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[1500] Tau Player trying out Marines
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Old 25 Oct 2005, 18:36   #1 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default [1500] Tau Player trying out Marines

I've only ever played Tau against marines, but now that my Tau are done, I'm building a SM army - mostly with lots of old 1980s minis and some mix of new ones. I chose the Mentors Legion (888) because I love their colors and the challenge of painting them (white is difficult).

For traits, I went with "Purity Above all" and "No Librarians" (I forget the Codex name). Psychics are tools of Chaos and the Mentors won't use them!
Now, I've never built a SM list and it's difficult to write up a list without knowing what's super cheezy and what's not. I've tried to build my 1500 point list as a "take all comers" list, but I think I may be missing some elements. Can anyone provide some advice before I start painting? Also, I think I have a bit of Tau-envy cause I think I built a list that goes overthetop in vehicle destruction.

1500 Point Mentor Army:
HQ:
Master Commander, Artificer Armor, Bolt Pistol/Sword
Master of Sanctity, Jump Pack, Bolt Pistol
HQ Squad, 7 Marines, MultiMelta, MeltaGun, Apothecary, Infiltrate Upgrade, Champion, Frag&Krak
Total: 446

Troops:
6 Scouts, 2 w/ Sniper Rifles, Bolt Pistols/Swords
8 Tacticals, Hvy Bolter, Plasma Gun, Honours, Apothecary Upgrade
8 Tacticals, Hvy Bolter, Plasma Gun, Honours, Apothecary Upgrade
Total: 438

Fast Attack:
2 Speeders, MultiMeltas
3 Bikes, Meltabombs, Honours
8 Assault Marines w/ Jump Packs, Honours and Meltabombs
Total: 454

Heavy Support:
5 Devastators, 4 Missile Launchers
Total: 155

My plan is to get hit whoever I face (mainly Necron and Marines, but sometimes Eldar) fast and hard with my FastAttack and infiltrating HQ. My Devastators and Tacticals can mop up whatever is not engaged. All the meltas are for taking out vehicles if any decide to show up. Is the list too powergaming? I'm worried I don't have enough for swarm creatures like Tyranids, but I've never played a Tyranid army (no one I know has one and actually plays!). I can see this list giving my Tau some problems (not more than any other SM army though). Any thoughts? If it's too powergaming, I don't want to play it. For reference, I also have in my box of goodies:

Lots more Tactical Marines. Like 80 or so. I can pretty much field any weapon config/payout.
Land Raider Crusader
2 Razorbacks awaiting rhino-razor conversions.
5 Assault Termies (3 lightning, 2 hammers)
7 Normal Termies (1 flamer, 1 sarge, 5 normal)

Be brutal! I don't mind!
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Old 25 Oct 2005, 22:16   #2 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: [1500] Tau Player trying out Marines

Yes, someone else making the transition from Tau to Marines... though I cant help ya much. I will say good luck though!

The mentors legion colors with some old minis, you should post some pics when you have them painted.
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Old 26 Oct 2005, 02:59   #3 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: [1500] Tau Player trying out Marines

Quote:
Master Commander, Artificer Armor, Bolt Pistol/Sword
Master of Sanctity, Jump Pack, Bolt Pistol
HQ Squad, 7 Marines, MultiMelta, MeltaGun, Apothecary, Infiltrate Upgrade, Champion, Frag&Krak
Total: 446
That is a MASSIVE amount of points going into one squad, nearly a third of your entire army! I'm not the biggest fan of having the twin Meltas in there, especially since you have 3 assault oriented characters. Also seeing as your army is primarily shooty oriented, you should have a counter assault unit to protect the troops, while the fast attack units harrass the enemy. BTW that list is no way cheesy.
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Old 26 Oct 2005, 03:03   #4 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: [1500] Tau Player trying out Marines

Now that I think about it what I would do with the command squad.

Use the standard command squad box, and give the marine a melta and the sergeant a power fist and bolt pistol. Have the commander as a captain and give him a power fist and either a storm bolter or melta bolter combo. This way you have a very assaulty unit that has 2 power fists and 1 or 2 meltas that have a good chance to take down armor. Also consider giving your commander purity seals and an iron halo just so no power weapons take him down too easily. Also if you can mount them in a rhino for mobility. That gives you speed and versatility to go on a counter attack, meet enemy assaulters on your own terms and run up to punch any vehicles and large tanks you come across.
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Old 26 Oct 2005, 03:31   #5 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: [1500] Tau Player trying out Marines

ok, starting from HQ: ditch the arti-armour. buy him a decent weapon instead. arti-armour is pretty useless. wounds will be taken on the squaddies from shooting weapons, and in combat, the only people who are gonna be tackling him are gonna have weapons that ignore saves anyway. next, i'd be taking a different shooting weapon to the multi-melta...its short range inhibits its usefulness on static units. it might also be worth giving the sarge a powerfist

troops: why only 2 sniper-rifles?? and combined with close combat weapons?? this squad config doesn't really make sense to me. assault weapons would be a better choice here...also, the tac squads with veteran sarges: they could do with a powerfist or similar

fast attack: i don't really see only 3 bikes being useful...i'd be opting for ditching the bikes and breaking the speeders into 2 squadrons (more versatile that way). i'd also lose the meltabombs on the assault marines, and giving the sarge a powerfist instead

heavy support: bulk out the devs. the second casualty on this squad is gonna remove a heavy weapon, which is never a good thing
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Old 26 Oct 2005, 14:39   #6 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: [1500] Tau Player trying out Marines

Well, I picked the artificer armor because the model I have looks like he has artificer armor. I can always use a different commander model I guess. The Master will be attached to the HQ squad, while the Chaplain will be attached to the Assault marine squad. That is a legal breakout of the two HQs right?

