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Author Topic: Recent Changes to the Enclave Access  (Read 3417 times)

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TopBanana

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    Re: Recent Changes to the Enclave Access
    « Reply #120 on: January 20, 2010, 06:51:08 PM »
    I'm a bit late coming to this discussion, but I'll throw my two cents in.

    It seems that we all generally agree on what the abstract requirements should be to access the Enclave:
    1. "Good Behavior"
    2. General Commitment to the site

    The disagreement seems to arise about what objective standards correspond to these. 

    I think that requiring a warning level of 10% or lower adequately serves 1.  I think that the permanent nature of smites and the nature of positive karma argues against a requirement for overall positive karma.  Here's what I mean.  Smites are permanent, but positive karma is not meant to represent good behavior, it represents particularly good posts (and other contributions).  Unless mods become much more vigilant about recognizing each and every contribution, I think that an overall positive karma requirement is unfair to those who got smote in the past.  We've discussed negative karma decay before, but that's a different topic.

    The second general requirement that everyone seems to be arguing for is a sense that a member is not joining merely for the Enclave.  I also believe that this is adequately served by a straight post requirement.  I think that a post requirement of 250 posts (or whatever), shows that someone is serious about the rest of the site.  They may not have made any great contributions, but they presumably haven't been spamming (or their warning level will be elevated and they will be denied access due to that).  In short, I'm confident that someone wouldn't be able to spam their way to the requirement and avoid the notice of the mods.  Additionally, it ensures that they are in the main part of the site for a while, learning the rules and good posting habits.

    I also don't think that either general principle requires a minimum positive karma.  The main reason is that, to put it simply, there are posts out there that probably deserve applauds, but don't have them.  I know we have the flag-a-post function and the mods do do a good job, but it remains a subjective system.  Additionally, it has always been claimed that karma did not make someone better than someone else, so I think it is not in that spirit to make distinctions about Enclave Access based on it.

    If we wanted to do something like the new current system (post count or karma) I think that the idea of encouragement karma needs reexamined, or the limit should be more than +1.  I admit that my first applaud was encouragement karma, but I didn't know what to think about it at the time.  If people are getting into the Enclave on their point of encouragement, it is entirely possible that they will be exposed to it before they've internalized the generally high quality of posting that the site has elsewhere.

    Anyway, those are my thoughts,
    TB
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    MrMobiusMe

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    Re: Recent Changes to the Enclave Access
    « Reply #121 on: January 24, 2010, 09:09:32 PM »
    I agree with you there. I don't mind working up to 250 posts or whatever, but me getting karma isn't something I see happening anytime soon.
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    HijiriOni

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    Re: Recent Changes to the Enclave Access
    « Reply #122 on: January 26, 2010, 11:38:23 PM »
    Given that we tend to desire post quality over quantity I don't even think having the 250 posts or the karma is a good idea.

    I think It took me over a year to break the 250 mark (then again I quit posting for 8 months).
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    Khanaris

    Re: Recent Changes to the Enclave Access
    « Reply #123 on: January 27, 2010, 02:54:49 AM »
    I agree with you there. I don't mind working up to 250 posts or whatever, but me getting karma isn't something I see happening anytime soon.

    To be honest, we tend to keep an eye on general post count for Karma.  If we notice a member with a lot of posts and no karma, we are likely to go back through their last few dozen posts.  If they are contributing at all (and you have been so far), they may get a cookie for that rather than for any specific post.  This recognizes people who add a little all the time, but aren't interested in posting big threads.
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    fiercegoldfish

    Re: Recent Changes to the Enclave Access
    « Reply #124 on: January 28, 2010, 05:43:51 AM »
    I'm going to have to agree with banana on this. I assume the point of the karma thing is to make sure there is no spam etc, but i don't see what the problem with just banning the troublemakers is (or something like that that would disallow you to enter if you've been bad). Add a post count to that and it would be quite difficult to just make a new account if you've been banned to get in. I would hate to have to write a whole six page tactic report just to get to the enclave.

