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Space Marine Vehicle Tactica
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Old 10 Nov 2007, 16:48   #1 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Space Marine Vehicle Tactica

I asked Dutch as to whether I could do this, and he said yes, but i should post it here and if it's good enough it will get moved the Librarium. He said Vash should have the last say on this.

The space marines are lucky in that they have many different types of vehicle, all with distinct roles. In this Tactica I will include: Vehicle uses, values, upgrades, who should ride in them and sneaky tricks. I will being purely using vehicles from the Codex, so no FW or Apoc. .

The Vehicles

Rhino

The rhino is a commonly used vehicle, which has weak armour but a large troop capacity. It is best used for moving Tactical squads around the table. It is weaker in the new rules, as the idea of a 'rhino rush' has been weakened, though not destroyed. The rhikno is a bargain, and it is best you put veteran/tactical squads in it. Don't ever forget their fire points, as many people forget these, and are suprised when the Devastator squad in the rhino their lasguns can't hurt starts killed the units that can.
Remember that Rhinos are one of the easiest non-skimmer tanks to kill, and that they should be used with caution.
The Rhino Rush is when one or more rhinos will drive towards an enemy at full speed using smoke launchers. The rhino is unlikely to be killed except by determined fire, and will probably be able to get in range to use drop its cargo. The most common cargo will be 10 Tactical Marines, who then unleash Bolter death of the enemy. Using this tactic even isolated sqauds can cause serious damage. Most enemies do not have the firepower to take out several tanks per turn, but even so, the Crew Stunned result can really ruin your day, so extra armour is a prime investment.
Drive By Best worked with Tactical/Veteran marines, this tactic is very simple and plays to the Space Marine's strengths. You drive the rhino towards and enemy, before letting the marines out of the side doors. The marines then unleash a hail of fire, before getting baxk into the rhino next turn and driving away. This tactic works brilliantly against armies with small units of lightly armed CC warriors (Eldar howling banshees are perfect targets) who you can wipe out in a turn.
Rhampage Often a rhino's squad will disembark (say after a Rhino Rush) without intending to come back. The does not make the rhino obsolete. Stay on the lookout for lightly armed, low Ld enemy untis (such as conscripts) and Tank Shock them. The value of a Rhino chasing away a unit on an objective is huge.
Blockade Near end game? Got a unit of Fire Warriors (example) setting their scopes on that 40% casualties scout squad (example) sitting on the objective? Drive a rhino inbetween them. Providing you put it quite close the the scouts, the rhino will force the Fire Warriors to move, quite possibly putting them out of range. If the example enemy squad has a heavy weapon, they may shoot the rhino out of the way, but smoke launchers can stop this. Remember: every shot hitting the Rhino is a shot wasted for your opponent.

Razorback

The Razor back is also very easy to kill, be hopefully you can kill enemy tanks with anti-armour weapons with Devastators etc.
Many of the rules of the rhino apply to the Razorback, but here are some things you should think about:
Which weapon? Choosing which weapon to have on a razorback can be tough, but you should let the squad that's in it make the choice for you. If the squad has no heavy weapons, give the RB twin-linked lascannons, to get rid of any tanks that are looking at them in a funny way. If the sqaud has their own heavy weapon, give the RB a heavy bolter, to lend them the couple of extra kills that could win a combat.
Cheap Predator The Razorback can easily be played as a cheap predator, staying at the back with its dedicated devastator squad, shooting enemy tanks, ready to drive its squad away if those incubi come too close.

Drop Pod The drop pod itself is often overlooked as a tactical boon, more often the units inside are considered the most improtantant. Many enemies will even overlook the fact drop pods are killable, and that they fight back. The deathwind launcher is very good against orks, and can wipe out a squad per turn with a little luck.
Wait until enemies turn their back to your drop pods, then hit them with Str 5 in the rear parts. They are unlikely to single handedly do much, but can soften enemy units up nicely.
However, the drop pod has several BIG disadvantages. 1) It is immobile, so your opponent always get halh its points, meaning it is quite likely to be, on its own level, a large loss.