Several comments to good suggestions:

1. The multimelta is there because my HQ squad can infiltrate, which will probably place me in a tank busting position first turn with them. I could drop it though and add a power weapon.

2. The scouts have close combat weapons because they are the models I own. Also, everytime I've seen scouts in play they get assaulted and die horribly because they lack that extra attack. Giving them sniper rifles was just icing on the cake, since I've faced down the barrel many times. I thought it'd be fun to use them! I could rethink the plan and just reduce to the squad to all close combat weapons.

3. The bikes are the iffiest option I think and your advice is good (my original list had the speeders broken out). I got the bikes in an ebay deal and all I have are 3. I have never seen them fielded and never used them…is 3 too low? Even with all the other assault elements I have in the squads? At what number are they more useful? 5? What if I had a bike with the sidecar? If I drop them, I could add a Rhino for one of the Tacts.

4. Pad out the devastators. Good advice. I should have realized this since when playing marines, I usually get rid of the devastators pretty quickly.

5. You'll note I upgraded all my Sgts. to Apothecarys, Bfangs. I don't think they can take a powerfist, nor would I want to give them one! One in my assault squad does make sense though. I can probably find some points if follow your other suggestions.
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Old 26 Oct 2005, 20:02   #7 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: [1500] Tau Player trying out Marines

I'm doing this too now that my Tau are complete. I just gotta wait for the BT codex next week! ;D

If you want to really go all out for assault, consider adding Drop Pods in favor of some of the slower elements (such as the Termies.) Assuming the scatter dice don't blow you too far off course, they can be a great way of busting out real close to your opponent.
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Old 26 Oct 2005, 20:11   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: [1500] Tau Player trying out Marines

Quote:
Originally Posted by cawshis
Well, I picked the artificer armor because the model I have looks like he has artificer armor.
OH what model do you have then? I dont think the commander model looks like he has artificer armor so what one are you using?
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Old 27 Oct 2005, 00:28   #9 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: [1500] Tau Player trying out Marines

Quote:
Originally Posted by cawshis
Well, I picked the artificer armor because the model I have looks like he has artificer armor.* I can always use a different commander model I guess.* The Master will be attached to the HQ squad, while the Chaplain will be attached to the Assault marine squad.* That is a legal breakout of the two HQs right?
yes, i do believe it is. and btw, just because the model looks like he has arti-armour, doesn't mean he has to be equipped with it . it might just be personalised power armour or something, so no need to pick up an extra commander

Quote:
1.* The multimelta is there because my HQ squad can infiltrate, which will probably place me in a tank busting position first turn with them.* I could drop it though and add a power weapon.*
i'd be dropping it, and picking up a powerfist or something

Quote:
2.* The scouts have close combat weapons because they are the models I own.* Also, everytime I've seen scouts in play they get assaulted and die horribly because they lack that extra attack.* Giving them sniper rifles was just icing on the cake, since I've faced down the barrel many times.* I thought it'd be fun to use them!* I could rethink the plan and just reduce to the squad to all close combat weapons.
all close combat weapons would, IMO, be a much better way to do things, perhaps with a flamer thrown in

Quote:
3.* The bikes are the iffiest option I think and your advice is good (my original list had the speeders broken out).* I got the bikes in an ebay deal and all I have are 3.* I have never seen them fielded and never used them…is 3 too low?* Even with all the other assault elements I have in the squads?* At what number are they more useful?* 5?* What if I had a bike with the sidecar?* If I drop them, I could add a Rhino for one of the Tacts.
i'd recommend 5...full squad or nothing . honestly, i've never seen only 3 bikes acheive anything useful (well, maybe once, but that was a fluke). honestly, i'd say the rhino would be a better idea

Quote:
5.* You'll note I upgraded all my Sgts. to Apothecarys, Bfangs.* I don't think they can take a powerfist, nor would I want to give them one!* One in my assault squad does make sense though.* I can probably find some points if follow your other suggestions.
whoops, didn't notice the apothecary bit...my bad. but you definitely want that power fist in the assault squad, otherwise they can too easily get trapped by a wraithlord or dreadnought (fists are much better at messing up dreads than meltabombs, IMO) or independednt character...or monstrous critter...
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Old 27 Oct 2005, 03:37   #10 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: [1500] Tau Player trying out Marines

Can Scouts have a flamer? I don't see one in the listing.

New and improved 1500 Mentors (Purity Above All, Have Faith in Suspicion) starter list:

Master Commander, Iron Halo, Power Sword, Bolt Pistol, Frag/Krak
Master of Sanctity Chaplain, Jump Pack, Bolt Pistol, Frag
HQ Squad, 7 Marines, Meltagun, Apothecary, Champion, Infiltrate, Frag/Krak
HQ Total:445

6 Scouts Bolt Pistols/Swords
8 Tacticals, Hvy Bolter, Plasma Gun, Honours, Apothecary Upgrade, Rhino w/ Armour, Smoke, Light
8 Tacticals, Hvy Bolter, Plasma Gun, Honours, Apothecary Upgrade, Rhino w/ Armour, Smoke, Light
Troop Total: 544

6 Assault Marines, Jump Packs, Honours, Power Fist
Land Speeder w/ MultiMelta
Land Speeder w/ MultiMelta
Fast Attack Total: 292

8 Devastators, 4 Missile Launchers, Honours
Heavy Support Total: 215

Total: 1499

I think I'm happy with this list. Once I get another bike and a heavy bike, I'll figure out a way to field them in the 2k army.
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