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Unwholesome amounts of Guard-Induced PAIN!
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Old 08 May 2009, 23:45   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Unwholesome amounts of Guard-Induced PAIN!

Hi All,
I can tell that little by little the pain of the IG Codex is starting to spread.
I'm still working on my first (!) BatRep vs the IG, but a nasty list has popped up that I wanted to share with everyone and get your thoughts.
Its pretty much as follows (apologies if I don't get it 100%, I think I'm still in shock):

Primaris Psychersx2
Veteransx2 with Carapace with Plasmaguns in Valkyries
Veterans with Meltas and Demo Bombs in a Chimera
Psychic Choirx2 in Chimeras
Lemun Russ Executionerx2 (the bloke with 5(!) plasma cannon shots)
Lemun Russ Classic

The hurt usually starts with the Lemun Russes and Psychers castling up and dropping plates, big and small on people while dropping their morale if they really really (i.e. Nob Bikers) don't like you.
The Melta Vets are there to roadblock and blow up your Battlewagons and anything that doesn't die turn 1.
And then, just when you think you're safe, the Valks come in outflanking and blow well... pretty much your entire backfield to heck. Anything that doesn't die to rockets/missles dies horribly to the plasma gun vets with the Primaris Psycher (2d6 S6 attacks??). Fighting a two front war is NOT what Orks do well, and it takes a LOT of fighting to make it through 5 turns (and uh... something resembling victory).
The only thing that really seems to slow the list down is its relative ABUNDANCE of KPs and its low (only 3!) number of scoring units. Still, a total bear of a list.
Wanted to throw this out there so people could report other nasty lists that have been floating around destroying the great Green Machine

Best,
-BT
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Old 09 May 2009, 00:58   #2 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Unwholesome amounts of Guard-Induced PAIN!

First, I just want to say I love that title. It inspired me to read every word on your post.

Yup, your IG buddy looks pretty brutal. I have a decent guard army and am in the middle of ponying up a nice orky force. (Im at about 1200 points so far) My whole strategy for orks is going to get in CC as fast as possible, because I realized through practice battles that orks main weakness is getting shot to *lame tau curse word* in turn 2. I'm going to employ Zagstruck and Snikrot, despite my frustration with special characters. I also have a nice mech ork force to blitz the enemy right off the bat. A battlewagon, several trukks, bikes, and deffkoptas. Basically, everything is mounted up and blitzing towards the enemy as fast as possible.

It seems like in your situation you'd want to do the same thing. It can be scary charging an IG (or Tau for that matter) gunline. But standing back and trying to formulate a nice, tidy plan is MUCH worse. The pie plates just don't stop coming!! I love this as an IG player, but not so much playing with my xenos. If I were in your position, I'd charge his starting force and try to overwhelm him in one spot. Sorry I'm not a massive amount of help, it seems like this army was made to kick some greenskin hiny.
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Old 09 May 2009, 03:23   #3 (permalink)
Zen
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Default Re: Unwholesome amounts of Guard-Induced PAIN!

Just say grace that he didn't have Leman Russ Eradicators in there. I'm going with Warpspiderman's advice; Kommandoz and Stormboyz, both with their unique characters. Orks is very direct army and have little room for tricks such as outflanking and deep-striking. Most of your army has to literally get across the board to krump their opponents.

So, I say Kommandoz (with Snikrot), Stormboyz (with Zagstruk) and Deffkoptaz.
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Old 09 May 2009, 04:23   #4 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Unwholesome amounts of Guard-Induced PAIN!

You know what alternately scares (the ork part of me) and elates (the guard part of) me? Griffon mortars. Low point cost for terrible (great) anti-ork blastiness. Plus they're super-accurate. Did you know that a cruel (smart) player could put 3 of them in his list for the cost of one of those zogging (admittedly nasty) 5-plasma executioners?

The only thing that's saving us is that they're forge world only for now. When they get released, it'll be a good time to go get another KFF mek, methinks.
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Old 10 May 2009, 13:46   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Unwholesome amounts of Guard-Induced PAIN!

Thanks all!
I actually did get to play him, and the list wasn't as scary as I thought. I even brought my "fun" list, and it worked out pretty well
The Griffin Motor is pretty nasty, but still, it's only S6, which is a threat, but a relatively low one as it's rarely going to be busting vehicles (even Trukks are safe half the time). Three of them linked would be pretty nasty vs Hordes though they would still get cover saves. A Colossus Motor would be pretty bad as well, as it eliminates cover and is still a S6 big plate.

Best,
-BT
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Old 10 May 2009, 14:11   #6 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Unwholesome amounts of Guard-Induced PAIN!

