod units, or infilitrating, don't just use a tidal wave of Black and White marines. It looks fun but it doesn't usually work out.
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Old 20 May 2007, 07:21   #6 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Whats your perspective on Black Templars?

Also, remember that when you give a Marine (Codex/BT/other) a heavy/special weapon, unless it says "replaces", he keeps the weapon(s) he had before. Therefore, if you take a marine armed with a powerfist and pistol, remember that he can start with a bolter too. Thus, if you have the vow Accept Any Challenge, No Matter The Odds, he can fire that and prevent the squad from charging if it would be unfavorable circumstances.

On the subject of vows, here&#39;s a rundown of them, since you&#39;re probably wondering:

Suffer Not The Unclean To Live: It works well against armies that either already go faster than your men (Eldar come to mind), or go considerably slower (like Tau, sometimes Orks). If it reduces you to going after the enemy, or at the same time, don&#39;t take it.

Up Hold The Honour Of The Emperor: Cheapest one, it works well in small-point games, and is best when you&#39;re playing with little-to-no cover, or you&#39;re enemy has lots of AP3 or Pinning weapons.

Abhor The Witch, Destroy The Witch: A very situational vow, it only works if the enemy has a psyker in their army. Its useful against Eldar and some Choas and Imperial armies, but worthless against Tau (maybe Necrons too, I&#39;m not sure if they have psykers or not).

Accept Any Challenge, No Matter The Odds: In MY opinion, this is the best vow, especially for a "take-all-comers" list. The ability to strike you&#39;re opponents (no matter who they are) on a 3+ in CC is simply awesome. Combine this with at least 1 chaplain, and the enemy is pretty much doomed. But again, that is my opinion.

Hope this helps.
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Old 21 May 2007, 04:27   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Whats your perspective on Black Templars?

I would say that they are one of the most fun and devistating armies to play. But it all depends on how you play them, and due to that they have a steep learning curves. I have been playing them for a year now and I&#39;m just now starting to get a hang of them, that said I have only lost two or three times in the past month with my Templar(non, combat patrols that is, i&#39;ve only lost 2 though!) and each one of my victories has been a Victorious Slaughter. If I can eliminate your anti-tank, I win. No questions asked. If I get into CC, most of your army will die, no questions asked, I took on a genesteeler list, and whiped them to a man. I had 3 Crusaders and 2 Vindicators left alive.
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Old 22 May 2007, 13:19   #8 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Whats your perspective on Black Templars?

I built my squad so six have cc and bolt pistol, the squad leader has the bolt pistl and power sword, and 3 have bolters. Good mix right?
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Old 22 May 2007, 15:34   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Whats your perspective on Black Templars?

I prefer the bolt pistol/power fist combo due to the fact that it can take on ANYTHING and win. And just remember that if you fire the bolters you cant charge, which is why I prefer to have dedicated assault units, and dedicated fire support units.
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Old 23 May 2007, 00:52   #10 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Whats your perspective on Black Templars?

Quote:
Originally Posted by F3Zero
I built my squad so six have cc and bolt pistol, the squad leader has the bolt pistl and power sword, and 3 have bolters. Good mix right?
Mind you there are no squad leaders. The bolters can be dropped, because a combat squad should stay a combat squad.
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