    On a side note could anyone tell me what the requirements are for the trade board? My brother cant get on it and I haven't for the life of me been able to find a thread on it.
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    Tyross (FT)

    Re: Recent Changes to the Enclave Access
    « Reply #125 on: January 28, 2010, 03:21:23 PM »
    On a side note could anyone tell me what the requirements are for the trade board? My brother cant get on it and I haven't for the life of me been able to find a thread on it.
    The Trading board has a 75 post count minimum.
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    doctor_wu

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    Re: Recent Changes to the Enclave Access
    « Reply #126 on: January 30, 2010, 07:33:02 PM »
    Will the karma requirement get noted in the forum rules because the last time I checked a few days ago it only said 250 posts.
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    Tyross (FT)

    Re: Recent Changes to the Enclave Access
    « Reply #127 on: January 30, 2010, 08:48:34 PM »
    I've updated the forum rules now :)
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    Sidstyler

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    Re: Recent Changes to the Enclave Access
    « Reply #128 on: January 31, 2010, 04:24:32 AM »
    So it's 250 posts or a point of karma, instead of requiring both.

    No complaints here then.
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    Tyross (FT)

    Re: Recent Changes to the Enclave Access
    « Reply #129 on: January 31, 2010, 04:42:51 AM »
    So it's 250 posts or a point of karma, instead of requiring both.

    No complaints here then.
    Pays to read the entire thread (although having it stretch over ~7 pages for you guys, I can see why not :))
    http://forums.tauonline.org/index.php/topic,92088.msg1328966.html#msg1328966
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    Sidstyler

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    Re: Recent Changes to the Enclave Access
    « Reply #130 on: January 31, 2010, 05:50:50 AM »
    I have no idea why you assume I didn't read it. I did, I had just checked the forum rules to see if you did, in fact, go ahead with that change and commented to show that I was glad to see that.

    Was it wrong of me to assume that things might change?
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    enderwiggin

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    Re: Recent Changes to the Enclave Access
    « Reply #131 on: February 01, 2010, 06:47:51 PM »
    I have no idea why you assume I didn't read it. I did, I had just checked the forum rules to see if you did, in fact, go ahead with that change and commented to show that I was glad to see that.

    Was it wrong of me to assume that things might change?

    Heresy!

    Things never change, change is Tau-like and this site is a loyal member of the Imperium! Those commie Tau will never... Wait a second!  ::)  :D


    I'm happy enough with the opinion that the rule isn't terribly unbalanced in any way.

    I never knew the Enclave was that crazy/out of hand though.  ???
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    Zenai

    Re: Recent Changes to the Enclave Access
    « Reply #132 on: February 01, 2010, 06:53:19 PM »
    I never knew the Enclave was that crazy/out of hand though.  ???
    Not so much since I never ever have to see those Enclave Games keep popping up in my Show new replies to your posts. And anyway, Enclave is naturally ain't something you want someone too new and/or too unfamiliar with the forum etiquette to explore especially when they discover the Enclave Games.

    enderwiggin

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    Re: Recent Changes to the Enclave Access
    « Reply #133 on: February 01, 2010, 07:00:12 PM »
    I never knew the Enclave was that crazy/out of hand though.  ???
    Not so much since I never ever have to see those Enclave Games keep popping up in my Show new replies to your posts. And anyway, Enclave is naturally ain't something you want someone too new and/or too unfamiliar with the forum etiquette to explore especially when they discover the Enclave Games.

    I did forget the Enclave Games section. With the recent measures, my mind has had time to heal/blank out those painful times to some degree.  :P

    Your other point is good as well Zenai, it'd be different if we had SD and D outside the Enclave or as an stepping stone (say at 150 or something), just to get people more used to the idea of well thought out posts and posting quality standards. I don't know how difficult that may be for the programmers though, I tend to think FT and crew can do pretty much anything with the site.  :P
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    The Strange Child

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    Re: Recent Changes to the Enclave Access
    « Reply #134 on: February 01, 2010, 07:15:20 PM »
    I tend to think FT can y'xa'uk the site up in many interesting ways
    Fixed. ;)
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