Dreadnought

The dreadnought is a figurehead of the space marines, huge wise and ancient. They can either be used as tanks or as super soldiers, depending on your tactics.
Obviously the Dreadnought is slow, and has weak rear armour, so it it better in tight spaces.
I was a devastator... Give a Venerable Dreadnought a missile launcher, tank hunter and twin-linked lascannons and you'll have an excellent tank hunter.
Can't touch me... Send a dreadnought into combat against any unit that numbers 9 people or less and has low strength (again howling Banshees) and watch as he tears the Sushi out of enemies who can't escape, and can't hurt him. Harlequins, Howling Banshees, Rough Riders... all will bow down before the dreadnought!
He's a big lad... Send a normal dreadnought to walk along with any infantry squad. He can act as a supoort, augmenting the squad's strengths and weaknesses. Simple, but so effective.

Land Speeders

Land speeders are easy to kill, but then they weren't built for toughness....
The Tank Hunter The land speeder isn't a tank- it's an anti tank. Use it to fly around at bearkneck speed, popping shots at enemy vehicles, eliminating threats.
Keep away! Take a squad of 3 land speeders with heavy bolters, and fire at an enemy from 36 inches away. Most enemies cannot fight back at this range, and if they try to close the gap, just fly away.
It came from above... Deep Strike a LS behind an enemy firebase, and harass them constantly. Force them to turn there attention away from the real threat, and make them waste ammo and man power taking down a distraction.

Vindicator

The vindicator does just what it says on the tin: vindicates things. You have to be wary however, as many enmies will take advantage of its puny range, simply avoiding it, or blowing it to pieces in turn 1.
The real war is in the mind... People are scared of Vindicators. Simply as that. They will direct lots of fire at it in a desparate attempt to take it out, often failing to do so. If you use smoke launchers to stop them doing to much damage, they will waste huge amounts of fire trying to kill a tank that, whilst powerful, is not going to single-handedly win the game for you. If the enemy conserves his fire on other targets make him pay the price: VINDICATE HIM. It's a win-win situation.
I don't thing we should go there... Enemies with weaker shooting may simply avoid the vindicator completely, staying well away. Use this to your advantage and funnel enemies in an area where your combat units can batter them. Give the vindicator LOS to an objective, and wipe away anything that dares go there. It's as simply as that.

Predator Annihilator

Bang, bang, you're dead. The Predator is quite tough, and is basically a good all rounder. It is unlikely to single handedly do much though.
Smite Me the PA really only has one use-tank hunting. Luckily, it is very good and tank hunting. Concentrate its fire on 1 vehicle, destroy it, then move on.

Predator Destructor

Bang, bang you're all dead. Same disadvantages as Annihilator.
Smite Them The destructor is good at killing multiple heavily armoured enemies, and can also be a good tank hunter. Remember that Autocannons are actually very good against light vehicles.

Whirlwind

Whoooosh slam, ow! The mother of all barragers, the whirlwind combines tactical flexibility with a decent, but weak shot. However it is as tough as a rhino, and easily killable, even by basic troops.
Vengeance or Castellan? It is often hard to choose what kind of missiles your whirlwind should fire, and the choice is yours, but personally I almost always pixk Vengeance, as it simply kills people, rather than requiring the fiddly touches of Castellan.
Blow me up Scottie! The greatest virtue of the whirlwind is its ability to hit units that though themselves safe. Pick a 4+ armour save unit behind a rock and make them pay for their cowardly ways!
It's safe here... There is almost nevert a disadvantage to hiding a Whirlwind behind a rock, so do it. Don't make that face.

Land Raider

The land raider gives new definition to 'Brute Force'. However, they are extremely expensive.
Tough Land Raiders are difficult to kill, so leaving them stranded is less likely to be a problem.
Boom! Splat! Land Raiders should be used to provide cover fire for whoever is inside them. Enemies with power weapons and tanks are the biggest threat, and are often the most obvious thing to kill.
Must be a tiny thing, hidden behing the Raider.. A land raider can provide cover for two alrge sqauds, and is about as tough as a bunker, use it as moveable cover, with a squad inside and squads behind.

