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Newbie Dark Angels list - Balance, Budget, Bi-b.. er and fun.
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Old 26 Jul 2007, 08:35   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Taiwan
Posts: 112
Default Newbie Dark Angels list - Balance, Budget, Bi-b.. er and fun.

So a few things to consider with this list. I'm not going to go out and dump a whole bunch of cash down to start out. I'm also looking at building up slowly and I'm not buying anything new till I finish building and painting what I have. I'm also not looking to win every game and tweak everything to the max. I just want some fun games with friends where both players can enjoy themselves and have a chance to win.

First off, I bought the Space Marine Battleforce with enough parts for 5 scouts, 15 tactical marines, 5 assault marines and a Rhino.

A friend bought me a jump-pack chaplain as a gift.

I have various bits and pieces that I've scrounged and I can put together another 10 man tactical squad with a rocket launcher and a flamer if I want.

In a few days I'm buying the Ravenwing Attack Squadron with 6 bikes, 1 attack bike and a land speeder.

I've been playing a list now at 500 points with guys at the LGS using Combat Patrol rules (except for the 400pts rule). The list is fun to play and seems balanced, using a 10 man tac squad split into two, heavy weapons in one combat squad and the other half in a Razorback. Jump-pack infantry with the chaplain to leap out and hurt things.

When I get my Ravenwing Attack Squadron, this is what I'll be fielding. Please offer any advice since I'm new to 40k. Bear in mind I'm trying to work with the models I have access to and stuff that is balanced, flavorful and fun to play with. Not going to go out and buy a dreadnought / whirlwind / Land Raider or whatever else for a while to come. Maybe a month or so and I'll get something big if this is all painted.

HQ (120pts)
- Chaplain + jump pack

Troops (360pts)
- Tac Squad A (10 man)
- Plasmagun and Missile Launcher
- Sarge with Chainsword and B/pistol

- Tac Squad B (5 man)
- Plasmagun
- Sarge with Meltabombs

Transport
- Razorback w Twin Linked H/Bolter
- Pintle Mounted S/Bolter
- Dozer Blade

Fast Attack
- Assault Squad (5 man) (140pts)
- Sarge with P/weapon

-Ravenwing Attack Squadron (380pts)
- 6 bikes, 2 with flamers
- 1 Attack bike with a Multi-Melta (I've had trouble with armored targets and vehicles before)
- 1 Land Speeder (H/bolter and Assault Cannon)

Total
1000pts

The 10 man tac squad is split into 2 combat squads, the guys with heavy weapons holding back in cover and shooting at heavy targets, the other half hop into the Razorback and ride around causing havoc with the Razorback as support.

Squad b is sorta troubleshooter/last ditch tank killer with the plasmagun and melta bombs.

Jump pack guys with the chaplain target specific stuff and put the beatdown on them up close.

The ravenwing are there to keep the heat off everyone and hit targets of opportunity. Not sure, haven't really used them before, so I'll have to learn what they do as I go.

Input, ideas, advice?
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Old 26 Jul 2007, 11:44   #2 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Coloma
Posts: 1,463
Default Re: Newbie Dark Angels list - Balance, Budget, Bi-b.. er and fun.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Plastic Rat
So a few things to consider with this list. I'm not going to go out and dump a whole bunch of cash down to start out. I'm also looking at building up slowly and I'm not buying anything new till I finish building and painting what I have. I'm also not looking to win every game and tweak everything to the max. I just want some fun games with friends where both players can enjoy themselves and have a chance to win.

First off, I bought the Space Marine Battleforce with enough parts for 5 scouts, 15 tactical marines, 5 assault marines and a Rhino.

A friend bought me a jump-pack chaplain as a gift.

I have various bits and pieces that I've scrounged and I can put together another 10 man tactical squad with a rocket launcher and a flamer if I want.

In a few days I'm buying the Ravenwing Attack Squadron with 6 bikes, 1 attack bike and a land speeder.

I've been playing a list now at 500 points with guys at the LGS using Combat Patrol rules (except for the 400pts rule). The list is fun to play and seems balanced, using a 10 man tac squad split into two, heavy weapons in one combat squad and the other half in a Razorback. Jump-pack infantry with the chaplain to leap out and hurt things.

When I get my Ravenwing Attack Squadron, this is what I'll be fielding. Please offer any advice since I'm new to 40k. Bear in mind I'm trying to work with the models I have access to and stuff that is balanced, flavorful and fun to play with. Not going to go out and buy a dreadnought / whirlwind / Land Raider or whatever else for a while to come. Maybe a month or so and I'll get something big if this is all painted.

HQ (120pts)
- Chaplain + jump pack

Troops (360pts)
- Tac Squad A (10 man)
- Plasmagun and Missile Launcher
- Sarge with Chainsword and B/pistol

- Tac Squad B (5 man)
- Plasmagun
- Sarge with Meltabombs

Transport
- Razorback w Twin Linked H/Bolter
- Pintle Mounted S/Bolter
- Dozer Blade

Fast Attack
- Assault Squad (5 man) (140pts)
- Sarge with P/weapon

-Ravenwing Attack Squadron (380pts)
- 6 bikes, 2 with flamers
- 1 Attack bike with a Multi-Melta (I've had trouble with armored targets and vehicles before)
- 1 Land Speeder (H/bolter and Assault Cannon)

Total
1000pts

The 10 man tac squad is split into 2 combat squads, the guys with heavy weapons holding back in cover and shooting at heavy targets, the other half hop into the Razorback and ride around causing havoc with the Razorback as support.

Squad b is sorta troubleshooter/last ditch tank killer with the plasmagun and melta bombs.

Jump pack guys with the chaplain target specific stuff and put the beatdown on them up close.

