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1600 pts Blood Angels with Death Company
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Old 09 Jun 2010, 20:57   #1 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 35
Default 1600 pts Blood Angels with Death Company

Hi there!

I need a 1600pts Blood Angels army for a campaign (opponents will mostly be Tyranids, Chaos and Space Marines). Fascinated by DC, I wanted to include these chaps – mainly because I really want those DC-Dreads… Just have to play a few games to see how much I am hampered by their Black rage, though.

[HQ]

HQ 1: : 160 points
- Reclusiarch: Jump pack, Melta bombs

[hr]

[ELITES]

Elite 1: : 80points
- 1x Sanguinary Priest, Jump pack, Melta bombs

[hr]

[TROOPS]

Troops 1: : 240 points
- 10 Assault Marines, 2xMelta, Sergeant: Thunder Hammer

Troops 2: : 220 points
- 10 Assault Marines, 2xFlamer, Sergeant: Power weapon, Melta Bombs

Troops 3: : 265 points
- 10 Death Company, all Bolters, 1xThunder Hammer, Drop Pod

Troops 4: : 185 points
- Death Company Dreadnought, Blood Fists, Magna-grapple, HeavyFlamer, Drop Pod

Troops 5: : 170 points
- Death Company Dreadnought, Blood Talons, HeavyFlamer, Drop Pod

[hr]

[FAST ATTACK]

Fast Attack 1: : 145 points
- Baal Predator, TL Assault Cannon, Heavy Bolter Sponsons

[hr]

[HEAVY SUPPORT]

Heavy Support 1: : 135 points
- Predator, Lascannon Sponsons

[hr]

[size=14pt]Army Total: 1600[/size]

[hr]

Overall, I tried not to go overboard on upgrades in order to squeeze in as many really useful units as possible, instead of having too few and/or over-powered units… Especially with DC it is very easy & tempting to fall for a monster unit that will be complete overkill against most opposing units.

The plan is to use the DC and the Anti-tank-DC-Dreadnought (blood fists, magna grapple) in the Drop Pod Assault, and to support their landing operation with ranged fire from the two predators, while the assault squads advance. By the time the anti-infantry Dreadnought (blood talons) arrives, I have hopefully decimated the enemy’s anti-tank.

Of course this plan is subject to circumstances (opponent, terrain, mission,…), so it is more ‘a guideline’ than a rule

I’d like to have a second priest, so maybe I’ll downgrade one of the predators to a twin-heavy bolter Landspeeder to squeeze him in. With only one priest I’ll probably keep the second assault squad within 6” of the priest that joins the other squad during the initial advance.

So, what do you think of it?
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Old 10 Jun 2010, 13:28   #2 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Texas
Posts: 7,741
Default Re: 1600 pts Blood Angels with Death Company

That seems like a pretty good list! My main question is why the Bolters on the Death Company?

My main worry is such an enormous amount of points put into a DC squad with only a Thunder Hamer. I don't really see them getting as much accomplished as they could.

[hr]

I have a few ideas for the list. They may or may not line up with your vision for the list, your model collection, etc. As said I think it's a fine list but here's some food for thought.

Making the Death Company Dreadnoughts Furiosos instead might be a good move. I know they'll lose out on Fleet among other things, but they do gain more front armor. More importantly, this would remove the need for a 10-man Death Company unit, giving you 265 points to spend on, well, anything! Some more armor, Speeders or Attack Bikes, another HQ, or any combination thereof. Or maybe something shiny (and points heavy) like a pimpin' Vanguard unit or some Terminators.
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Old 10 Jun 2010, 19:09   #3 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 35
Default Re: 1600 pts Blood Angels with Death Company

Well, I don't think that the points cost of the DC is enormous... A 10 strong Tactical squad with drop pod and Thunder Hammer is only 30 points cheaper (ok, I can also get a Flamer/melta plus a heavy weapon for those). And consider what I get for those 30 points:
- better WS
- 9 additional attacks in CC (no matter if they get assaulted or assault)
- Furious Charge
- Fearless
- Feel no Pain
- Relentless

The last point is one of the reasons for taking bolters: while I have 1 attack less in CC (compared to CC-weapon + Boltpistol), I have 1 more shot before the assault per model. This has the following benefits:
- I can still charge the enemy after rapid-firing him
- while bolters are not the best firearms in 40K, the shots do have DS5 (which normal CC attacks have not). This can also be really handy against Tyranids, which I'll face a lot in the campaign
- enemies killed by shooting will reduce the number of attacks the opponents has in CC (esp. tyranids with high I value like genestealers, which also happen to have a 5+ save )
- ok, I have only one, but powerfists, lightning claws and Thunder Hammers work better with (relentless!) Bolters than with bolt pistols

The second reason for taking Bolters is to maximize the damage output of the unit on the turn they Drop-pod. This is also one of the reasons that I take Heavy flamers on the Dreads... Also (ideally, against non-Tyranids), I will try to pop enemy transports with the Predators, and rapidfire/flame the emerging troops

The third reason is that (apart from the Preds) I have no ranged shooting, and not every squad is worth to go chasing after (e.g. survivors from an assault, more generally: small units).