Even bigger pain can be caused be a manticore using forgeworlds latest rules for it- a 7" blast that penetrates mega armour (AP) and wounds wraithlords on 3's. It's a big lascannon for most purposes but it's less than 200 points.
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Old 11 May 2009, 15:13   #7 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Unwholesome amounts of Guard-Induced PAIN!

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigToof
The Griffin Motor is pretty nasty, but still, it's only S6, which is a threat, but a relatively low one as it's rarely going to be busting vehicles (even Trukks are safe half the time).
It's ordinance, so the trukk will be penetrated substantially more than that.
Also, since they're indirect, they count their point of origin to be the center of the template, not the firer. This usually means that it will ignore cover saves unless you're in area terrain or covered by a KFF.

Collosi are nasty, but their minimum range is their weakness and they're less accurate, which helps.

Nobz of all types will laugh off both types of guns with ease.
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Old 11 May 2009, 15:37   #8 (permalink)
Zen
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Default Re: Unwholesome amounts of Guard-Induced PAIN!

Underestimating your opponent and being arrogant will get you nowhere. Basilisks, Manticores and Medusa can instant kill a Nob and ignore their FNP. And Leman Russes are more threatening than ever for Nobz; Leman Russ Battle Tanks, Leman Russ Demolishers and the Leman Russ Executioner are already bad enough with their main turret weapon. Wait until you see them with Plasma Cannon sponsons.
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Old 11 May 2009, 16:38   #9 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Unwholesome amounts of Guard-Induced PAIN!

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigToof
Hi All,
I can tell that little by little the pain of the IG Codex is starting to spread.
I'm still working on my first (!) BatRep vs the IG, but a nasty list has popped up that I wanted to share with everyone and get your thoughts.
Its pretty much as follows (apologies if I don't get it 100%, I think I'm still in shock):

Primaris Psychersx2
Veteransx2 with Carapace with Plasmaguns in Valkyries
Veterans with Meltas and Demo Bombs in a Chimera
Psychic Choirx2 in Chimeras
Lemun Russ Executionerx2 (the bloke with 5(!) plasma cannon shots)
Lemun Russ Classic

The hurt usually starts with the Lemun Russes and Psychers castling up and dropping plates, big and small on people while dropping their morale if they really really (i.e. Nob Bikers) don't like you.
The Melta Vets are there to roadblock and blow up your Battlewagons and anything that doesn't die turn 1.
And then, just when you think you're safe, the Valks come in outflanking and blow well... pretty much your entire backfield to heck. Anything that doesn't die to rockets/missles dies horribly to the plasma gun vets with the Primaris Psycher (2d6 S6 attacks??). Fighting a two front war is NOT what Orks do well, and it takes a LOT of fighting to make it through 5 turns (and uh... something resembling victory).
The only thing that really seems to slow the list down is its relative ABUNDANCE of KPs and its low (only 3!) number of scoring units. Still, a total bear of a list.
Wanted to throw this out there so people could report other nasty lists that have been floating around destroying the great Green Machine

Best,
-BT
Would be interesting to see the fluff behind that list ^^
A low number of very specialized units, and only a few weak choices to hold any objectives...

Though it should not be too hard to beat. As mentioned Deffkoptas and Snikrot would do some serious harm. And I would add Lootas and/or Killa Kans to the list as well.
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Old 11 May 2009, 16:47   #10 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Unwholesome amounts of Guard-Induced PAIN!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zenai
Underestimating your opponent and being arrogant will get you nowhere.
I don't think I'm being arrogant with my comment about Nob Bikers. They will laugh off fire from Collosi and Griffons.

Quote:
Basilisks, Manticores and Medusa can instant kill a Nob and ignore their FNP.
You're quite right. But did I ever say that nob bikers would laugh off these types of weapons? Turboboost in and pray. That's always been the strategy against ordinance. What you should take away is that there's nothing short of the deathstrike that will nullfy a nob biker's cover save AND instakill him.

Quote:
And Leman Russes are more threatening than ever for Nobz; Leman Russ Battle Tanks, Leman Russ Demolishers and the Leman Russ Executioner are already bad enough with their main turret weapon. Wait until you see them with Plasma Cannon sponsons.
Plasma sponsons are good, but they are also very expensive. It is unlikely that you'll see more than a couple tanks with this upgrade. While they ignore FNP, they don't instakill, which is always a plus - this allows for some creative wound allocation on our part. Plus, nobz should always be spread out to max coherency against IG. An opponent shouldn't be able to get more than one of my nobz with each plasma blast.
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