The ravenwing are there to keep the heat off everyone and hit targets of opportunity. Not sure, haven't really used them before, so I'll have to learn what they do as I go.

Input, ideas, advice?
I would just change around a couple of things, not really the way units are set up, more the items they are carrying.

first would be squad a: there's a reason that its called hidden power fist. I know its expensive for the sergeant, but it is so worth it.

second squad b: lose the melta bombs, give him a power fist and change the plasma to a melta gun. also assign the razorback to this squad as they will need the transport more if they are going tank hunting.

Assault squad: same thing, find a way to give the sarge a power fist instead. I know it hoses their initiative, but that strength 8 hit will more than make up for it, especially when you consider the chaplain will be joining this unit (and he has a power weapon...). Plus, god forgive, you get assaulted by a dreadnought or something with toughness 8 (wraithlord, nightbringer, deciever....) you will have a very tough time getting out of that mess.

The ravenwing is almost perfect. The only thing I would question is the two flamers. But then again thats more a personal misgiving toward them than anything else.

So basically other than a weapon/wargear swaps I think your list could be solid. Just remember to split your ravenwing squads up also.
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Old 27 Jul 2007, 02:50   #3 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 483
Default Re: Newbie Dark Angels list - Balance, Budget, Bi-b.. er and fun.

I personally have never had any luck what so ever with my ravenwing (mine runs at about 405pts) and at 380pts in 1000, you can't make mistakes with them, and because they are IMHO hard to use, you will (shrugs).

If you havn't bought the $150 box, try maybe a ravenwing biker box, and then some more tacticals and if you want a attack bike.

So you would have three bikes, two with flamers 130pts ($55)
ten man tac squad 165pts+ (what ever you trick them with) ($50)
and an attack bike with multi metla 50pts (not sure how much they cast but it can't be $45)

So you'll save money and have more tactical options open to you, granted you wont be at 1000pts yet, but you wont be feeling hamstrung by your expensive ravenwing squad

If you have bought the $150 box set, then you will have to be very careful with those ravenwing, very careful, they are an expensive unit and can die very easily
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Old 27 Jul 2007, 04:43   #4 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 272
Default Re: Newbie Dark Angels list - Balance, Budget, Bi-b.. er and fun.

I would recommend the Dark Angels battleforce...it comes with alot of stuff that is really handy. If you do get the battleforce: I would suggest breaking the command squad into something completley else, I've never had any luck with the command squad and they are quite expensive.

I just got my ravenwing box....hmm...I'm not sure how flamers would work...I guess it wouldn't be so bad, the only problem is that they are really short range and have low strength, I try not to field flamers anymore.

The squads with plasma gun and missile seem good.

My only problem, is your only anti-tank is a multi-melta...which has really short range.
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Old 27 Jul 2007, 05:50   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Taiwan
Posts: 112
Default Re: Newbie Dark Angels list - Balance, Budget, Bi-b.. er and fun.

Thanks for all the advice guys.

Most of Howloutloud's comments make total sense to me. In fact after I'd posted this I decided to swap second squad's plasma to a melta.

My Anti-tank consists of the 'mini-devastator' combat squad with the missile launcher and plasma gun and the squad b with the Meltagun as well as the Attack Bike with the Multi-Melta.

Figuring the other Assault Cannon and Heavy Bolters are fine for skimmers and light vehicles.

The reason for the flamers on bikes is that I've played a few games before with a 'generic' space marine force, and they were allowed flamers in their assault squads. I had a lot of success with fast attack stuff going in and hitting things with flamers just before the assault. This is pretty much for thinning out masses of troops and I can get them there with the extra speed.

As far as buying stuff. Well I already have the Space Marine Battleforce.

I'm buying the Ravenwing because I like the models. If they're hard to use, well I'll learn how to use them. Like I said flavor first, twinking to win, last.

I've also been drooling over the Dark Angels Battleforce, and I'll probably pick that up next month. Mainly want it for the bits to give my guys a more Dark Angels look.

Last question. Plasma pistols. I can take a lot more if I wanted to. I tend to avoid them because I have very bad luck with dice and they tend to cause more casualties on my side than the enemies, plus some people feel they're cheesy.

Any comments?
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Old 27 Jul 2007, 06:12   #6 (permalink)
Ethereal
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 18,087
Default Re: Newbie Dark Angels list - Balance, Budget, Bi-b.. er and fun.

I love the Ravenwing. They are awesome for taking objectives and hunting down tanks (with melta-guns). And once you start taking Deathwing, they are incredibly useful. They are sort of hard to use, but it is more a function of plotting out safe areas for them to be every turn, where there aren't many clear fire lanes to them and they aren't going to get mobbed. They are so incredibly fast that you will generally have a lot of choices.

I learned the hard way that a Power Fist is almost a must for the Ravenwing sergeant. It is very easy for Ravenwing to get caught in an extended close-combat, where their small unit size will get them killed rather quickly. The reliability offered by the Fist lets them claw their way out much faster. It is also handy for cracking open the rear armor of vehicles.
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Old 27 Jul 2007, 06:38   #7 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 272
Default Re: Newbie Dark Angels list - Balance, Budget, Bi-b.. er and fun.

Plasma pistols? Never really used them...my friend used to field one in an assault squad...it was ok, but wasn't really worth it for the points cost.

Thanks Khanaris, I just put togeather my Ravenwing sergeant today...luckily I had a left over powerfist that turned out looking pretty good.

Get the DA battleforce, it's really worth it...I love the devasator squad, very nice covering fire and should work wonders with the ravenwing (covering fire).

Oh, If you happen to come across the Dark Angels edition of The White Dwarf (sorry, don't know the issue number) pick it up, it's got some great tips for playing the new DA and it has a sample 2,000 point game that uses main-stream marines, ravenwing, and deathwing to great effect.
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