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Miral Army (list and conversion ideas)
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Old 28 Oct 2009, 13:14   #1 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Miral Army (list and conversion ideas)

Here's what I'm thinking for a Miral (swampy-death-world) army:


TROOPS

1st Platoon
~ Command squad with Officer's Bolt Pistol and Veteran's; Vox-caster, Mortar and Plasmagun
~ Chimera
~ Infantry squad 1 with Sergeant's Power Weapon, Plasma Pistol and Guardsmen's: Plasmagun and Vox-caster
~ Commissar with Power Weapon and Plasma Pistol
~ Chimera
~ Infantry squad 2 with Sergeant's Bolt Pistol and Guardsmen's: Plasmagun, Vox-caster and Missile Launcher
~ Chimera
~ 20 Conscripts
Platoon @ 479pts with 45 Infantry Models and 3 APC's

Veteran Squad
~ Carapace Armour
~ Sergeant with Power weapon, Plasma pistol
~ Three Plasmaguns
Squad @ 165pts
Totalling 644pts

FAST ATTACK

Vendetta Gunship @ 130pts
Totalling 774pts

Hellhound & Banewolf @ 260pts
Totalling 1034pts

Rough Rider Squad (on Lizardmen COLD ONES!!)
~ Eight models
~ Two Flamers
Squad @ 95pts
Totalling 1159pts

HEAVY SUPPORT

2 Leman Russ with Hull Lascannon @ 330pts
Totalling 1459pts

2 Hydra Flak Tanks @ 150pts
Totalling 1609pts

2 Leman Russ with Hull Lascannon @ 330pts
Totalling 1939pts

HQ

A somewhat skimpy Company Command Squad
~ Commander's Boltgun
~ Veteran's Vox caster
Squad @ 57pts
Totalling 1996pts


Ideas:
Catachan models, looking dirty. Browns colours. Chimeras on "swamp bases" (like miniature dioramas), plenty of mud and rust. Some jungle beasts, such as rough riders mounted on Lizardmen Cold Ones.

Army weaknesses:
It looks like I've just mish-mashed together some cool-looking units... I haven't. I wanted a strong platoon and veteran squad to be relatively mobile (conscripts acting like a small shield), my Vendetta and 1 Leman Russ pair will directly fight with them. The other units will act as flank-protectors and head-hunters...

Hm. Let me know what you think...
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Old 28 Oct 2009, 18:40   #2 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Miral Army (list and conversion ideas)

Personally, from a fluff standpoint (as always with me), the Leman Russes seem out of place. I've never liked which Catachans (or any death world light infantry) have heavy armor with them, seems like they'd just get bogged down in the swamp. I think you're army would be more thematic if you instead had sentinels, or more valkyries.

With that exception i like the list allot. I don't think it'll need much conversion outside of your rough riders. As long as you spend time on your bases i think it'll look good.
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Old 28 Oct 2009, 19:01   #3 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Miral Army (list and conversion ideas)

Man, that is awesome! Good luck with making this army. The rough riders are going to be reeaally sweet.

I think tanks can fit in. We had tanks during Vietnam right? Maybe throw on some track guards and a dozer blade with a bunch of mud and plants on it.

Is there any way you could fit a reference to Miral land sharks in here? I think those creatures are how everyone really knows about Miral in the first place. Maybe that's what you could call your Russ or something.
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Old 31 Oct 2009, 05:28   #4 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Miral Army (list and conversion ideas)

Hey Frisbee. I am going to make some fluff/real life comparisons to your list, if you do not mind, and then I'll relate that to how I can hep refine your list.

Firstly, swamps and APCs/Tanks.
A lot of Armored Personnel Carriers are amphibious today (And yes, I know the Chimera is too) but that means that they are good in open water. With such wet, muddy locations like swamps, the weight of the vehicle ranging anywhere from 40-65 tons will cause the wheels (In the case of LAV-3, Strykers, Infantrie sturmwagons etc.) and the tracks to get stuck or thrown. What this basically means, is wet land is an infantry land.