Land Raider Crusader

50 Cent would be proud to roll up in one of these. nHowever they are even more expensive.
Chocolate Box Put 5 assault terminators with Lightning claws with a chaplain in the crusaders and bring them safely to the enemy. Then all hell breaks loose.
This is how we ride! Any sqaud will fit/work well in a crusader, but assault units are the best, as the frag launchers really give them a boost. I recommander Assault marines without jump packs, command squads, terminators and veterans.
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Old 10 Nov 2007, 17:03   #2 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Space Marine Vehicle Tactica

All the tanks are of decent value for what they do, but some are of large points costs. Here is a rundown of what sort of games each one should be in.

0-500 pts
Rhino
Dreadnought
Razorback

501-1000 pts
Rhino
Dreadnought
Razorback
Predator Destructor

1001-1500 pts
Rhino
Dreadnought
Razorback
Predator Destructor
Predator Annihilator
Land Raider
Drop Pod
Whirlwind

1501-2000
Rhino
Dreadnought
Razorback
Predator Destructor
Predator Annihilator
Land Raider
Drop Pod
Whirlwind
Land Raider Crusader
Vindicator

These are the points cost at which it is best to take these tanks without putting to many eggs in one basket.

Now a list of who is best to ride in each transport:

Rhino
Tactical
Veteran
Command
Assault With J packs
Devastator

Razorback
Combat
Veteran
Devastator
Command

Land Raider
Tactical
Command
Terminator
Devastator
Veteran

Land Raider Crusader
Command
Veteran
Terminator Assault
Terminator

Now, a list of uses for upgrades:

Dozer Blade Dead cheap, every vehicle should have one, unless you're fighting a desert battle.

Extra Armour Again, you should take this, especially if you have Rhino/ Razorback, or you will lose you greatest asset: speed.

Hunter-Killer Missile Useful for taking out enemy walkers in early battle, but rarely take down powerful prizes.

Pintle-Mounted Storm Bolter Useful, but again only rarely. 2 shots will almost never save you.

Power of the Machine Spirit Almost completely useless if you have extra armour, way over priced. It is only really (really, really) useful if you have a vindicator, which does not need BS anyway.

Searchlight Unlikely to be much use, but is so cheap it's a crime not to have it.

Smoke Launchers A must-buy for any tank.

Combos

Rhino + Vindicator
A vindicator can help a rhino rush, blowing enemy units out of the way. You have to bear in mind that it will have to either move or fire if it wishes to keep up with the rhinos.

Rhino + Predator
The predator can keep up with the rhinos, and give them good fire support for killing tanks (PA) or infantry (PD). The predator doing this job is liekly to get swamped and killed, but it is a path clearer, not a game winner.

Dreadnought + Whirlwind
If you keep a shooty Dreadnought at the back of your lines, it can defend the whirlwind, whilst not sacrifising much (its movement is nothing to boast about).

Land Raider (crusader) + Rhino
If you place a land raider near a rhino, nine times out of ten the nemy will shoot the raider, not the rhino, so your troops are more likely to arrive with relative impunity.

Thank you, i hope this is a help.
-Songblade
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Old 10 Nov 2007, 21:32   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Space Marine Vehicle Tactica

Not bad, I'm not entirely fond of the style, but nothing says tacticas havea to be rigidly serious, however some combined tactical applications wouldn't be a miss. As in some explenations as to tactics that focus on Space Marine armor primarily.
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Old 10 Nov 2007, 22:31   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Space Marine Vehicle Tactica

Uh, just wondering, how are you saying your vehicles can shoot more than one target? Other than that looks good to me.
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Old 11 Nov 2007, 11:33   #5 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Space Marine Vehicle Tactica

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vash113
Not bad, I'm not entirely fond of the style, but nothing says tacticas havea to be rigidly serious, however some combined tactical applications wouldn't be a miss. As in some explenations as to tactics that focus on Space Marine armor primarily.
You mean using vehicles in pairs?

