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commander wargear
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Old 21 Aug 2006, 08:00   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default commander wargear

Im having trouble picking what wargear to give my commander ???. First i wanted a plasma/thunder hammer combo but then i got thinking, should i use lightning claws or add an adamantine mantle or mabye put in an iron halo. I am realy confused as to what is the best equipment i mean should i just go for the cheapo commander or give him lots of stuff to make him deadly :huh:. Help me please!

(By the way he is a master)

Thanks*

(oh my old guy had a power sword, and adamantine mantle and a storm bolter and he seemed to work pretty well)
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Old 21 Aug 2006, 08:23   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: commander wargear

I made a comander with plasma, thunder ha mmer, iron halo.
Not best idea. It moves slowly, and is expensive.

Best idea,jump pack,power wepon,bolt pistol.(4 attacks,5 on charge.)96 points. Use to crush heavy wepons but not cc specialist.

Cheapo is most deadly.
You can go for 2 of the above wich will have total of 8 attacks or-make a expensive killing machine who at best has 5 attacks.


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Old 21 Aug 2006, 10:52   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: commander wargear

first you gotta tell us what kind of army he'll be leading. then its a matter of points value paid versus total points.

for me, I lean toward shooty, but thats because I play Dark Angels and they lean toward shooty. So my master (when I take him) has an Iron Halo (just seems fluffy that the master of a company would have one, when I take him as a commander he doesn't get it) a storm bolter and the sword of secrets which again is only taken to be fluffy.

if I were to go close combat oriented I would probably go bolt pistol, power sword and terminator honors (I had forgotten to type that for the first one as it is mandatory for dark angels). the other option is lightning claws for the reroll to wound (which is nasty)

as for arming him with either a power fist or in your case the thunder hammer, I wouldn't unless I were to buy him a power weapon also, as you would need to be able to switch between the two or waste his higher initiative.
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Old 21 Aug 2006, 15:34   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: commander wargear

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bertus Maximus
Im having trouble picking what wargear to give my commander ???. First i wanted a plasma/thunder hammer combo but then i got thinking, should i use lightning claws or add an adamantine mantle or mabye put in an iron halo. I am realy confused as to what is the best equipment i mean should i just go for the cheapo commander or give him lots of stuff to make him deadly :huh:. Help me please!

(By the way he is a master)

Thanks

(oh my old guy had a power sword, and adamantine mantle and a storm bolter and he seemed to work pretty well)
Heya,

Your HQ will be better for you, for his cost, if you give him a purpose in your army. He's a master, so he's good to keep alive. You may want to keep him out of assault in that case, or at least, away from the front lines so that he will live longer and provide his generous rites of battle to the army. In that sense, you don't need to take anything really. A storm bolter would be appropriate with an auspex and call it a day. Attach him to a Command squad with heavy bolters and take a ranged reserved approach for example.

However, if you want to get up close and personal with him, consider other options. Thunder Hammers are nice, but they cost a mint and are only truly useful against seriously dangerous threats in assault--monstrous creatures, enemy marines, etc. These threats single you out in assault, because you're an ind. character. You may want to make note of that because if you strike last with a thunder hammer, you may die before getting a chance to do anything with it. The plasma pistol will generally only get fired once, because of the low range and then you'll be in assault. So is it worth it? Probably not. If you plan on being in assault, consider things that get you there faster. Enhanced movement modes are critical. Jump pack and Bikes offer these to you. Defense is important, such as a Storm Shield or Combat Shield. Lots to consider.

So, a few things to consider since this is Space Marines. If you want to be in assault, the Bike is going to be a great buy for you. The T5 is a great way to extend your life in assault. It also keeps you alive on the way to assault, because you're fast and you can turbo boost if you think you will be stranded to go for a great invulnerable save. Simply add a CCW or bolt pistol and take a power fist under your wing, or power weapon if you want to keep initiative and you're set (for relatively cheap). Alternatively, a jump pack with a power weapon or lightning claws can take you very far in assault. Moving fast, choosing assault targets instead of being the target yourself. Killing things in the 2" kill zone is how you keep yourself alive far more often than using defensive upgrades which cost a mint and only give you a small chance of extra survival. If you take him into a Drop Pod with a Command Squad, rigged for close range assault, you can forgo the jump packs, bikes, etc and keep him simple and even cheaper.

Think of what you need him to do. Think of where you want him to be. Think of who you are facing often and if he's the right character for assault, or if he needs to hang back and just survive and support.

Example(s):

Reserved, Support
Master with Storm Bolter, Auspex
Command Squad; 5x Space Marines with 2x Heavy Bolters
~187 points (think of it like a mini devastator squad, but fielded as an HQ in deployment)

Drop Pod
Master with Pair of Lightning Claws and Iron Halo
Command Squad; 7x Space Marines, 2x Meltaguns
Drop Pod
~285 points (expensive, but potent and mobile)

Jump Pack, Solo
Master with Jump Pack, Pair of Lightning Claws, Frag Grenades
~126 points. (151 points if you want to add an Iron Halo, though personally I wouldn't bother)

Bike, Solo
Master with Space Marine Bike, Power Fist, Bolt Pistol
~131 points. (Basic setup, but very powerful; you can add artificer armor for a 2+ inv save upon turbo boost)

Cheers!
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Old 21 Aug 2006, 17:06   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: commander wargear

As has already been pointed out, commanders are worth keeping alive, even if they're not actively fighting. Chaplains are the scary kill-machines of Space Marine close combat, but it'd be a shame to waste the commander's excellant close combat stats.