For fielding Chimeras in your list, go for it! However, if you are planning on conversion, I can give you several ideas for easy conversion if you want. Firstly, is a fording plate. This is like a reverse cow-catcher on a locomotive. Basically, the vehicle deploys this, and it pierces the water infront of the vehicle, making it easier going. Secondly, water jets/proppelers. Yes, I know the chimera is amphibious, but water jets are very useful in sticky situations, as they can give you some extra torque to get out of problems. And thirdly, just as a nice features, a tow cable on each one, so that background wise, if one gets stuck another can pull it out.

Valkyrie: Eh... I disagree with everyone else. I don't like valkyries in a swamp scenario. Sure, it can go into VTOL and hover several feet above the water (Assuming it can get through the foliage.) but that leaves the troops inside having a several foot drop, into at least a foot of water. Not fun, from personal experiance. Also, hovering a helicopter several feet above the ground is damned hard, and it is a lot easier simply to put it down, which tou cant do in a swamp.

Conversion ideas: Extended skids. Buoyant skids, so that the valk can set down like a sea plane, and bob on the water while infantry dismount. Either that, or rappelling cables for the troops.

Leman Russ: yeah, one of the only non-combat non-friendly fire tank loses the US took in desert storm was a mobility kill, when an M1A1 got stuck in the mud, and the crew had to abandon it for two days. Swamp land really isn't tank country, and I don't know what I can say as per conversions.

Veterans: Great! Be sure to convert them with some sort of re breather, just so they look cool :P

Hydra and hellhound(variants): Same as a chimera, but without amphibious special rule. Maybe give them buoyancy tanks on the side. The problem i see with the hydra is if it is buoyant and not getting stuck, the recoil from those guns will push it back.... Again, I'd recommend water jets or propellers, maybe they can be synchronized so they activate when the guns fire, so that the vehicles are not pushed back as much?

Carapace in general: Good for your list, bad for your background. I know first hand that weight is your enemy, and when I go out, I might bitch about the extra 20-30 pounds of body armor I have to wear, but imagine being encased in it, in around a foot of water! Ick. If you can convert it so that it's a water friendly, but bullet proof armor system, more power to you!

And by the way:
Water plow: The square piece of metal jutting out from the M113


This is a great website for finding inspiration on your amphibious vehicles!
http://images.google.ca/imgres?imgur...a%3DG%26um%3D1
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Old 31 Oct 2009, 06:13   #5 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Miral Army (list and conversion ideas)

But real life doesn't translate into tabletop warhammer. If these things are unrealistic based on your experience, then so is just about everything about the game. An M16 can shoot accurately quite a lot further in scale than a bolter or a pulse, but those are the ranges that the game uses. I met a bishop once, but he didn't move particularly quickly in a diagonal motion either.

I like the idea of swampy looking turf around the chims, and if you need a leman in it too, use Cat's idea about the reversed dozer blade and base it like its moving through much swampy goo, so as to stay to theme. Game effectiveness is not very easily translated from real life modern military effectiveness.

If you want abstract play chess, if you want realism play one of those old strategic level hex games. If you want fun and modelling and ludicrously unbelievable toys play 40k.
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Old 31 Oct 2009, 13:30   #6 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Miral Army (list and conversion ideas)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guitardian
But real life doesn't translate into tabletop warhammer. If these things are unrealistic based on your experience, then so is just about everything about the game. An M16 can shoot accurately quite a lot further in scale than a bolter or a pulse, but those are the ranges that the game uses. I met a bishop once, but he didn't move particularly quickly in a diagonal motion either.

I like the idea of swampy looking turf around the chims, and if you need a leman in it too, use Cat's idea about the reversed dozer blade and base it like its moving through much swampy goo, so as to stay to theme. Game effectiveness is not very easily translated from real life modern military effectiveness.

