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2000 pts Black Templars Tournament - Minimal painting, non-competetive
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Old 30 Oct 2008, 16:40   #1 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default 2000 pts Black Templars Tournament - Minimal painting, non-competetive

I realized I had bought a place in a local tournament 3 months ago and had 2 days left until the kickoff. With about 4-6k points to choose from I needed to choose something that I knew could be painted quickly. So I went Łber mech. The painting was still quite the strain on my wrist, but hey at least I didn't have to leave a WO on all my matches. :P


Anyways would be interesting to see how much cheese people consider this. Will post my result in the tournament after some comments have been made.


HQ:
110 pts Emperor's Champion + Abhor the witch, destroy the witch.

Elites:
168 pts Venerable Dread, Tank-Hunter, TL-Lascannon + missile launcher, smoke launchers.

138 pts Dread, TL-Lascannon + missile launcher, smoke launchers.

100 pts Techmarine, 3 tech servitors
278 pts Dedicated Transport: LRC with storm bolter & smoke launchers.

Troops:
80 pts 5 Initiates with bolters
278 pts Dedicated Transport: LRC with storm bolter & smoke launchers.

80 pts 5 Initiates with bolters
278 pts Dedicated Transport: LRC with storm bolter & smoke launchers.

Heavy Support:
163 pts Vindicator with extra armour, smoke launchers, power of the machine spirit.

163 pts Vindicator with extra armour, smoke launchers, power of the machine spirit.

163 pts Vindicator with extra armour, smoke launchers, power of the machine spirit.

Total: 1999

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Old 30 Oct 2008, 18:09   #2 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: 2000 pts Black Templars Tournament - Minimal painting, non-competetive

That list is... SCARY!!!!

Every LRC is scoring!
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Old 30 Oct 2008, 19:00   #3 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: 2000 pts Black Templars Tournament - Minimal painting, non-competetive

Nope, only two out of three is. And given the overall lack of firepower with some of the builds of Black Templars, I heartily approve. An interesting take on the Dreads not having the close combat weapons. My main concern is the lack of actual Marines, as once those 10 are exposed, they're basically goners.
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Old 30 Oct 2008, 19:45   #4 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: 2000 pts Black Templars Tournament - Minimal painting, non-competetive

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild
Nope, only two out of three is. And given the overall lack of firepower with some of the builds of Black Templars, I heartily approve. An interesting take on the Dreads not having the close combat weapons. My main concern is the lack of actual Marines, as once those 10 are exposed, they're basically goners.
The downside of BT is sadly that only 2 of them are scoring, but the 3rds cargo can repair the other 2. All 3 can contest even without their precious cargo.
The overall lack of firepower is something i really dont understand. You got an average armor value of 13 to shoot at. And seeing as the dreads can stick behind the rest of the army I though I would be able to sink or delay the fire from things that could actually hurt my precious land raiders. I'm still not giving away what happened, but I will tell you this: I had to deploy first all of my matches, and I got dawn of war on 3 of them (total: 5 matches.) Another thing worth considering is the power of the machine spirit, worth it or not worth it? Guess away!
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Old 30 Oct 2008, 22:56   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: 2000 pts Black Templars Tournament - Minimal painting, non-competetive

Our hybrid and infantry builds compared to other Marines are weaker due to the lack of weapons, hence the comment. Yours has lots, which is fun. I'm guessing it went very well, especially with the amount of Large Blast Templates coming down on the enemy hard!
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Old 31 Oct 2008, 03:18   #6 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: 2000 pts Black Templars Tournament - Minimal painting, non-competetive

Actually none of the LRCs are scoring, though 2 are troop choices on the FOC. pg 90 tells us what units are scoring and it clearly states vehicles cannot be scoring. And the Templar codex has no rule to change that. In fact it clearly says to treat them as vehicles for scoring purposes. The two 5 man crusader squads are scoring and if they are inside a transport then the transport essentially becomes a scoring unit.

As for the list it doesn't do much for me. You appear to be trying to make a shooty mech list out of a CC army. Yes, you have alot of AV13 and 14, but there are plenty of lists and units that will make a mockery of that. A DE list with a few darklances will leave a trail of wreckage. however, if your opponent failed to take sufficient AT then you are home free! At 2k points I would find that unlikely in most balanced lists.

