[Terminatus]

As many of you know, I tend to complain a lot, especially if I get my ass handed to me... We'll it's time for another round of that...

Today I was in a 3-on-3 with my buddies, My side consisted of me (Salamnder's Successor), Ultramarines and Death Guard [this was his 3rd game ever]... Whil the other side had 2 awesome players, who just happen to be brothers, on it (LatD, Necrons and Space Wolves)...

My list was as follows:

Master
Art Arm
IH
MC PW
Termie Honors

Tac squad x3
8 marines
TG+CC
2 plasma guns
vet sarge, PF

Ven dread
Lascannon
CCW

Pred
TL Lascannon
HB sponsons
stormbolter
xtra armor

Ultramarines had a 5-man termie squad with a CML and an assault cannon w/ attahced chaplain
5-man sniper scout squad
10-man bolter scout squad
5-man assault marine squad
5-man tac squad w/ plasma cannon
Techmanrine w/ 4 HB servitors

Death Guard had 2 14-man CSM squads with all bolters
A CC dreadnought
a 7-man Chosen squad with 2 plasma guns and a PF
A Termie lord with a manreaper

My opponents had soemthing like this

Crons:
3 wraiths with destroyer lord (Ivul + warscythe)
2 10-man warrior squads
Lord w/ res orb
a bunch of scarab swarms

LatD:
huge Mutant squad (probably 20+ mutants)
Aspiring Champ with Plasma pistol
Rough Rider squad of ~10
squad of ~10 chaos puppies
Big mutant squad of ~10
basilisk
2 teams of rockets

Space Wolves:
2 rather large squads of Bloodclaws w/3 PF each
a 5 man squad of Grey Hunters
A Wolf Priest and a Rune Priest
Wolf Scouts

The beggining of the game went well ,I had to remind the death guard player of a few things, but it started off well... Things went down hill as the gap between the armies started to close; The basilisk popped the CC dread and killed a few marines, the scarabs and the rough riders came up the right flank with the wraiths and lord and a squad of bloodclaws (eventually) while another squad of scarabs and the puppies came up with the the mutants, large and small, followign suit while the rest of the crons and the LatD fire teams stayed back... we were forced to engae the enemy, eventually killign them but were too few in number by the end of the slaughter to really do anything... we callled it whe I had lost all my marines, and only had the dread and pred left, Death Guard had a few marines and Ultra marines were barely standing...

So... this was a game fo noob vs veterans... the space wolf player is such an idiot, he claimed that the team of brothers was unfair until he rolled for teams and he joined them, btu he only got into close combat at the very end and got raped by the manreaper... As I have stated in the past, I am really sick of getting my ass kicked, although this was not such a massacre as the last one... My friends are convinced that the only way to win with marines is to play cheese and I refuse to believe that, there has to be another way... Feel free to tell me I'm an idiot, because odds are you're right...

[Chton]

IH!
Sorry :
Posted in the wrong thread...

Ah, well...
It seems your opponents has the absolute superiority in numbers.
The less models on the table, the lesser amount of firepower you'll have.
Try to use more standard Marines.
And you should have added meltaguns or flamers instead of the plasmaguns.
It is a melee squad after all.

[Terminatus]

Ok, I understand that there wasn't really a question or anything in the first post, so that's why it was spammed...

Anyway, I would like to know what the hell I'm doing wrong.... out of 60+ games I've won 4, it's atrocious... My friend tells me to play smaller games and one day it will just click like 'this is how my army is supposed to work'... perhaps I am using the wrong traits, or maybe my squad configurations are wrong, any advice that is relevant to my plight would be extraordinarily helpful...

Thanks

[icer190]

I'm starting to get the hang of my Templar very well now that its almost 1 tournament and 1 year after I had started. And I'm doing pretty good now, though I still dont do very good against the more veteran players, I can now almost hold my own.

[Praying Mantidae]

Well in this case I think it just boils down to a rather unfair match-up. Veterans vs. relatively inexperienced players often ends in tears...


Just keep at it, keep playing games. As your friend said, play some smaller games for a bit. Figure out what sort of things your army is strong with, and what weaknesses it has. Eventually it will just "click". Some people just get the "click" faster than others.

[Cadaver]

You aren't going to get a feel for your army playing multiplayer games where you have to rely on teammates and have them rely on you during a game. I'm sure you have played many 1 on 1 games and that's what I would concentrate on for the time being.

Don't be afraid to try new things, either. When I got back into the hobby a few months ago I played my marines differently every game. It helps that I have over 3,000 points of marines but if you have a decent amount of stuff you can still change things up alot. I don't know what size army you are working with but if you could list everything you own I'd be happy to give you some specific suggestions for what you have.

Until I get a better idea of what you're working with I'll tell you about one of my favorite tactics. It's called The Hammer and Anvil, basically you split you forces to two sides of the board. You will put your fast moving units on Side A and put the bulk of your troops and big guns on Side B. Side A(the Hammer) will advance rapidly into the enemy causing them to shoot back at the immediate threat. Side B(the Anvil) will stay put or advance slowly staying together. Ideally the units being attacked by the Hammer will move away from those units and be met by the large, more destructive force of the Anvil.

Now obviously that's an over-simplification of how things will play out. You will no doubt have units attacking the Anvil from the start and the Hammer could be destroyed in the first few turns but the principle is that you make them react to your moves, not the other way around.

Like I said before, that's just one example. If you post all you've got I will give you some more suggestions on how to start winning battles. Keep your faith, the Emperor will not fail you.

[Betus Maximus]

the best thing to do is play lots of small (750pts) 1 v 1 games and swap around your army list. a tactic is get infiltrators! scouts can be destructive. it forces the oponent to either kill them or ignor them to try and concentrate on your main army and get blown to pieces by them!

[Hyena031]

Warrrrrrrrrrgghhhhhhhhhh to Bertus Maximus for his point on dem infiltrators....me love using dat tatic with me Kommandos...they actually set the pace for da fight...not your Git opponent....Bertus you be a wise 'Umie

Blood Claw of da Imitators

[omnivision6]

I know were your comming from. It took me almost a year to win my first game with my dark eldar. But trust everybody when they say to keep at it. Have you considered another army? Perhaps your style favors something marines cant offer. I would strongly suggest you think about that. Keep at it man, and keep your faith in your weak emporer.

[Cadaver]

Originally Posted by Bertus Maximus

the best thing to do is play lots of small (750pts) 1 v 1 games and swap around your army list. a tactic is get infiltrators! scouts can be destructive. it forces the oponent to either kill them or ignor them to try and concentrate on your main army and get blown to pieces by them!

I completely disagree. Games as small as 750 points do not allow enough options. And suggesting "get infiltrators" with no other advice isn't helpful. Sure, scouts can be very useful troops but without knowing what he might have to support that choice does nothing to help him learn winning tactics.

Originally Posted by omnivision6

I know were your comming from. It took me almost a year to win my first game with my dark eldar. But trust everybody when they say to keep at it. Have you considered another army? Perhaps your style favors something marines cant offer. I would strongly suggest you think about that. Keep at it man, and keep your faith in your weak emporer.

Without trying to be rude, I think saying its personal style is a cop-out. I just played my first game with Tau yesterday and won against drop troop IG. I hadn't played my opponents army ever. It's all about tactics, and to a small extent, luck. Alot of people cry cheesy and beardy when they don't win, and I'm not accusing any posters of this, but I believe every army is balanced and you simply have to learn their strengths and weaknesses.