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Deffrollas and the ramming rule
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Old 29 Apr 2009, 07:57   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Deffrollas and the ramming rule

Hey guys, sorry if this has been discussed here before but it's been a while for me. I'm a little confused about how to work out a battlewagon with a deffrolla ramming another vehicle.

My first question is, is this move even legal? Ramming seems to be a type of tank shock so it should be legal, but one might argue that ramming is not a tank shock and therefore the deffrolla has no effect on the unit when ramming.

If ramming with a deffrolla is legal then is there a regular ramming attack taking place as well, using the normal calculations? Therefore making it possible that the battlewagon may suffer damage in return.

If the deffrolla destroys the enemy vehicle should it still suffer a ramming attack?

And lastly, are skimmers able to dodge a deffrolla like they would dodge a regular ramming attack?

Personally I think the answer to all of these questions is yes, but I'd like to hear what you guys say in case I come up against some nasty rules lawyers.
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Old 29 Apr 2009, 08:43   #2 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Deffrollas and the ramming rule

Honestly talk to your local gaming group and come to a consensus, because GW can't. I've seen emails from GW that state you can't run over a land raider, but they haven't put out anything official. I think you can, but it really doesn't matter what I think.
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Old 29 Apr 2009, 11:17   #3 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Deffrollas and the ramming rule

I would answer yes to all of the above, but I have no official say so...

If somebody claims you that ramming is not a tank shock show them where it says 'ramming is a type of tank shock'. It's right near the beginning of the section.
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Old 29 Apr 2009, 11:43   #4 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Deffrollas and the ramming rule

And then if they say rammin isn't a type of tank shock, your now able to ram with your ork vehicles that don't have reinforced ram....
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Old 29 Apr 2009, 12:19   #5 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Deffrollas and the ramming rule

As all above me, this has been discussed and countered since the beginning of time (or at least the last codex), and STILL we have no true consensus, either through the GW mail in questions (I got a 'yes it works', yet some others got a 'no it doesn't&#39 or an FAQ.

GW knows this is a problem, yet they still haven't FAQ'd it. It has made orks either win or lose many tournaments.
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Old 29 Apr 2009, 14:48   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Deffrollas and the ramming rule

I guess the guys at Adepticon said "no". But then again, they're not GW.
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Old 30 Apr 2009, 01:58   #7 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Deffrollas and the ramming rule

Yeah, you'll get different answers to it from different sources. A number of tourneys have disallowed it, but I suspect that this may be more of a knee-jerk reaction to the power of the rolla when fielded in multiples than anything. Personally, I support Rolla Ramming for two reasons. 1. Ramming is defined as a special type of tank shock. 2. Something I call RAA, or Rules As Awesome. Doesn't it seem damn cool that a Battlewagon could pancake puny enemy vehicles with it's mighty roller of doom? Yes? Then I say DO IT!

In the end though, it's probably best to discuss it with your opponents even if just to avoid a potential "WTF?" reaction.
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Old 30 Apr 2009, 06:39   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Deffrollas and the ramming rule

Yeah... honestly I think the rule is intended this way, and I wouldn't even consider it powergaming because battlewagons aren't that difficult to take out. They have to be up close to the enemy in order to use the deffrolla, and because of their rear AV10 they're extremely vulnerable to assaults, not to mention the several turns of fire they'll have to endure in order to get that close.

I probably wouldn't even bother using a deffrolla if it didn't work on vehicles because most infantry you would want to tank shock with a deffrolla still get their armour saves, it's not that brutal.

Unfortunately this doesn't give is a 100% orky proof tactic to eliminate skimmers, which in my mind are a considerable threat and now there's an IG Valkyrie... *shudders*
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Old 30 Apr 2009, 06:43   #9 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Deffrollas and the ramming rule

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fish Ead
Yeah, you'll get different answers to it from different sources. A number of tourneys have disallowed it, but I suspect that this may be more of a knee-jerk reaction to the power of the rolla when fielded in multiples than anything. Personally, I support Rolla Ramming for two reasons. 1. Ramming is defined as a special type of tank shock. 2. Something I call RAA, or Rules As Awesome. Doesn't it seem damn cool that a Battlewagon could pancake puny enemy vehicles with it's mighty roller of doom? Yes? Then I say DO IT!

In the end though, it's probably best to discuss it with your opponents even if just to avoid a potential "WTF?" reaction.
I agree with the RAA sentiment, after my Battlewagon full of a Warboss and Burna Boyz Rammed an immobilized Monolith and destroyed it, and then fired the Burna payload at the Necron Warriors the monolith had just sucked through. That turn alone won me "best play" accolades at that tournament.

Reccomendation:If there is going to be a warboss in the Battlewagon, A Deffrolla + Boarding plank is fantastic. Any fast vehicle will be crushed by the rolla and thus the Boarding plank isn't needed, and any slow but tough vehicle will be destroyed by the weight of 7-12 strength 10 attacks. (assuming Warboss with PK and Attack Squig)
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Old 01 May 2009, 08:15   #10 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Deffrollas and the ramming rule

So how would ramming a vehicle with a Deffrolla work? Would you just roll a D6 and see how many S10 hits you have? Or do you also use the normal ramming rules as a separate attack?
A'm confused over the whole thing.
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