That being so, I've found the balance between keeping him out of harms way and making the most of his close combat prowess is to stuff him in a Land Raider with a close combat oriented command squad. It could be that your Land Raider gets knocked out early every game, but I play with a lot of vehicles and I find mine tends to survive.

Using this tactic, my commander and his 'dead-fighty' squad rumble steadily across the battlefield in their Prometheus, blatting away with all four twin-linked heavy bolters for the first couple of turns then forgo shooting to race forward 12" and deliver the troops into combat on turn three (sometimes four). Most enemy squads are almost completely destroyed in this manner (many before they even get to land a blow) and then the unit is free to find a new target in the last couple of turns or consolidate their position on an objective. It's expensive (although the Prometheus always pays for itself...don't know about other varients mind you), but it gives you the flexibility to re-deploy your command squad, make the most of 'rites of battle', seize an objective at the last moment and utilize your commander's martial prowess. They also make an effective Quick Reaction Force, able to 'catapult' a fighty command squad into combat up to 20" away in a single turn.

Alternatively, if you use the conventional Land Raider in this fashion, then you could replace the command squad with an assault squad. It'd mean losing the option for specialists and some special/heavy weapons (which, by all accounts, are overrated anyway), but on the plus side; meltabombs give your command squad an added edge against enemy vehicles (and flamers are still great when you're charging down the assault ramp at a mass of infantry).

This is not really what you're asking, I know...but I thought I would explain how I make the most out of my commander (when I use him), without sacrificing either his close combat prowess or his unique special rule.
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Old 21 Aug 2006, 20:48   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: commander wargear

Power weapon, bolt pistol, combat shield (if not a Chaplain) and terminator honours. All you really need now is some Furious Assault love and you've got 6 WS5 attacks at S5 and I6. That'll murder other Marines...and that's what I believe his best use is

If you can't hurt stuff with that, you've got problems.
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Old 21 Aug 2006, 21:27   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: commander wargear

Personally a couple of combinations I have been toying with.

Assault Commander
-Master, pair of lightning claws, melta bombs, terminator honors, jump pack, iron halo (or combat shield and adamantine mantle), frag grenades and artificer armor.
An expencive commander but very mean, useful and fast. However I find a chappy does this job better and for less.

Basic Shooty
-Master, storm bolter, power weapon, melta bombs, frag grenades. iron halo and terminator honors
Some cc ability and can add some shooty power. Mostly to hang back with a firebase and support them with the storm bolter and fend off any assaulty things that get to them.

Dirt Cheap
-Master with bolter
Very cheap leadership 10 for everyone.

In my recent battles Ive been experimenting with my commander and have found that its best to keep him relatively cheap and held with the firebase to preserve that leadership 10 all around. Then if you need assaulty power a chaplain does quite well. I use a Master of Sanctity with a bolt pistol, melta bombs, frag grenades, terminator honors, artificer armor and jump pack. Last game he literally tore through every infantry squad my opponent had. Lost his assault squad he was attatched to on the way but killed the enemy so it worked.

Good luck with your commander.
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Old 22 Aug 2006, 06:36   #8 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: commander wargear

alright, here's an older (read: much older) discussion about equipping characters for combat

but as far as i can see it, you've got 2 really good choices: thunder hammer, combat shield and adamantium mantle, plus whatever off-hand weapon you might desire (power weapon, plasma pistol, both are good), either jump-packed or thrown in a transport with form of retinue or lightning claws and an iron halo. for a combat efficient commander, these are probably the best options available
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Old 25 Aug 2006, 22:44   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: commander wargear

i have had an idea for equiping my commander, either a power fist, storm bolter and iron halo or a lightning claw, a storm bolter and an iron halo.

comments please
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Old 25 Aug 2006, 23:23   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: commander wargear

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bertus Maximus
i have had an idea for equiping my commander, either a power fist, storm bolter and iron halo or a lightning claw, a storm bolter and an iron halo.

comments please
It's not great; your commander, like all IC's, should always be attached to a squad. As such, assuming his squad doesn't get completely wiped out during the course of a game, he should only ever be expected to make his own saving throws during close combat (where he is targeted as a seperate unit). This obviously reduces the usefulness of an Iron halo, perhaps to the point that you may find a simple combat shield is an adequote substitute for 15 points less (or a storm shield if you're willing to part with your second weapon).

Some may also regard the Power Fist as a mistake because you're sacrificing his high initiative. I'm on the fence about this however; commanders have a high number of attacks and despite their ability to strike first in most situations, six Power Fist attacks is a scary prospect. Having an Iron Halo or a combat/storm shield helps in this situation. Your commander can expect to face power weapons during the course of a game's worth of close combat, and because he's striking last he really needs some protection against these sort of weapons. If you like the idea of a powerfist, then you should really consider a Thunder Hammer. They do everything a Power Fist does and more for just an extra 5 points...plus, they look damn cool.

Lightning Claws are another viable close combat weapon and there is no drawback to taking a Storm Bolter instead of another one-handed weapon, because you can only get an additional attack from having another Lightning Claw. On paper, 5 attacks that ignore armour and can re-roll to wound are slightly better on average than 6 normal power weapon attacks (although there is obviously less potential).

As for your second weapon, assuming you don't take a storm shield (or, as already discussed, a Lightning Claw), a Bolt Pistol may be a better choice than a Storm Bolter. It may not have the same shooty potential, but if you're aiming to get your Commander into close combat, then the extra attack will be very welcome.

You can also gain another attack, for a total of 6 on the charge, by giving him Terminator Honours.
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