Your other obvious issue is the lack of scoring units. In kill point missions you probably do quite well, but in objective missions you are going to have a tough time.
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Old 31 Oct 2008, 05:18   #7 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: 2000 pts Black Templars Tournament - Minimal painting, non-competetive

i thought the troops were still scoring when they were in a transport
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Old 31 Oct 2008, 15:43   #8 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: 2000 pts Black Templars Tournament - Minimal painting, non-competetive

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mordekiem
Actually none of the LRCs are scoring, though 2 are troop choices on the FOC.
Nah I know THAT, but what I meant (sorry, should have typed it out) was that 2 of the land raiders can be scored with if loaded. Thanks to GWs FAQ BT can't transport other units in their dedicated transports, making 2 of the LRC able to score (if they got marines inside), and one only able to contest.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mordekiem
As for the list it doesn't do much for me. You appear to be trying to make a shooty mech list out of a CC army. Yes, you have alot of AV13 and 14, but there are plenty of lists and units that will make a mockery of that. A DE list with a few darklances will leave a trail of wreckage. however, if your opponent failed to take sufficient AT then you are home free! At 2k points I would find that unlikely in most balanced lists.
As the post said, a minimal painting army chosen from some of the points I had to choose from. I could have made it CC, I could even have made it pure marines and no vehicles. But I didn't have time to paint, and judging from the opposition I met I had a clear shot at most armies. And no, they did not lack AT. And who said Black Templars have to be played as a close combat oriented army, from my experience they got offensive tactics, but this does not mean they can't be shooty.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mordekiem
Your other obvious issue is the lack of scoring units. In kill point missions you probably do quite well, but in objective missions you are going to have a tough time.
The matches, opposition, missions and deployment were as follows (never met the same player more than once of course):
Game 1: Imperial Guard, 4 objectives to hold, spearhead.

Game 2: Imperial Guard, kill points, dawn of war.

Game 3: Orks, 2 objectives, pitched battle.

Game 4: Chaos Space Marines, kill points, dawn of war.

Game 5: Chaos Space Marines, 4 objectives to hold, dawn of war.

Win in a scenario got you 3 match points, a loss 0 and a tie 1.

Game 1 I picked the totally wrong table quarter (I did NOT know he had 3 basilisks, a whole lot of mortar teams and a shitload of lascannons) But I still managed to outmaneuver him, not killing any of his basilisks, but moving within their minimun barrage range so I could just ignore them altogether. All his units were mostly in cover, but I didn't need to worry much seeing as I got the same treatment with a nice cover save and my old school smokes! Ending him having 30 boys left on 1 objective, emperors champion killing a unit of 10 he was only meant to contest against (yes I admit that was lucky, but it didn't matter for the outcome anyways), me contesting another objective with 1 vindicator,1dread and the last LRC with the techmarine in it, who during the game had time for 3 repairs, in 7 turns.
Final score: 1-1 = Tie

Game 2: I loooove dawn of war with this list against a defensive army like the guards. This meant his vehicles couldn't start the game on board. but my 2 LRCs still could! Deployed them behind cover, and as I began I bursted all my other tanks 12" towards the other side, smoked and waited. He got 1 kill point in turn 1 (my non venerable dread) And at turn 2 it was GG, 3 tanks and 2 units dead. That's how deadly 3 hidden vindicators can be. This game the marines, the emperors champion and the techmarine didn't even have to deploy.
Final score: 12-1 in kill points. = Win

Game 3: I met a swarmy ork, this was late saturday night so at turn 4 (he had 1 objective I 0) I said GG and left a WO. Although only 1 dread, 1 troop and the emperors champion were dead I felt like the best I could do with this list against such a troop horde was tie, but I felt his list and his fair play deserved him a win, so I folded.
Final score: Loss

Game 4:
Chaos with a total of 8 kill points vs my 12?... Hardest match so far. He had 20 DS terminators (the nasty chaos version with a load of meltacombis). But my vindicators ripped them apart while the others ran away too far for him to charge and then smoked. He also had 2 LR, 1 bike squad and 2 tacs. Of whom I only killed 1 LR and the bike squad.
Final score: 4-2 (lost a dread and a vindicator). = Win.

Game 5: Chaos with 5 troops, 1 LR, 5 terminators, some nasty mutating guys (3 i believe), 1 vindicator, some lesser demons and a monstrous flying thingy. After 5 turns 3 of his troops, his vindicator and the LR was history, as well as both of his rhinos transporting troops. I had lost 1 LRC and 1 troop squad. I held one objective, he had 3. I however had 2 Vindicators and 1 LRC on one of them, the emperors champ, 1 dread and a vindicator on the other, and my other dread was one fifth of an inch away from contesting the last one due to me not moving the full distance in turn 4... messy!
Final score: 1-1 = Tie

2 wins, 2 ties and 1 somewhat dishonouring loss still felt good, and I do feel good about the list, although it is a bit heavy on the LRC side.

In conclusion I think the list was a pretty good one seeing as it wasn't meant to be competitive in the first place and seeing as how it was my strategic faults that costs me 1 tie and 1 win, game 3 and 5 respectively.
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Old 01 Nov 2008, 18:14   #9 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: 2000 pts Black Templars Tournament - Minimal painting, non-competetive

Ha! I called it. You did good in kill points, but struggled in objectives. ;D

BTW, if you read the codex carefully it states only the rhino, razorback and drop pod can carry the unit they are bought for. And the drop pod is immaterial since noone can get on it anyways.

So your LRCs can still carry anyone.
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