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which is better: nightbringer, deceiver or monolith
View Poll Results: which is better, nightbringer, deceiver or monolith
Nightbringer 5 8.77%
Deceiver 6 10.53%
Monolith 46 80.70%
Voters: 57. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11 Feb 2010, 21:16   #1 (permalink)
Kroot Warrior
 
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Default which is better: nightbringer, deceiver or monolith

honest opinion please as im trying to win an argument
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Old 11 Feb 2010, 21:28   #2 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: which is better: nightbringer, deceiver or monolith

Monolith!

1. Blocks line of sight
2. Attacks all units within 12"
3. Get 2ND chance to re-roll on we'll be back
4. Cost 2/3Rd's the cost of your so called Necron Gods
5. The hardest vehicle in the game to destroy
6. Can teleport units for extra support
7. Can deep strike for max shooting effect.
8. Can leave troops in reserve and they can come out of the Monolith

Necron Gods
Beside the fact these models cost more than 300Pt's and kinda hard to kill against some armies. I think in a 2000pt army or more they may be worth it at that point. Remember the less necrons you have the easier it would be for you to phase out.
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Old 11 Feb 2010, 21:32   #3 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: which is better: nightbringer, deceiver or monolith

I need to know the context for this first.


Against hordes, Mech, what?



At the minimum what is the points level of the game?
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Old 12 Feb 2010, 01:51   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: which is better: nightbringer, deceiver or monolith

I would say that the monolith trumps both, but between the Nightbringer and the Deceiver, there is no competition. The Deceiver is LIGHTYEARS ahead of the Nightbringer. I mean, 4 awesome special rules that make you want to burn your rulebook, and +1 int. The monolith is good all around, but the Deceiver is the better Ctan
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At least a 5th one, so you can launch a legal squad.
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Old 12 Feb 2010, 16:37   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: which is better: nightbringer, deceiver or monolith

tween the 3, ... Monolith.

between deceiver and nightbringer, if points is not an issue, NB will pawn deceiver everytime. ;D
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Old 12 Feb 2010, 18:50   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: which is better: nightbringer, deceiver or monolith

Quote:
Originally Posted by omegatron
between deceiver and nightbringer, if points is not an issue, NB will pawn deceiver everytime. ;D
The Nightbringer will kill the Deceiver, yes. But the Nightbriniger can't
1) Pin Fearless units
2) Leave combat when the enemy is S4+, unlike the Nightbringer
3) Let you "redeploy" your army.
4) Make the enemy only hit on 6"

Yes, the Nightbringer is the BEST CC monster in the game. BUT. It is waaayyyy overkill, and is overall worse than the Deceiver for any real purposes.
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Quote:
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Hopefully, my country's customs don't mistake the Genestealer model as being totally made out of cocaine...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boneguard
At least a 5th one, so you can launch a legal squad.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Droids_Rule
shtlk, I honestly editted instead of posting a reply with a quote. Sorry, Goliath. Trying to figure out these mod abilities.
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Old 13 Feb 2010, 00:53   #7 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: which is better: nightbringer, deceiver or monolith

They are 3 entirely different units with entirely different applications. To say one is 'better' than the others is irrelevant. To say one is better than the others in a certain situation is a valid point for an argument.
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Old 13 Feb 2010, 01:38   #8 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: which is better: nightbringer, deceiver or monolith

I'd partially agree with you Gabriel whilst I generally hold the opinion that Deciever is better than Nightbringer the two C'tan are both situational because despite the Decievers more interesting rules sometimes what you really need is a giant CC sledgehammer if only to put the fear of God into your enemy.

However of the 3 units listed I would still say Monolith is the clear winner because of the sheer volume of strengths it offers weighed against its points cost, which is pretty low for everything you get from it, and whilst the two C'tan are something i'd have to think about fielding very carefully depending on what I will probably be facing the Monolith is a unit that can prove its worth against any foe:

*Sturdiest tank in game (14/14/14 armour with living metal rule(no melta or lance rules work against it))
*Can deep Strike (without suffering side effects if it scatters onto an enemy unit)
*Can teleport Necrons
*Gives a unit an extra bite of the WBB cherry
*The Power core (teleport/power core weapon) can work even if the Lith is stunned/shaken or immobilised and is not subject to weapon destroyed results.
*d6 shots at every unit in range if you're fighting a horde army
*It is also a very useful piece of mobile scenery handy for keeping other units safe.
*Entry point for Warriors coming on from reserve.

All for only 235 points. To my mind the C'tan just don't compare when you look at their points cost weighed against what you get in return for a unit which is overall much more flexible in terms of what you can field it against.

EDIT: I'd also add that as Monoliths fill a Heavy Support slot they don't deprive you of a potential second HQ choice in larger games and you can potentially field 3 whereas you will only ever have a single C'tan roaming about. It's a minor point but think it should be considered as you're getting such a highly effective and influential unit outside of the FoC HQ section.
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Old 13 Feb 2010, 03:48   #9 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: which is better: nightbringer, deceiver or monolith

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabriel_
They are 3 entirely different units with entirely different applications. To say one is 'better' than the others is irrelevant. To say one is better than the others in a certain situation is a valid point for an argument.
but it is Gabriel.
against known or unknown opponent, if given the choice I would not hesiate to pick Monolith over the Ctans.

If given another choice, I would do the same, pick another Lith over the Ctan.
If given another choice I'll always pick Lith over Ctans.

Now the situational relevancy lies on what Ctan to bring if you are decided to bring one.
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Old 13 Feb 2010, 06:25   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: which is better: nightbringer, deceiver or monolith

Picture this.
Abaddon, 4 Terminators with twin LCs, and a Daemonprince assault a Deceiver. Deceiver kills the prince. Abaddon does 2 wounds. Next turn. Deceiver killed Abaddon and the Terminators. Then, he proceeds to kill 15 Khorne Berserkers. Only taking 2 wounds.

That is entirely true, and wasn't above average rolling either. The monolith? Didn't do much except blow up some lesser daemons. I agree with Gabriel. Fighting IG? Take the Nightbringer and push their gunline off the board. Fighting MEqs? Take the Deceiver, since most things will be S4+ so the Nightbringer is pointless. Monoliths are on the complete opposite side of the "In-game uses" spectrum. Its really more of a support unit. It can drop a S9 template each turn, to keep the enemy hiding in cover, and gives rerolls to WBB.
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VS Droids: W24/L24/T10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zenai
Hopefully, my country's customs don't mistake the Genestealer model as being totally made out of cocaine...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boneguard
At least a 5th one, so you can launch a legal squad.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Droids_Rule
shtlk, I honestly editted instead of posting a reply with a quote. Sorry, Goliath. Trying to figure out these mod abilities.
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