Another reason is that the Bolters can help to mitigate the Black rage (the DCs downside, which I have omitted in the list above). While the rage dictates where they have to go, I can still pick targets for my shooting as I like (which may be up to 24" away, no matter if I move or not). Under optimal conditions I might even be able to follow up the shooting by charging multiple units (the closest one plus the one I shot at)

Finally, the better WS, Furious charge, FnP, Fearless and high number of attacks already make the squad very good in CC compared to most other units. By taking Bolters, I do forfeit the option to make them really excellent in CC (instead of 'only' very good), but I do gain flexibility and all the benefits mentioned above.

Unfortunately, i did not find the points for getting a second ThunderHammer (or two PF), but a lot of S5 attacks and Krak grenades are also good against light/medium vehicles. Tougher vehicles will have to be dealt with by the Predators, the Meltas or the Dreads...

Later in the game the Reclusiarch can leave his assault squad and join the DC, if I have need of an increase of CC-prowess. Unfortunately, given the reduced transport capacity of the DP, he cannot join them right from the beginning, though... but then again, having two fearless units is also very good!

As for your proposals: they are all very sound, and I'll write up some alternate lists for the campaign, which will go along these lines (and in another thread).

However, this thread is dedicated to making the DC plus two DC-Dreads work on this points level while still having a balanced list. Overall, I spent 620 points (i.e. less than 40% of the points) on those three units. With DC, it is very easy to spend this much on a single unit (with lots of 'powertools', Jump packs or Landraider, plus Chaplain); after adding two DC-Dreads, the remainder of the army will be very limited in what it can achieve. And it is this rage-less remainder over which I have full control, and which I need to hold objectives...
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Old 11 Jun 2010, 02:52   #4 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: 1600 pts Blood Angels with Death Company

All good points. You've put thought into this.

I honestly didn't notice the 'Death Company' in the title and I certainly wouldn't want to kill the theme of the list. :P
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Old 11 Jun 2010, 15:36   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: 1600 pts Blood Angels with Death Company

I'm still a bit upset with DC having relentless. They only have access to 1 weapon that uses it and plain bolters aren't exactly special. Just means they have an effective 30 inch range and they get 2 shots on the charge. Sadly it wrecks the way I'd rather play them with CCW/Pistol because the extra shots and range from a bolter outweigh the +1 attack unless you use power weapons, and you can't claim the a +1 with power fists/TH.
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Old 11 Jun 2010, 16:17   #6 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: 1600 pts Blood Angels with Death Company

However, given the fluff, it would be hard to imagine Death Company charging into battle with Lascannons and such...

I think the Relentless is just there to mitigate the Black Rage a bit, because otherwise even Bolters would be completely useless for this unit, leaving it with just one equipment option. This would also mean that they would then always need a transport or jump packs to be effective.

For the same reason the DC Dreads got Fleet and the ability to always keep moving unless destroyed or immobilized. Without these gimmicks, a Dread with Rage (and a CC-oriented one at that), would also be next to useless...
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Old 11 Jun 2010, 17:55   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: 1600 pts Blood Angels with Death Company

Probably going to be ninja'd here, so sorry for any repeats. (Yep totally was)

Well it would be hilarious fora DC to be just going full auto Heavy bolter charging forward.

I really like this list. I have been pigeon holed into only using DC with jump packs, and once I told my opponent that they did not have packs and gave them a rhino, but still Pistol+CCW. Never considered the utility of a straight up versatile unit.

Your two assault squads each have their own specialty allowing for good interception of their favourite unit.

the only changes I would suggest are the reduction of Thunder Hammers to Power Fists. The S is really all you are looking for, the I drop is alright, but the stunned addition rarely matters. Chances are they have A) extra armour and consider themselves lucky, or B) Have suffered a worse result already from other attacks and don't particularly care about the stunned result. Not a ton of points mitigated, but its a little.

Definitely want to get some DC with bolters going on now.
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Old 12 Jun 2010, 16:47   #8 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Posts: 35
Default Re: 1600 pts Blood Angels with Death Company

Hmm, I took the Thunder Hammers to annoy giant bugs (and for their cool looks ). If I exchange them with power fists and also drop the Melta bombs from the priest I can equip one of the DC with power weapon+bolt pistol... sounds good to me!

If I had more points, I would probably field the unit like this:
10 Death Company, Drop Pod
2x Power weapon + Bolt pistol
2x Power Fist + Bolter
6x Bolter

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sau1us
Definitely want to get some DC with bolters going on now.
When you do, could you post your experience with those here?
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Old 13 Jun 2010, 14:32   #9 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Posts: 621
Default Re: 1600 pts Blood Angels with Death Company

Yea definitely, They seem like a good mix of Cc and shooting to merit the Dpod best. I have them now , just need to make/paint them.
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