If you want abstract play chess, if you want realism play one of those old strategic level hex games. If you want fun and modelling and ludicrously unbelievable toys play 40k.
Guitardian, my posts relate to the background and fluff of the army more than game effectiveness. I could easily tell Frisbee what units that he absolutely, 100% cannot use because it's a swamp. But that isn't any fun, so I'm simply trying to help him make a more flavorful, themed army.

I do know the difference between 40k and modern life, and it is huge. That, however, does not stop me from building themed units based on my own, individual experience.

Forgot to mention...
Rough Riders: They would be GREAT in this kind of terrain. Maybe try and make the cold ones look more crocodile like? It's the perfect habitat for them!
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Old 31 Oct 2009, 13:38   #7 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Miral Army (list and conversion ideas)

I like the rough riders too. They make any guard army seem more rustic and kind of grungey. I wish GW did some models other than the attila-the-hun looking cartoon characters. dirt bikes would be cool. goblin wolf riders wolf models or ork boar models wouldnt be too out of place for swamp mounts, and probably cheaper than cold ones. does GW even make Cyboar models any more?
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Old 31 Oct 2009, 13:50   #8 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Miral Army (list and conversion ideas)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guitardian
I like the rough riders too. They make any guard army seem more rustic and kind of grungey. I wish GW did some models other than the attila-the-hun looking cartoon characters. dirt bikes would be cool. goblin wolf riders wolf models or ork boar models wouldnt be too out of place for swamp mounts, and probably cheaper than cold ones. does GW even make Cyboar models any more?
The goblin cavalry are small, and wolves don't fit in great (theme wise) with swamps, sadly enough. I don't know about cyboars...

The best theme wise non-animal rough rider for this army? Jet skies or hovercraft. Would take some conversions, but man it would be sexy!
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Old 31 Oct 2009, 14:12   #9 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Miral Army (list and conversion ideas)

JET SKIS?! never thought of that one. what are those things look like speed boats with the big helicopter rotor on the back they use in the everglades... i dont know what that would proxy as, but they are very swampy stereotype vehicles. there was a 'gijoe' toy of one of them long ago that was all remote controled i think it was called the 'bushmaster' or something.

Really I think looking in non-GW regular 'hobby shop' type stores where they sell model railroad bits and WWII kits and stuff could give you a load of stuff to work with (and way cheaper). Best Leman I ever saw was an Airfix 'panzerjager' tank hull with some GW guns attached. He used it with the Death Corps of Krieg, who look pretty hitlery helmety Weirmarkt-ish as it is.

still i think just modelling bases in the theme would pull off whatever army you want. make an amphibious leman and a bunch of infantry covered in mud, it would still have a themed army charm regardless of what is actually in the army.
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Old 31 Oct 2009, 14:19   #10 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Miral Army (list and conversion ideas)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guitardian
JET SKIS?! never thought of that one. what are those things look like speed boats with the big helicopter rotor on the back they use in the everglades... i dont know what that would proxy as, but they are very swampy stereotype vehicles. there was a 'gijoe' toy of one of them long ago that was all remote controled i think it was called the 'bushmaster' or something.

Really I think looking in non-GW regular 'hobby shop' type stores where they sell model railroad bits and WWII kits and stuff could give you a load of stuff to work with (and way cheaper). Best Leman I ever saw was an Airfix 'panzerjager' tank hull with some GW guns attached. He used it with the Death Corps of Krieg, who look pretty hitlery helmety Weirmarkt-ish as it is.

still i think just modelling bases in the theme would pull off whatever army you want. make an amphibious leman and a bunch of infantry covered in mud, it would still have a themed army charm regardless of what is actually in the army.
Hovercraft:


Air cushion on the bottom to float on water, propellers to push it forward. Smaller versions have only one prop, but they are fast.

Jet skies:
http://virtualstreams.com/images/jet...bt%20etzel.jpg

Military versions generally black, and can be armed (Some have a second person manning a LMG or similar on the back.)
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