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[Sneezy Panda]

so my friend and i have been having a friendly competition over the summer and right now it stands at 4 wins 5 draws and 5 loses for me. i had a strong lead of 4 wins to 2 loses but the shock of my bezerkers has been lessened. i need to pull of a final win so that its a least an overall tie. here is my current set up:

HQ:
kharn- 165

chaos lord-130
mark of khorne
lightning claws


TROOPS:

8x bezerkers- 208
champion
power fist

8x bezerkers- 208
champion
power fist

rhino- 40
combi-weapon

8x bezerkers- 208
champion
power fist

rhino- 40
combi-weapon

HEAVY SUPPORT:

landraider- 220

2x obliterators-150

2x obliterators- 150

TOTAL: 1499

my opponent(warboss vandersnag) likes to use 60 boyz, a SAG, a KFF mek, mega armored nobs, regular nobs, 2 killa kans, 3 kannons, and 3 deff koptas.

the KFF mek travels with the mega armored nobs. the regular nobs travels in a trukk. the killa kans are kitted for assault.

i'm thinking about bumping my bezerker squads back up to ten because the puny 8 many squads just are not cutting it against the wave of orks.

i want to stay mostly true to a khorne list as possible so not telling me to get rid of all my bezerkers for plague marines or something. NO LASH PRINCE EITHER!

other than that i'm open to all options.


previously i have used two deamon princes as a tag team and they worked quite well for a while. but i will only use twin deamon princes. the speed that they give the army is great, i wish i could use kharn and the deamon princes because kharn is also such a great option.

i would almost want to have a 4th bezerker squad but taking the 4th squad seems like a bit too much. the landraider is my safety net. the usefulness of it is just too great. being able to launch my bezerkers right out of it is great. kharn usually travels inside of it too and i just now have utilized his ability to de-tach from the squad and charge a seperate unit.

i usually deep strike with my obliterators, but i know how everyone loves to have them walk. but i think the affect of having them deep strike and burning down a whole mob of orks. maybe if i deep strike one and walk the other squad?

[Warboss Vandersnag]

Well, they are two deff dreads actually. Not Kans.

Now, what i suggest, is lesser demons! Not only will a small squad of 7 be perfect for objective capturing, but will be great for stalling meganobz and supporting obliterator drops!

Or perhaps, you should put down some termies of your own. get rid of kharns berserkers in the landraider, and fill it with a smallerr squad of khorne berserkers. the 2+ could end up being the ticket you need to survive the ork hordes.

[Sneezy Panda]

i'm assuming you mean take out the bezerkers and put in terminators. yes that is a possibility that i haven't toyed with yet. well i would love to hear a suggestion of a terminator setup. seeing as i have used them about once. i have heard good things about terminators though and will consider it.

[Warboss Vandersnag]

Well being your direct adversary, I'm a little standoffish as to give you a specific unit setup! :lol:

[Psyko]

Your opponents army seems like a pretty strait forward orky one, rellying on numbers and sheer variety to break down an opponent.

As you mentioned I agree with bumping your squad numbers to 10 giving you more bodies against continual waves of orks, I have no idea why you have equipted powerfists to your aspring champion's as base they have I4 and on the charge 4 S5 I5 power weapon attacks.

The use of Rhinos is always highly welcomed for any Khorne army as it allows you to control most of the fighting, try and overpower a flank use your superior troops to your advantage.

Obliterators are very reliable and usefull units to have around, but are more focused on tournament play as there large array of weaponry can match a variety of army lists and keep them usefull no matter who you verse. As such you know who you are versing and a general idea of what your up against, you can either keep your Oblits or lose them to pack on Havocs equip with weaponry suitable to take down needy targets or maybe even dreadnaughts to hold up his boy packs, although not a smart idea if they have a powerclaw.

I also see no need for a second lord, most if not all your berserker squads should be able to chop though the most resilient of targets with a WS5 and a flurry of attacks the unit itself will do the job, no need for overkill, remove the lord in exchange for something you deem needed.

All in all your list should put up a fight but slight changes should give you a better fighting fist, no its up to you.

goodluck.

[Sneezy Panda]

well i straight up ripped him apart last night. i blame the good cover saves  here's what i used;

HQ:
kharn- 165

greater deamon-100


TROOPS:

8x bezerkers- 208
champion
power fist

8x bezerkers- 208
champion
power fist

rhino- 35

9x bezerkers- 229
champion
power fist

rhino- 35

HEAVY SUPPORT:

landraider- 220

2x obliterators-150

Defiler- 150

TOTAL: 1500

[JD]

He musn't have been any good. That list would get hammered by most decent ork builds.


Wanna beat orks at their own game?

You need daemons. To tie up a unit for a tuirn so you can get the charges you need.


Drop the defiler, he will die too easily.

Drop the Oblits for they are not needed.


If you really want to beat up orks, Combi flamer on the rhinos.

[Warboss Vandersnag]

I don't see how your justifying the drop of the defiler. Pie plates served my ork army good and hard all last night unfortunatly. And the obliterators? two twin link flamers? That unit swathes down half a squad before they can blink. and then, they take any ork counter charge on the chin and dispatch powerfist judgment.

How do you feel 5+ invulns would stack better then these two units? what squad size of lessers do you propose? I feel mathhammer wise they'll die much swifter with their 5+.

If there is one point i can agree upon however, it's combi flamers on rhinos.

[Sneezy Panda]

If there is one point i can agree upon however, it's combi flamers on rhinos.

yeah, if i can squeeze the points out i would totally do that.

but i would also like a detailed explanation on why my choices are not good ones. i know i've always said vindicators are better but the multi-function of the defiler is just too sweet. the long range firepower is just what i need to counter his more mobile units.

[JD]

The point is not for them to do damage. The point is for them to be a speed bump.

Charging a summoned unit of 12 odd daemons into a squad of orks will hold them up for a turn.

A turn which you allows you to get a multicharge ready for your berserkers.
 

[Warboss Vandersnag]

Hmm I can see that point. However, couldn't we say that a 150 pt defiler CC and all is just as nice? 12 demons is 168 points... But really, I spose this comes down to play style and army preference.