Shall I rename the different tactics?
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Old 11 Nov 2007, 18:05   #6 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Space Marine Vehicle Tactica

Well when I read the section on the tank hunting dreadnought it looked like you said it could shoot at two different targets. Sorry if you meant having two of the actual dread's.
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Old 11 Nov 2007, 21:39   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Space Marine Vehicle Tactica

He was talking to Vash.

But yes, I agree, it seems like Songblade is under the misconception that vehicles can split fire. They cannot. The Power of the Machine Spirit, in addition, does not allow you to split fire as in previous editions.
Speaking of PotMS, it's actually an incredibly useful upgrade for a Vindicator. Basically, even if it's shaken, it can still fire its cannon (which EA does not do), and furthermore the abysmal BS of the spirit is negated by the fact that you don't use BS to fire ordnance. I wouldn't get it on anything else, though.
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 00:28   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Space Marine Vehicle Tactica

Quote:
Originally Posted by Commander Songblade
You mean using vehicles in pairs?

Shall I rename the different tactics?
What I mean is new tactics on how to use vehicles in conjunction with each other. Yea a Rhino Rush is not bad, but when it's unsupported it's likely to just be blown apart piecemeal. Where as instead an Armoured Spearhead can help, a Land Raider flanked by Predators with the softer Rhinos filling the interior of the spearhead advances down the middle of the board, when in range the Predators split sideways and a pair or more of rhinos power forward and unleash their cargo in a deadly volley of fire, while the Land Raider's front door clangs open and a cc monster squad rushes into the enemy. A classic Armoured Spearhead. Tactics like that, that explain how to actually use Space Marine vehicles in an army in conjunction with each other is what I was suggesting. Otherwise the uses of each vehicle individually are fairly straight forward. If you really want a tactica to be useful and succeed, covering as many aspects as possible to give readers as much information and advice as they need is the best course of action.
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 02:46   #9 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Space Marine Vehicle Tactica

Quote:
Originally Posted by Abael
He was talking to Vash.

But yes, I agree, it seems like Songblade is under the misconception that vehicles can split fire. They cannot. The Power of the Machine Spirit, in addition, does not allow you to split fire as in previous editions.
Speaking of PotMS, it's actually an incredibly useful upgrade for a Vindicator. Basically, even if it's shaken, it can still fire its cannon (which EA does not do), and furthermore the abysmal BS of the spirit is negated by the fact that you don't use BS to fire ordnance. I wouldn't get it on anything else, though.
I noticed that dread error, too. The only way you have a chance of blowing up 2 vehicles a turn is if they are a squad. I think even saying that you will kill a single vehicle (let aloe a tank) per turn is a bit of an overstatement. So is calling a Landraider "untouchable". Any balanced force will be able to deal with a lone land raider. There is just too many things, other than lance weapons, that will do one in. Railguns, melta weapons, etc. And that is just the shooty attacks.
I also don't think scouts can get a razorback, so listing them as an ideal occupant is not such a good idea. Also there is a typo on Assault marine w/ JP in the rhinos. Of course you have to drop the Jump packs to get the rhino. The "who is best" list also pretty much lists any squad that can use them. I think that list should be edited to include ideal units to transport and perhaps some unit setups that would go well in them. For example Cleanse & purify bolter/plas squads in a rhino.

I think it'd also be smart to clarify which codex(s) you are basing everything from. I am assuming the SM codex. But the BA & DA codexes are much different.

I'd also like to see more pros and cons. You have the "used car salesman" approach where you are talking up everything. About the only thing you mentioned as bad was PotMS, which is actually quite nice on vindicators.

Overall it is not a bad article for newbies. I am not trying to be negative, just offer constructive criticism.
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Old 15 Nov 2007, 17:47   #10 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Space Marine Vehicle Tactica

hehehe, car salesmen, and he's talking about the futuristic cars hehehe

sorry about that,

Abeal, that is actually a very good idea, so good infact, that i may try it ;D, you just have to hope that they only get the shaken result.
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